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advice on neglected EL engine 4.0L 

 

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 Post subject: Re: advice on neglected EL engine 4.0L
Posted: Thu Dec 20, 2012 10:35 am 
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caseyaberhart wrote:
phongus wrote:
IMO, get a second working engine and keep the old one. Work on the old one slowly and put go fast or better parts in there. Collect things as you go and when you're ready, put it all together and wack it back in the car. It is quiet enjoyable if you are patient and do research before you start breaking stuff :). Good luck.


thank you phongus, you appear to be one of the leading authorities on e series fords here and this is what i was thinking of doing. i am not discrediting anyone else but this to me seems to be the best avenue for me. the fact being that i have low budget and high time makes this seem like a sensible choice.


Thanks, but I doubt I am the leading authority...I learned from the knowledgeable here on FM and just pass on my experiences. Many more smarter people on FM on this regard.

If you were referring to leading tight a*** E-series owner, you're on the right track.

Like you, I have more time than money...well less time and less money now, but that's beside the point. If you have the time, building up a spare motor is a good learning curve and makes you feel all warm and fuzzy :D.

 

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phongus = Post whore 2006
EL XR6 motor, EL ECU + J3 chip, WADE 1673 Camshaft, 3" S/S intake, Pacy 4480, 2.5" Hi flow cat, 2.5" Lukey exhaust.
Max Power = 144.6 rwkw (03/05/2008)

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 Post subject: Re: advice on neglected EL engine 4.0L
Posted: Thu Dec 20, 2012 12:59 pm 
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phongus wrote:
caseyaberhart wrote:
phongus wrote:
IMO, get a second working engine and keep the old one. Work on the old one slowly and put go fast or better parts in there. Collect things as you go and when you're ready, put it all together and wack it back in the car. It is quiet enjoyable if you are patient and do research before you start breaking stuff :). Good luck.


thank you phongus, you appear to be one of the leading authorities on e series fords here and this is what i was thinking of doing. i am not discrediting anyone else but this to me seems to be the best avenue for me. the fact being that i have low budget and high time makes this seem like a sensible choice.


Thanks, but I doubt I am the leading authority...I learned from the knowledgeable here on FM and just pass on my experiences. Many more smarter people on FM on this regard.

If you were referring to leading tight a*** E-series owner, you're on the right track.

Like you, I have more time than money...well less time and less money now, but that's beside the point. If you have the time, building up a spare motor is a good learning curve and makes you feel all warm and fuzzy :D.


We appear to be in the same tighta** place so this is the route I will most likley go:

Get a running engine, drop it in (I know it isnt that simple but anyway) take the old one apart and build it back up. If I can come up with the $$$ I might pay someone else to do the swap e.g. the wreckers if they are reasonable.

I did a search on here for this type of failure and it doesn't really seem to happen all that often. So maybe the aftermarket dizzy assembly was a dud? Or just the unmatched gears on it caused this?

 

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Stock EL Gli Sedan, Tickford 98 EL/AU Hybrid Swapped in after aux shaft failure due to a lazy mechanic who can't service cars and aftermarket distributor-of-death-made-in-china crap.
Soon to be: The FalcMont - Build thread: viewtopic.php?f=53&t=120773

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 Post subject: Re: advice on neglected EL engine 4.0L
Posted: Thu Dec 20, 2012 1:07 pm 
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ive had it happen a few years back, i just replaced the engine then brought a genuine bosh distributor problem solved..
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 Post subject: Re: advice on neglected EL engine 4.0L
Posted: Thu Dec 20, 2012 1:32 pm 
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TROYMAN wrote:
ive had it happen a few years back, i just replaced the engine then brought a genuine bosh distributor problem solved..


Does Bosch make them anymore? I thought they stopped production :?

 

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Max Power = 144.6 rwkw (03/05/2008)

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 Post subject: Re: advice on neglected EL engine 4.0L
Posted: Thu Dec 20, 2012 1:52 pm 
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they did, but i have heard they are re producing them again..
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 Post subject: Re: advice on neglected EL engine 4.0L
Posted: Thu Dec 20, 2012 3:22 pm 
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Update:

I can get a 2nd hand bare long for 550 compression tested or for 50 less and giving them my engine I get one with the manifolds on already. 3 month warranty on both. The 2nd option is easiest for me. As it will be a backyard job and I have mates helping me. They dont want to muck about with changing manifolds and such so a straight swap would be best I guess. Engine crane for the wwekend will be free. And a carton of whatever for each participant.

If I go the bare long I know I am up for gaskets etc. also can I retrieve the brand new rear main seal from the original engine without damaging it? (tighta**).

So with either option what problems may I encounter? Also I will be removing the engine and box as one, and bolting the box to the new one and slipping it all back in. when I go to pick up the 2nd hand engine what should I look at? I have all the sockets and bars I need. I also have my own compression tester.

I really cant afford to fk this up.

What is the procedure for an engine swap? Is there some details on here somewhere? I searched for engine swap but the search function here automatically omits the word engine from the search (F**k thing).

All tips tricks and help is much appreciated.

 

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Stock EL Gli Sedan, Tickford 98 EL/AU Hybrid Swapped in after aux shaft failure due to a lazy mechanic who can't service cars and aftermarket distributor-of-death-made-in-china crap.
Soon to be: The FalcMont - Build thread: viewtopic.php?f=53&t=120773

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 Post subject: Re: advice on neglected EL engine 4.0L
Posted: Thu Dec 20, 2012 3:29 pm 
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Try ebay/gumtree for an engine being sold privatly, can be as low as $250 for a good running motor, just you wont have the warranty

 

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 Post subject: Re: advice on neglected EL engine 4.0L
Posted: Thu Dec 20, 2012 4:15 pm 
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Drain cooling system and remove radiator, remove battery, remove serp belt, unbolt air con compressor from engine and put to one side, remove power steer pump and put to one side, remove induction tubes, disconnect wiring at the firewall, disconnect accelerator cable, disconnect vacuum lines from brake booster etc, disconnect negative battery cables from block, disconnect positive battery cable from the starter motor, disconnect heater hoses from heater tap and bypass tube, disconnect fuel lines, disconnect wiring from distributor and temperature senders, disconnect automatic shifter linkage, drain auto fluid, remove driveshaft, place jack under rear end of transmission, remove transmission crossmember, lower jack until rocker cover rests on firewall, connect suitable lifting gear to engine lifting points and engine crane, raise crane until it takes the weight of the engine, remove the engine mount through bolts from the k-frame, using the crane and the jack, lift the engine and transmission assembly out of the vehicle, the jack helps the trans to roll forward.

Then you should have something that looks like this:

Image

That's going off memory nearly a year ago. I probably missed something...

Seriously, invest $50 into a service manual. It will pay for itself.

Edit: Might need to disconnect the cat converter from the exhaust manifold. It will make things easier lol.

 

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 Post subject: Re: advice on neglected EL engine 4.0L
Posted: Thu Dec 20, 2012 4:37 pm 
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As bry40l said, see if you can find a cheaper motor? Some people might be wrecking a good working car due to severe panel damage. Not sure on prices on your neck of the woods, but I bought an EL Tickford motor with EL Fairmont Ghia ECU for $550, all in working condition, that was 5 years ago. Check on FM or AFF to see if anyone is wrecking in the area.

Bet me to it evxr6 with the engine removal haha...slow typer I am. Remember to remove the bonnet if you can or unbolt the hydraulics and get someone to hold the bonnet while you lift the engine in and out...mind you, make sure when they hold it, they bloody well hold it...a wind breeze can push the thing backwards break your windscreen and bend your bonnet. Actually just remove the thing. While you have everything out and if you have money to spare, replace the heater bypass pipe IF it looks broken and rusted...you won't be able to replace that easily later one if it dies...also the hoses would be a good idea to replace while you're at it.

To lift the engine you can use a chain or seat belt...if you have a spare one lying around. I have used the seat belt on many occasions and they haven't failed me yet! Also when you lift the engine out, it is best to angle the engine up so that the transmission can clear the trans tunnel.

Best of luck!

 

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phongus = Post whore 2006
EL XR6 motor, EL ECU + J3 chip, WADE 1673 Camshaft, 3" S/S intake, Pacy 4480, 2.5" Hi flow cat, 2.5" Lukey exhaust.
Max Power = 144.6 rwkw (03/05/2008)

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 Post subject: Re: advice on neglected EL engine 4.0L
Posted: Thu Dec 20, 2012 6:19 pm 
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phongus wrote:
As bry40l said, see if you can find a cheaper motor? Some people might be wrecking a good working car due to severe panel damage. Not sure on prices on your neck of the woods, but I bought an EL Tickford motor with EL Fairmont Ghia ECU for $550, all in working condition, that was 5 years ago. Check on FM or AFF to see if anyone is wrecking in the area.

Bet me to it evxr6 with the engine removal haha...slow typer I am. Remember to remove the bonnet if you can or unbolt the hydraulics and get someone to hold the bonnet while you lift the engine in and out...mind you, make sure when they hold it, they bloody well hold it...a wind breeze can push the thing backwards break your windscreen and bend your bonnet. Actually just remove the thing. While you have everything out and if you have money to spare, replace the heater bypass pipe IF it looks broken and rusted...you won't be able to replace that easily later one if it dies...also the hoses would be a good idea to replace while you're at it.

To lift the engine you can use a chain or seat belt...if you have a spare one lying around. I have used the seat belt on many occasions and they haven't failed me yet! Also when you lift the engine out, it is best to angle the engine up so that the transmission can clear the trans tunnel.

Best of luck!


Update $500 has scored me a 96da engine with tickford head out of a 1998 nl fairlane. Is this the au/el hybrid people talk about? The current engine is a 95da. New engine has distributor manifolds etc still on it. All that is missing is the accessories pwr steer, alternator etc. 3 month warranty. it has 170psi compression test.

Js the bypass hose the metal oneattached to the water pump? How do you remove this or do you need the engine out? I dropped the coolant, pulled the hoses, pwr steering pump, belt and tensioner pwr steering bracket and that was it for me (trashed my back a few years ago). So picking up the new enginr tomorroe

 

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Stock EL Gli Sedan, Tickford 98 EL/AU Hybrid Swapped in after aux shaft failure due to a lazy mechanic who can't service cars and aftermarket distributor-of-death-made-in-china crap.
Soon to be: The FalcMont - Build thread: viewtopic.php?f=53&t=120773

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 Post subject: Re: advice on neglected EL engine 4.0L
Posted: Thu Dec 20, 2012 7:04 pm 
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The heater bypass can be removed with the engine in place, but really it will be the biggest pain in the a***. If the pipe is still in good nick, you can just remove it once the engine is out and put it straight onto your second engine.

Does the new engine come with a water pump? If not, best to get a new one and chuck it in. It is advised not to remove the old pump and reuse because of the locations of the gaskets, unless you have the tools to pull the water pump apart and replace the gasket.

 

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phongus = Post whore 2006
EL XR6 motor, EL ECU + J3 chip, WADE 1673 Camshaft, 3" S/S intake, Pacy 4480, 2.5" Hi flow cat, 2.5" Lukey exhaust.
Max Power = 144.6 rwkw (03/05/2008)

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 Post subject: Re: advice on neglected EL engine 4.0L
Posted: Thu Dec 20, 2012 7:58 pm 
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phongus wrote:
The heater bypass can be removed with the engine in place, but really it will be the biggest pain in the a***. If the pipe is still in good nick, you can just remove it once the engine is out and put it straight onto your second engine.

Does the new engine come with a water pump? If not, best to get a new one and chuck it in. It is advised not to remove the old pump and reuse because of the locations of the gaskets, unless you have the tools to pull the water pump apart and replace the gasket.


Water pump on new engine cannot be turned by hand, seized?

 

_________________

Stock EL Gli Sedan, Tickford 98 EL/AU Hybrid Swapped in after aux shaft failure due to a lazy mechanic who can't service cars and aftermarket distributor-of-death-made-in-china crap.
Soon to be: The FalcMont - Build thread: viewtopic.php?f=53&t=120773

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 Post subject: Re: advice on neglected EL engine 4.0L
Posted: Thu Dec 20, 2012 9:05 pm 
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New Pump :D
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 Post subject: Re: advice on neglected EL engine 4.0L
Posted: Thu Dec 20, 2012 9:13 pm 
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caseyaberhart wrote:
phongus wrote:
The heater bypass can be removed with the engine in place, but really it will be the biggest pain in the a***. If the pipe is still in good nick, you can just remove it once the engine is out and put it straight onto your second engine.

Does the new engine come with a water pump? If not, best to get a new one and chuck it in. It is advised not to remove the old pump and reuse because of the locations of the gaskets, unless you have the tools to pull the water pump apart and replace the gasket.


Water pump on new engine cannot be turned by hand, seized?


new pump...but I'd be concerned as to why it is seized in the first place :?

 

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phongus = Post whore 2006
EL XR6 motor, EL ECU + J3 chip, WADE 1673 Camshaft, 3" S/S intake, Pacy 4480, 2.5" Hi flow cat, 2.5" Lukey exhaust.
Max Power = 144.6 rwkw (03/05/2008)

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 Post subject: Re: advice on neglected EL engine 4.0L
Posted: Thu Dec 20, 2012 9:28 pm 
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phongus wrote:
caseyaberhart wrote:
phongus wrote:
The heater bypass can be removed with the engine in place, but really it will be the biggest pain in the a***. If the pipe is still in good nick, you can just remove it once the engine is out and put it straight onto your second engine.

Does the new engine come with a water pump? If not, best to get a new one and chuck it in. It is advised not to remove the old pump and reuse because of the locations of the gaskets, unless you have the tools to pull the water pump apart and replace the gasket.


Water pump on new engine cannot be turned by hand, seized?


new pump...but I'd be concerned as to why it is seized in the first place :?


No worries, was going to renew it regardless. I pulled a pump from a working engine before and it was hard to turn. This engine was pulled 7 months ago and had only done 110000km. Car had bad panel damage.checked for oil leaks when I looked at it and it appears that it doesnt have the typical inlet side head leak. Also the head gasket protrudes about 2mm from the engine, being a tickford motor doesthis thinghave different valves cam and compression ratio? And will my stock ecu run it for the time being until I get a tickford ecu?

ford-4l-and-6-cylinder-f1/hybrid-4lt-t117323.html?hilit=95da%2096da is this the same engine but with tickford enhancements?

also nl fairlane is an el and nf fairlaine is an ef right?

 

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Stock EL Gli Sedan, Tickford 98 EL/AU Hybrid Swapped in after aux shaft failure due to a lazy mechanic who can't service cars and aftermarket distributor-of-death-made-in-china crap.
Soon to be: The FalcMont - Build thread: viewtopic.php?f=53&t=120773

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