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almost overheated......?!? 

 

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Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2007 12:34 am 
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Son brought his car over yesterday for a oil change.I dropped the oil and was checking the other fluids.Over flow bottle was empty, s**t i thought as i had been at him to check.So filled it and checked the next morning and it was empty again.Fill it up and check it out and there is water dripping under the car.As been said in this post, that heater hose under the manifold to the heater tap and has a small split in it.Theres no stress there so why splt, but what a bugger to get the hose off, got bandaids on every finger (damm old style hose clamps).
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Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2007 12:58 pm 
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eagleaus wrote:
Son brought his car over yesterday for a oil change.I dropped the oil and was checking the other fluids.Over flow bottle was empty, s**t i thought as i had been at him to check.So filled it and checked the next morning and it was empty again.Fill it up and check it out and there is water dripping under the car.As been said in this post, that heater hose under the manifold to the heater tap and has a small split in it.Theres no stress there so why splt, but what a bugger to get the hose off, got bandaids on every finger (damm old style hose clamps).


There was a little heater hose for me that had a pin hole in it. I finally replaced that. That was hard enough.

Then i had to replace my heater tap and lucky enough that the heater tap had the screw type clamps and not those s**t quick releases. The quick grips are good for race cars but not family cars.

 

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Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2007 1:23 pm 
Getting Side Ways
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Mitch_ wrote:
no, EL Fairmont is correct,
i was driving my mates AU and it dropped all of its coolant, and the gauge went into the red, and started beeping at me. just connected the hose, re-filled the water, and it was all good!
and we use thermocouples at work, and when we take the water off them, they still register the heat.


I agree with Mitch and EL Fairmont,
when there is no coolant water being circulated around the temp in the motor rises, meaning the block and head get hot which in turns heats up the temp sender unit, which then sends a signal to the gauge that the motor is hot. it is not the air around the sender unit that is being read it's the temp of the material around the sender unit which is.
it's simple really the air does not heat the gauge when there is no water, the metal where the sender is located does which in turns heats the air around the sender.
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Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2007 1:26 pm 
Getting Side Ways
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this very issue of the temp guage failing to register problems has cost me a head gasket and cracked head. I recomend fitting a coolant level sensor as per fairmont and xr6 etc. A very bad design.
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Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2007 1:32 pm 
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A thermocuple does not spark. It uses two dissimilar metals to measure a temperature difference between the two ends of the probe, The voltage produced will be in the order of 0.5mV or so. They will measure air just as well as water. They are often used as Air temperature indicators machines (at least at Hydro Tas). See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thermocouple for more of an explanation.
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Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2007 2:56 pm 
Parts Gopher
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some create a minute spark and some emitt a pulse but the fact is that electricity of a small form has to cross from one probe point to the other... and it has to work through the same metals otherwise it doesnt register a reading...... and the weight and mass of material in between them depends greatly on what temp reading it gives you due to spark/pulse travel, there are different designs of thermocouples for different applications, they will measure air as well as water yes, but one thats designed to measure water wont measure air anywhere near as accurate...... thus giving a temp of basically 0 when there is absolutely no water on or around the points, its just that simple. hands on experience is better than just reading what that says and trying to make yourself understand what you are saying....

 

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Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2007 4:08 pm 
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I do have a slight idea what i am talking about, i am an electronic engineer and work with these things all the time. the only difference between an air and water one is that one is waterproof. This may dampen the air readings somewhat due to thermal inertia, but it will eventually reach air temperature. There is no voltage difference between the wires at the probe tip as they are shorted. The different seebeck coeficients of the wires gives rise to a voltage difference at the end of the probe. There is only a miniscule current flowing through the thermocouple. in most of them the wires at the end will be soldered. The most likely reason you are seeing zero with no fluid in the block is that the meter is calibrated to read between say 90 and 150 degrees (not sure of exact range). the air temperature (what it is measuring) will not be what the water temperature would be, probably much lower and lower than the meter will read. If the engine gets hot enough it may read on the meter because it may get hot enough. Think of it... do you see the engine temperature gauge start off above zero on hot days? the meter is not designed to read low temperatures.
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Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2007 4:11 pm 
Parts Gopher
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quote/ The most likely reason you are seeing zero with no fluid in the block is that the meter is calibrated to read between say 90 and 150 degrees (not sure of exact range). the air temperature (what it is measuring) will not be what the water temperature would be, probably much lower and lower than the meter will read


-you basically just proved my point :)
so like i was saying in the first place, my car must not have been outta water completely, but more to the point some ppl were saying that without any water at all the car will read a high temp, but just like you said, which proved my point, with no water in the car it will read basically nothing on the cluster....... ?
anywayz im bored of this, basically the reason the thread was started was to make sure i didnt see any nice cars on the side of the road broken.... :)

 

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Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2007 5:14 pm 
Oompa Loompa
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my au has over heat protection which has saved me once when wife was driving . the temp gauge runs off the front and the rear overheat is at the back of the head saved me a fortune the car just shuts down f**k i love technology it saves you money :D

 

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Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2007 5:35 pm 
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Not quite tickford666 but the end result is similar. Anyway enough of that. running without water is bad for an engine and shouldn't be done which is really the point....
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Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2007 6:13 pm 
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i agree, i would like to know why my engine didnt s**t itself after an hour and a bit of driving with basically no water..... the temp stayed at half way on the letter "m" on the word normal mind you, but i have no idea why, when i got home the engine was hissing and it was bone dry, i have had it running since then and it does everything the same it did before hand, no extra noises, still revs to 6thou etc.... how come my car kept running and others break down?

 

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Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2007 6:27 pm 
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I guess it depends exactly how hot it got. And probably how it cooled down too.
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Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2007 6:58 pm 
Oompa Loompa
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But you say you only put 6 litres of water in , these cooling systems hold approx 16 litres of coolant.
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Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2007 7:12 pm 
Parts Gopher
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yeah i emptied a 6litre bottle of coolant into it and it didnt get to the top from what i can remember, although it was coming out the other end pretty quickly, i think if it werent leaking when i filled it up i probably would have got a couple more litres in max, sheesh i never knew they held that much water, i guess that why i was safe then.... although it did "seem" dry as a bone when it was sizzling and no more water was coming outta the heater hose, and omg what a prick to get to under the bbm, grrrrrr :P

 

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Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2007 7:21 pm 
Oompa Loompa
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Yeah not a easy thing to get at, have recently replaced all heater & radiator hoses on my EF, only took all arfternoon & half a cartoon of West End.
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