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3 coil packs, 2 sets of leads, still mis-firing (dual fuel) 

 

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 Post subject: Re: 3 coil packs, 2 sets of leads, still mis-firing (dual fuel)
Posted: Tue Jan 19, 2010 10:11 pm 
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ok... plugs re-gapped, balance pipe was correctly attached, spark leak checked at night (as suggested by MadMatt). still running rough. i'm getting very tempted to try a brand new coil and brand new leads. :@
it was after changing the coil that i noticed a big difference each time. first time it was noticeable but subtle, 2nd time it was very noticeable and caused bad misfiring, 3rd time was a charm until 300k's of driving and back to missing. none of the coils were new, they were from the wreckers..
thanks for the help thus far guys, i really appreciate it!
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 Post subject: Re: 3 coil packs, 2 sets of leads, still mis-firing (dual fuel)
Posted: Tue Jan 19, 2010 10:29 pm 
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lol that one last piece of info might be the biggest clue...
didnt realise you had bought second hand coils.
a brand new coil pack might be worth a shot

 

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 Post subject: Re: 3 coil packs, 2 sets of leads, still mis-firing (dual fuel)
Posted: Tue Jan 19, 2010 10:40 pm 
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misk_one wrote:
lol that one last piece of info might be the biggest clue...
didnt realise you had bought second hand coils.
a brand new coil pack might be worth a shot


so its not crazy to think it might be 3 dud coils (first one was known working on my car before the engine change). is there any recomendation on coils, any particular brand (genuine or aftermarket?)
and what about LPG lead recommendations? anything in particular to buy or stay away from?
cheers guys!
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 Post subject: Re: 3 coil packs, 2 sets of leads, still mis-firing (dual fuel)
Posted: Tue Jan 19, 2010 11:02 pm 
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I had the same problem turned out to be the Spark Plugs i bought a set for LPG and had no problems after that so try some spark plugs for LPG if u need the numbers i have a empty packet here some where
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 Post subject: Re: 3 coil packs, 2 sets of leads, still mis-firing (dual fuel)
Posted: Fri Jan 22, 2010 1:22 am 
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I had ignition issues in my EB, went thru a couple coils, a couple sets of leads & tried a few different plugs. Mostly new parts, some 2nd hand known good on other engines. In the end i did the following.

# New Bosch coil
# IC & E 8mm ignition lead set (not cheap, very worth while!)
# NGK Plugs to suit EB LPG, gapped at .9mm (a little tighter than the 1.0 to 1.1 factory suggests)

Ignition system issues resolved.

Just recently did a service on my Mums ED, which has always run pretty good overall on LPG since the reco engine 3 years ago. But it was always a little umm, harsh i guess is the word on acceleration and just a tad rough on idle. Not bad, what you expect from a LPG ED. It had Bosch plugs in it, correct for petrol. I fit a set of NKG Lpg type plugs with a .9mm gap & the engine idles so smooth & accelerates so smooth you would think it's running on petrol!

With the spark plug gap, any LPG fitter i've spoken with about spark plugs always suggests to reduce the gap by .1mm at the minimum.

Cheers

ToranaGuy

 

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 Post subject: Re: 3 coil packs, 2 sets of leads, still mis-firing (dual fuel)
Posted: Fri Jan 22, 2010 3:10 am 
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What did you gap them to?

.70mm gap.

I had a lot of backfires when i was experimenting with gap sizes, i will bet you $50 that is the cause!

(FYI: I aint paying out if i lose, i do however, expect you to) ;)

 

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 Post subject: Re: 3 coil packs, 2 sets of leads, still mis-firing (dual fuel)
Posted: Sat Jan 23, 2010 8:25 pm 
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alrightio. replaced plugs for some bosch yttrium ones, re-gapped to 0.9mm this time. no more backfiring on gas (touch wood). and no more missing on petrol either!!!!
still running a little rough on gas. its as if it thinks it has a lumpy idle on cold starts, (revs between 8-900 melodically). and it also stalls out when going into corners or when in reverse sometimes.

currently i just have the standard motorcraft leads on it. and am thinking of changing leads? any advice on this.
thanks a lot guys, reaaaally appreciate all the help
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 Post subject: Re: 3 coil packs, 2 sets of leads, still mis-firing (dual fuel)
Posted: Sat Jan 23, 2010 8:41 pm 
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check your not being given standard plugs and not gas suited plugs or colder than standard.

my mate had an issue on gas with misfire while under load and cornering. we found that 2 plugs were cracked and that fixed the under load prob but while cornering at a descent speed it would misfire, turns out the boots that slide up and down the lead were up way to high and the lead was slopping around abit so we pushed the boot down as far as it would go on the plug and bamm all sweet

 

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 Post subject: Re: 3 coil packs, 2 sets of leads, still mis-firing (dual fuel)
Posted: Sun Jan 24, 2010 10:03 am 
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If you want to check your leads, you want a multimeter, and without removing them put a wire at each end of a lead, one at a time and set the multimeter to the 'ohm' setting.

Under 12 and your right, over 12ohm's and the resistance is too high, but, when did you replace the leads, just recently? Hope you didnt throw away all those coil packs.

 

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 Post subject: Re: 3 coil packs, 2 sets of leads, still mis-firing (dual fuel)
Posted: Mon Jan 25, 2010 8:10 pm 
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no i didnt throw them out lol (the coil packs), they were exchanged with my mechanic.
anywho, 2 leads were over 12k, others were fine. i ended up changing the lot for brand new topgun max 300's. still no luck, still running rough (sort of spluttering/missing & backfire under load BUT only on gas now). will resetting the computer do anything?.. and what about map sensor..? as when i changed my engine i used my whole intake assembly as a whole..
what else could it be as i mix & matched parts from my old motor (which was running fine)?
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 Post subject: Re: 3 coil packs, 2 sets of leads, still mis-firing (dual fuel)
Posted: Mon Jan 25, 2010 8:18 pm 
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did you double check your vac lines for the gas system?
mine was running very rough (stalling and what not) after a few mods and i just needed to adjust the idle setup on the gas system (less gas more air)

has anything with the gas system changed at all?
it may just be a bit out of tune?

are the plugs you had/have been using dirty at all?
perhaps there is alot of oil and s**t in your intake or even in the cylinder itself that may be gunking up the plugs?

or if your breather system is not working correctly it may be drawing in more oil vapour than normal?

random i know, but could be worth a shot? lol

 

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mild engine, EL ECU & J3, HI6 & MSD coil

in the shed - .595" lift cam, GT4202, forged AU engine, ems 4424 ecu, glide & 5500 stall - next-bellhousing

XH ute daily - DOHC BA XR6 engine, T5, AU3 ECU, J3 chip, wideband & logger, ported BBM, 3" intake

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 Post subject: Re: 3 coil packs, 2 sets of leads, still mis-firing (dual fuel)
Posted: Mon Jan 25, 2010 10:29 pm 
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vac lines are fine for gas, came off once but secured well now.
other than that nothing has changed with the gas system ... at all... other than new airbox.
i had noticed the plugs i just changed were black and gunky... all of them though. and that was just after 1000km's.....
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 Post subject: Re: 3 coil packs, 2 sets of leads, still mis-firing (dual fuel)
Posted: Mon Jan 25, 2010 10:56 pm 
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were they sticky or dry?

if they were sticky they your getting oil through the engine...
could be a number of ways that happens.
could be shagged rings, worn valve stem seals, faulty PCV valve, or incorrect breather setup.

oil vapour through the engine will make it harder to ignite, can drop the octane level and also cover the plugs making it harder to spark.

 

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XG Panelvan
mild engine, EL ECU & J3, HI6 & MSD coil

in the shed - .595" lift cam, GT4202, forged AU engine, ems 4424 ecu, glide & 5500 stall - next-bellhousing

XH ute daily - DOHC BA XR6 engine, T5, AU3 ECU, J3 chip, wideband & logger, ported BBM, 3" intake

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 Post subject: Re: 3 coil packs, 2 sets of leads, still mis-firing (dual fuel)
Posted: Mon Jan 25, 2010 10:58 pm 
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have a read of this page and tell us which matches how your plugs looked
http://www.beru.com/english/produkte/zu ... ehilfe.php

 

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XG Panelvan
mild engine, EL ECU & J3, HI6 & MSD coil

in the shed - .595" lift cam, GT4202, forged AU engine, ems 4424 ecu, glide & 5500 stall - next-bellhousing

XH ute daily - DOHC BA XR6 engine, T5, AU3 ECU, J3 chip, wideband & logger, ported BBM, 3" intake

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 Post subject: Re: 3 coil packs, 2 sets of leads, still mis-firing (dual fuel)
Posted: Mon Jan 25, 2010 11:49 pm 
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it matched to number 2 but the electrode and insulator wasnt that discolored. its not using oil, so i'm thinking it isnt rings.
i'll do some more trouble-shooting tomorow.
if the plugs look like that, does it render them useless? or do you clean them and continue?
cheers!
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