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Very unusual problem, never experienced before 

 

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 Post subject: Very unusual problem, never experienced before
Posted: Thu Mar 19, 2015 5:11 pm 
Getting Side Ways
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Age: 58

Posts: 1029

Joined: 13th Sep 2010

Ride: Ford Falcon AU 2000 Series II

Location: Eagleby
QLD, Australia

G'day people,

My Ford AUII is doing strange things this arvo. Went for a drive down to Gold Coast on M1, vehicle started to get low on power as in jerking then come good, Anything electrical seemed to be draining vehicle. Even the blower fan on speed setting of 4 felt like it was on selection 1.

Apply brakes , just touch the brake pedal, speedo, fuel and temp gauges go back to starting positions, accelerate they come back alive again, being doing that on and off this arvo.

Arrived at Butcher Boy to collect container of fish frames (Crab bait), damn starter motor would not engage, all I get is an odd click click click noise in quick succession on ignition.

Managed to get a jump start, all worked well, started off like there was no power then gradually got up to speed, touch brake pad, yep all gauges go off again then come back alive including seatbelt sign and airbag sign...WTF is going on.

The battery is Calcium probably 4 year old, had a good run for sure, now battery charge indicator went from Green to Black.

It was Green when I left Gold Coast, it was black when I got home.

Indicator / Flasher lights would not work either.

I'm puzzled as to what the problem is.

Could it be the battery has just died, is it the alternator not charging or is there something else happening?

Any suggestions is welcome.

Cheers, Peter
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 Post subject: Re: Very unusual problem, never experienced before
Posted: Thu Mar 19, 2015 9:53 pm 
Getting Side Ways
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Age: 58

Posts: 1029

Joined: 13th Sep 2010

Ride: Ford Falcon AU 2000 Series II

Location: Eagleby
QLD, Australia

Anyone else had this problem happen, what was the cause and what was the remedy.

Unfortunately Ford Workshop manual seems not to cover my scenario.
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 Post subject: Re: Very unusual problem, never experienced before
Posted: Thu Mar 19, 2015 10:56 pm 
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Joined: 27th Sep 2006

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Ride: ED Falcon

Power: 133 rwkw

Location: Leeton
NSW, Australia

Seems weird the brake pedal causes a change... I'd be checking your earths... Battery, chassis, dash loom, body loom... Make sure they're all good and clean...

Next when left standing (ie first thing in the morning) what is the voltage across the battery? Once you start it, what is the voltage the alternator is churning out?

My alternator was only putting out mid 12's there once and it seemed really odd... Battery failed on me so I replaced it and still couldn't get into the 13's on my charge... Did the Au conversion into my ED with a new alternator and it was fine... The ED one must have been polling out or failing in the reg and couldn't live up to it any longer... Been good ever since...

Cheers,
Tim

 

_________________

93 Red ED 5spd Manual Build Thread

Performance: Complete AUII VCT Wiring & Power Train, Pacey Headers, 2.5" Exhaust, Exedy Clutch, DBA Rotors
Visuals: FG XR Wheel, XR Front, 17's, BA 5 Spd Shifter, BA Ghia Window Switches, NL Cluster
Tunes: 8" Pioneer Sub, JBL Speakers, Clarion Double DIN Headunit

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 Post subject: Re: Very unusual problem, never experienced before
Posted: Fri Mar 20, 2015 12:05 am 
Getting Side Ways
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Age: 58

Posts: 1029

Joined: 13th Sep 2010

Ride: Ford Falcon AU 2000 Series II

Location: Eagleby
QLD, Australia

TimmyA,

Everything worked ok this morning, had no problems, all went pear shaped this arvo.

Yep, its a weird one alright. Thanks, I'll be doing those checks tomorrow morning.

I've got the battery on a charger at the moment, its been on charge since 4.00pm this evening, still flashing on "Charging" light at 2amps rate per hour.

I have not checked the battery voltage.

I've got a Digitech QM-1500 Multimeter. I can check the voltage across the battery tomorrow if it charges.

Cheers, Peter
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 Post subject: Re: Very unusual problem, never experienced before
Posted: Fri Mar 20, 2015 12:13 am 
Technical Contributor
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Posts: 3705

Joined: 27th Sep 2006

Gallery: 20 images

Ride: ED Falcon

Power: 133 rwkw

Location: Leeton
NSW, Australia

Idle in the morning you'd be expecting 11.5 to 12v before starting... And once running you'd expect 13.5 to 14... Straight off the charger I'd hazard a guess at 12-12.5v?

Its hard to tell which is the problem too... You can have a battery that won't accept the charge... Or an alternator that won't put the charge out... It can be hard to tell... I replaced my battery first to find out that made no difference...

But you sound like you have a bad earth connection somewhere too to be getting those weird problems...

Cheers,
Tim

 

_________________

93 Red ED 5spd Manual Build Thread

Performance: Complete AUII VCT Wiring & Power Train, Pacey Headers, 2.5" Exhaust, Exedy Clutch, DBA Rotors
Visuals: FG XR Wheel, XR Front, 17's, BA 5 Spd Shifter, BA Ghia Window Switches, NL Cluster
Tunes: 8" Pioneer Sub, JBL Speakers, Clarion Double DIN Headunit

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 Post subject: Re: Very unusual problem, never experienced before
Posted: Fri Mar 20, 2015 12:47 am 
Getting Side Ways
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Age: 58

Posts: 1029

Joined: 13th Sep 2010

Ride: Ford Falcon AU 2000 Series II

Location: Eagleby
QLD, Australia

TimmyA,

Oh ok, I'll do that and see what the voltages read..

I know I have problems with the water pump leaking coolant on top of the alternator in the past and still has done so (I've been slack, still have not replaced that old water pump)

Someone who gave me a jump start this arvo said the engine bay felt a bit oily. Looks like a degrease job coming up too.

I'd love it if it was just that i.e. a bad earth connection.

I'll be having a good crawl under the engine bay , might be a broken wire somewhere.

Cheers, Peter
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 Post subject: Re: Very unusual problem, never experienced before
Posted: Fri Mar 20, 2015 7:44 am 
Getting Side Ways
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Age: 58

Posts: 1029

Joined: 13th Sep 2010

Ride: Ford Falcon AU 2000 Series II

Location: Eagleby
QLD, Australia

Update,

Battery is at half charge according to charger at 3.30am (Friday morning). at 6.40am charger is now flashing on (Fully charged icon), but not fully charged as yet. Battery been on charger since 4.00pm yesterday , I don't know if that's normal on trickle charge @ 2 Amps

Battery finally reached full charge status at 8.15am this morning.

Here are the pics of battery and charger

Battery reading is 12.98V from fully charged.

Start Engine increase revs, battery voltage read 14.2v to 14.4v . This was done after replacing alternator with another from wrecked vehicle.

Forgot to remove drive belt, never checked drive belt to see if it was properly on grooves. Start engine, heard odd noise, result...damaged drive belt. Maybe the other alternator was not sitting square , hmmm, not sure, it went back to same position as previous alternator so it should have been ok.

New drive belt today and will run again.

 

 

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 Post subject: Re: Very unusual problem, never experienced before
Posted: Sun Mar 22, 2015 11:12 am 
Getting Side Ways
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Age: 58

Posts: 1029

Joined: 13th Sep 2010

Ride: Ford Falcon AU 2000 Series II

Location: Eagleby
QLD, Australia

Update,

Went for test drive, drove 44 klm round trip, all seems to be working ok, battery is receiving charge from alternator, indicator works, no instrument power failures especially when applying brakes, accelerates as per normal.

So far so good.

I've removed the previous alternator from the car, I suspect it to be faulty. Does anyone know how to test the alternator when it's off the vehicle?

Bearing feels like its worn, feels bit gritty and makes a noise.

Cheers
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 Post subject: Re: Very unusual problem, never experienced before
Posted: Sun Mar 29, 2015 11:13 am 
Getting Side Ways
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Ride: 08 BF Ghia

Location: Melbourne
VIC, Australia

The problems when applying the brakes is due to battery low voltage and all the brake lights at rear trying to illuminate when battery isn't receiving enough power from alternator. Glad you got it sorted.
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 Post subject: Re: Very unusual problem, never experienced before
Posted: Sun Mar 29, 2015 2:06 pm 
Getting Side Ways
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Age: 58

Posts: 1029

Joined: 13th Sep 2010

Ride: Ford Falcon AU 2000 Series II

Location: Eagleby
QLD, Australia

Yep,

Got it sorted to some degree, just got to find the offending oil leak.

Auto Electrician on the phone reckons this problem is common when power steering fluid enters the alternator.

I still cant see where the oil is coming from , yet there are some minute oil seepage.

I hope its not from the front seal of the crankshaft.
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 Post subject: Re: Very unusual problem, never experienced before
Posted: Sun Mar 29, 2015 6:13 pm 
Getting Side Ways
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Joined: 5th Nov 2004

Gallery: 7 images

Location: Brisbane
QLD, Australia

The problem is common - P/S leaks from nut at back of alternator, and drops straight into Alternator. Causes Fires if the Alternator gets hot enough ;).

The nut is replacable from Memory- or is that E Series only. Little bit of work and care required - thats all. The O-Ring in the swiveling portion of the Nut starts to leak. Fix is cutting the nut off (look for some pics - not hard to do, although does require care not to score line), then simply pushing new nut on.

Nigel
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 Post subject: Re: Very unusual problem, never experienced before
Posted: Sun Mar 29, 2015 9:37 pm 
Getting Side Ways
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Age: 58

Posts: 1029

Joined: 13th Sep 2010

Ride: Ford Falcon AU 2000 Series II

Location: Eagleby
QLD, Australia

Nigel,

Thanks for that info, I've put permatex siliastic around that nut on the back of the Power Steering Pump few days ago, Still seems to be leaking / escaping from somewhere.

I tried looking for pics on this forum but cant seem to find any.

Cheers
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 Post subject: Re: Very unusual problem, never experienced before
Posted: Sun Mar 29, 2015 10:13 pm 
Technical Contributor
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Age: 28

Posts: 3705

Joined: 27th Sep 2006

Gallery: 20 images

Ride: ED Falcon

Power: 133 rwkw

Location: Leeton
NSW, Australia

Common leaks are the nut or front reservoir seal...

Silastic won't keep that pressure in... You'll need to clean it all off, cut the nut off with an angle grinder or hand saw and clip the one on...

You can also get an aftermarket hose which deletes the stupid swivel nut... I did this on my turbo...

Cheers,
Tim

 

_________________

93 Red ED 5spd Manual Build Thread

Performance: Complete AUII VCT Wiring & Power Train, Pacey Headers, 2.5" Exhaust, Exedy Clutch, DBA Rotors
Visuals: FG XR Wheel, XR Front, 17's, BA 5 Spd Shifter, BA Ghia Window Switches, NL Cluster
Tunes: 8" Pioneer Sub, JBL Speakers, Clarion Double DIN Headunit

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 Post subject: Re: Very unusual problem, never experienced before
Posted: Sun Mar 29, 2015 10:40 pm 
Getting Side Ways
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Age: 58

Posts: 1029

Joined: 13th Sep 2010

Ride: Ford Falcon AU 2000 Series II

Location: Eagleby
QLD, Australia

TimmyA,

Oh ok,

I never given that a thought, front reservoir seal being leaky.

Which nut needs to be cut off? Is that the brass looking one where the high pressure hose goes into?

Is that nut referred to as the swivel nut?

Who stocks / where can I purchase the aftermarket hose?

Cheers, Peter
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 Post subject: Re: Very unusual problem, never experienced before
Posted: Mon Mar 30, 2015 12:02 am 
Technical Contributor
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Age: 28

Posts: 3705

Joined: 27th Sep 2006

Gallery: 20 images

Ride: ED Falcon

Power: 133 rwkw

Location: Leeton
NSW, Australia

Yeah there is 2 nuts on the back of the pump on high pressure hose... The first nut (closest to the hard pipe) is the nut to unscrew the hose... The next bigger nut unscrews the valve out of the back of the pump... Never changed a reservoir seal myself, my old man did mine so not sure how it comes apart...

Yes that is the swivel nut... Basically when the nut is tight the pipe will still swivel in the back of the pump... This feature serves no purpose at all IMHO... Might have made construction in the production line quicker...

Inside the nut which is part of the hard line is an O ring (which is the bit that fails) and a circlip to retain it on the pipe... You buy the new nut from Ford and then measure down the inside of the new nut to where the circlip is... You then measure the existing nut and cut right through it only to the circlip, if you go to far you'll destroy the high pressure hose... Once you get through all the way around the end will fall off, and then you slide the rest back on the pipe, remove the circlip, slide the rest off the pipe... Clean and polish with emery and WD40 and the slide the new nut on until it clips into place... Easy job, just can't stress how important it is to take your time cutting in, little bit by little bit...

https://www.ultimatepowersteering.com.a ... falcon-au/

This one, uses the same pump end as what my ED has... Normal nut... Slides on, end is flared... O ring fits on the flare and screws in tight... If it leaks you undo, swap the O ring, and tighten up...

Had issues with the BF one... It needing "massaging" to fit around the turbo... Spent hours getting it right... A month later one of the crimps in the hose leaked... Got a replacement... It had swarf in the sensor hole... Looked like a full ball or wire wool... Sent back for a third... Same deal with the massaging around the turbo... It has been fine touch wood...

Cheers,
Tim

 

_________________

93 Red ED 5spd Manual Build Thread

Performance: Complete AUII VCT Wiring & Power Train, Pacey Headers, 2.5" Exhaust, Exedy Clutch, DBA Rotors
Visuals: FG XR Wheel, XR Front, 17's, BA 5 Spd Shifter, BA Ghia Window Switches, NL Cluster
Tunes: 8" Pioneer Sub, JBL Speakers, Clarion Double DIN Headunit

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