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250 Xflow 4.1 EFI running problem 

 

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 Post subject: 250 Xflow 4.1 EFI running problem
Posted: Sun Mar 19, 2006 9:10 pm 
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Hey guys
i got my 250 Xflow 4.1 EFI falcon running today after top end rebuild but the timming was out by mile and half which is the beginning of the problems when you turn the dizzy to get timming better it gets a lot better and then it hits the block if it could still turn further it will have a perfict idel but can't so my dads mate carefully pulled the dizzy out and turned the cog over one so it would get timming better but this is where everything went wrong when he moved it over it wouldn't push the full way down in the cam cog so we put it back and the car refuses to start with the cog in place so me move back to the right place and we had to tap it with hammer very very softly to get it slip and inter lock with the cam and it went in nicerly and still got nothing.

The battery gives 12.35volts if i remember right so it might be the battery not got enought volts they should be about 13.something volts

I put the battery on slow charge for the night and tomorrow we will see if it the battery what i dought

i removed the first plugs and had it turned over with starter motor pushing car and the sparks were so small and there was like 2 -3 second between each spark. It looks like it lacked the sparking power but when i tryed to turn the car over i had my dads large car charger/jumper.


anyone know what the cars doing to me

 

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 Post subject: Re: 250 Xflow 4.1 EFI running problem
Posted: Sun Mar 19, 2006 10:18 pm 
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Xflow wrote:
the timming was out by mile and half which is the beginning of the problems when you turn the dizzy to get timming better it gets a lot better and then it hits the block if it could still turn further it will have a perfict idel but can't so my dads mate carefully pulled the dizzy
the dizzy will ONLY slot in in one of 4 spots IIRC, the rest of the time the dizzy shaft wont align with the oil pump drive shaft, tapping it in with a hammer risks damaging the oil pump
properly you get a distributor shaft minus the drive gear and use that to turn the oil pump drive shaft to align it to the distributor drive gear/shaft

when you checked the ignition timing, did you disconnect the SPOUT connector at the distributor?

Xflow wrote:
The battery gives 12.35volts if i remember right so it might be the battery not got enought volts they should be about 13.something volts

while the engine isnt running and with no load, a healthily charged battery should sit somewhere around 12-12.5V, (suprisingly, its a 12V battery!), but with a healthy charging system, the voltage at the battery should be around 13.8-14V

Xflow wrote:
i removed the first plugs and had it turned over with starter motor pushing car and the sparks were so small and there was like 2 -3 second between each spark
thats about right, remember, each cylinder only fires once every 2 revoloutions of the crankshaft, and the starter doesnt spin the engine over that fast....

 

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Posted: Sun Mar 19, 2006 11:19 pm 
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Check your first post on this problem for my ideas to the solution!
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Posted: Mon Mar 20, 2006 3:17 pm 
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Quote:
when you checked the ignition timing, did you disconnect the SPOUT connector at the distributor?

WTF is the SPOUT connector
O NO what have i done now

 

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Posted: Mon Mar 20, 2006 6:10 pm 
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i THINK YOU NEED A MANUAL TO READ :roll: :roll:

 

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Posted: Mon Mar 20, 2006 7:46 pm 
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on the EFI distributors, between the plug that goes into the TFI module, and where the wires get taped together, there's a (IIRC yellow w/green trace) wire that has a single pin connector in it, this is the SPOUT connector, and you MUST (and no s**t about it) MUST disconnect this before even dreaming about checking the ignition timing

get a manual before f**k with anything in the future

 

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Posted: Mon Mar 20, 2006 11:06 pm 
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Ow that wire yer it yellow with the connector in the middle so what dose the spout do and what happen if you do that while it connected? nothing in the gregorys meantions the spout connector but it got Spark out connector which long term for it in the wiring diagram

it meantions the control relay could be faulty so ill most likerly replace that tomorrow after i try the motor with my new bosch coil and spare dizzy

 

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Posted: Tue Mar 21, 2006 6:40 am 
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SPOUT=spark out, disconnecting it disables ignition timing advance

 

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Posted: Wed Mar 22, 2006 9:32 am 
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Ive got it disconnected and got new coil on the motor now and she running again but timming sounds like few miles out and we turn dizzy and it slowerly gets better but the clip on the side of the dizzy holding the cap stop it from spinning the bit more to get a smooth idel.

Whats going on here is my dizzy stuffed? yes i got the SPOUT dissconnected
the piston top dead center and the dizzy point straight to where the first point is ment to be on the dizzy mark and it wants to spin a long way anti clock ways to get smoother idel but the dizzy cap clip stop it

anyone know?
im thinking stuffed dizzy moduel or something

 

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Posted: Wed Mar 22, 2006 9:59 am 
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Could also be that the timing marks on the balancer has slipped and giving you incorrect TDC readings.

My XF did this and the balancer was bout 20deg out. Caused lots of fun and confusion when I reset the timing one day.
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Posted: Wed Mar 22, 2006 1:16 pm 
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Xflow wrote:
Ive got it disconnected and got new coil on the motor now and she running again but timming sounds like few miles out and we turn dizzy and it slowerly gets better but the clip on the side of the dizzy holding the cap stop it from spinning the bit more to get a smooth idel.

Whats going on here is my dizzy stuffed? yes i got the SPOUT dissconnected
the piston top dead center and the dizzy point straight to where the first point is ment to be on the dizzy mark and it wants to spin a long way anti clock ways to get smoother idel but the dizzy cap clip stop it

anyone know?
im thinking stuffed dizzy moduel or something

pull the dizzy out, and move it one tooth clockwise (you'll need to move the oil pump drive shaft slightly) and you should be able to get it right

please tell me you're using a timing light

 

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Posted: Wed Mar 22, 2006 1:28 pm 
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Quote:
Could also be that the timing marks on the balancer has slipped and giving you incorrect TDC readings.

My XF did this and the balancer was bout 20deg out. Caused lots of fun and confusion when I reset the timing one day.

Ill check that out then there a mark of something to tell you where crank a Harmonic balancer line up right? lol

Quote:
pull the dizzy out, and move it one tooth clockwise (you'll need to move the oil pump drive shaft slightly) and you should be able to get it right

please tell me you're using a timing light


ok ill do that then but how you turn the oil pump? i noticed it connects to the dizzy threw the bottem of it.

and no were not using timming light yet intill it idels smoot enought to even get a timming light on the fricken LLLUUUMMMPPPPPY idel

ill see if i can start it up again and get my digital camera to record it running for few seconds see what you guy think from lissening and seeing what it doing that might help a lot.

Ill make sure the video file is small size download as possable

 

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Posted: Wed Mar 22, 2006 1:35 pm 
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use a timing light to get your ignition timing right, something else may be the cause of the lumpy idle

rotate the oil pump drive shaft by using the shaft drom an old distributor that has had its drive gear removed

 

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Posted: Wed Mar 22, 2006 1:55 pm 
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Hahaha though you were going to say use an old dizzy without the cog. ill do that then

Ill put the timming light on it in hour or so and then come back and tell you guys whats happen

 

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Posted: Wed Mar 22, 2006 2:00 pm 
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Xflow wrote:
Quote:
Could also be that the timing marks on the balancer has slipped and giving you incorrect TDC readings.

My XF did this and the balancer was bout 20deg out. Caused lots of fun and confusion when I reset the timing one day.

Ill check that out then there a mark of something to tell you where crank a Harmonic balancer line up right? lol


Nope.. Only real way is to get No 1 cylinder at TDC compression stroke and check the position of the TDC mark on the balancer against the timing case. If they are out greatly, balancer has probably moved.

We are also assuming here that the chain hasn't slipped a tooth while you had parts off as well.
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