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AU head gasket on an EF??? 

 

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 Post subject: Re: AU head gasket on an EF???
Posted: Tue Mar 16, 2010 2:44 pm 
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ELboy wrote:
Wow this is an interesting read. As a qualifided mech of 6 years i recomend you DO NOT use any sealant on head gasket or block the dowls will hold gasket in place.

Cjh your block looks very nice but why dont you have it set at tdc on no.1 not a good idea.


6 years eh?.....I got 20+. Mate, I've done that many 3.9/4.0 head gasket jobs ( EA to EL ), I could do them blindfolded. You can hold up a bolt from a Falcon and I can tell you where it came from.
I use sealant where necessary.....ie: where the head gasket meets the timing cover rubber seal. I use super glue to hold the rubber seal in place. I use Hylomar on the head gasket too.
I have found over several years that this works.
I don't put coolant/inhibitor in straight away either. I use water ( after flushing ), and leave the rad cap on the 1st notch. It is left like this for a week, in normal operation. The 2nd week, flush water out, put rad cap on fully.
3rd week, flush water out, put in coolant/inhibitor.....to the correct concentration required.


As for not having it on TDC.....it doesn't matter, the sprocket is cable tied in place, the cam is going back in the same place from whence it came. The engine wasn't turned over after removal of cyl head. You have more to learn yet, my friend.

 

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 Post subject: Re: AU head gasket on an EF???
Posted: Tue Mar 16, 2010 6:54 pm 
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I was about to say that if you understood why you're ziptieing the sprocket in place you'd realise having the motor at TDC means nothing!
Also the sealant is not for holding the gasket in place either..

 

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 Post subject: Re: AU head gasket on an EF???
Posted: Wed Mar 17, 2010 9:13 am 
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krisisdog wrote:
I was about to say that if you understood why you're ziptieing the sprocket in place you'd realise having the motor at TDC means nothing!
Also the sealant is not for holding the gasket in place either..


Yeah, it's to maintain the relationship between cam and crank. True, if it's ziptied TDC doesn't matter.
The problem is there's a notch on the sprocket that is "supposed" to help with realignment but it doesn't actually line up with the head when the chain is in place. It can sit above or below, but not in line at TDC. Hence the learning - ziptie it and it doesn't matter.

Although now I know how to get it realigned I don't always use ties as I like to free-rotate the engine on starter with the head off to check the bores and to listen for any noises that might indicate something's not right. Stuff like worn bearings, endplay, ring gear teeth, starter wear.

The backstop method is (assuming you cracked the engine at TDC on the compression stroke) to check that #1 valves are both closed at #1 TDC.
If I understand correctly, it's also worth checking that the dizzy is at plug #1 terminal (harder on EDIS :)) so you don't close the patient up with ignition sitting at the the wrong stroke.

QUESTION
As I do more of them I often wonder about the gasket's gallery holes and bore holes.. they're usually quite restrictive on the galleries and sometimes the material around the bore holes don't exactly match the head chamber circumference.
I realise we're not O-ringing the bores here, but has anyone tried die-grinding the gasket here for a better fit?
What about the gallery holes -has anyone heard of opening them up to port-match the galleries?
I thought they may be designed that way to restrict flow to maintain pressure but I've seen enough areas on the inline 6 (and trannies) to wonder if it's another "near enough is good enough" thing.
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 Post subject: Re: AU head gasket on an EF???
Posted: Wed Mar 17, 2010 9:39 am 
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I cable tie my cam when i do a had gaskit, makes it so much easier. If the had has been rotated, no big deal, before you fit it, check the cam pin, rotate the cam off the engine to get it close to where it needs to be to make the cam wheel fit back on, refit the head, then adjust slightly if required to get the cam wheel & chain back on. Not too hard.

I too wondered about the gallery holes for water & oil on the head gaskit. When i rebuild my mighty boy's F8b engine last September, i found that it "suffers" from the same deal, the gallery holes were not quite to the standard that i would like. The cylinder rings matched up perfect & the head gaskit has had no issues since i have assembled the engine, with no sealant on the head gaskit.

I think it might be a case of "this is close enough for most engines" on the manufacturers part.

Cheers

ToranaGuy

 

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 Post subject: Re: AU head gasket on an EF???
Posted: Wed Mar 17, 2010 9:58 am 
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ToranaGuy wrote:
<snip> i found that it "suffers" from the same deal, the gallery holes were not quite to the standard that i would like. The cylinder rings matched up perfect & the head gaskit has had no issues since i have assembled the engine, with no sealant on the head gaskit.


Did you do any matching on the gasket gallery ports? Any issues with warmup or low oil pressure?
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 Post subject: Re: AU head gasket on an EF???
Posted: Wed Mar 17, 2010 10:10 am 
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benryanau wrote:
ToranaGuy wrote:
<snip> i found that it "suffers" from the same deal, the gallery holes were not quite to the standard that i would like. The cylinder rings matched up perfect & the head gaskit has had no issues since i have assembled the engine, with no sealant on the head gaskit.


Did you do any matching on the gasket gallery ports? Any issues with warmup or low oil pressure?


No i didn't actually. I considered it, but i was running short of time, and even tho it doesn't look great, i've not had issues just using head gaskits in the past. There are no warmup issues, oil pressure is rather high due to close tolerances on the bearings (5thou), but not too high. It will drop a little when the engine has a little wear on it. It currently has about 2000kms on it, while it has "loosened up" a lot and rev's much more freely now, i still reckon it's a little on the tight side.

Cheers

ToranaGuy

 

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 Post subject: Re: AU head gasket on an EF???
Posted: Wed Mar 17, 2010 6:10 pm 
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ive talked about the gallery holes with my dad a little bit, he doesnt think that theres any point to it, as he was going to have them welded up and have them match the gasket or open the gasket up abit more, dont know what the difference would have ended up being though
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 Post subject: Re: AU head gasket on an EF???
Posted: Thu Mar 18, 2010 12:19 am 
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Welding them up to then open them to the gaskit size i think would be a waste of time (unless corroded), and iirc the holes in the gaskit were smaller, which would reduce coolant & oil flow. That wouldn't be good. If you were to do anything, better to open the gaskit up to the hole size in the block and head.

Cheers

ToranaGuy

 

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 Post subject: Re: AU head gasket on an EF???
Posted: Thu Mar 18, 2010 12:40 am 
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The holes in the gasket are wayyyy smaller than the head/block holes.

 

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 Post subject: Re: AU head gasket on an EF???
Posted: Thu Mar 18, 2010 1:07 am 
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krisisdog wrote:
The holes in the gasket are wayyyy smaller than the head/block holes.


The it wouldn't be wise to make the block & head holes smaller. But it could be a good thing to open the gaskit holes up.

Cheers

ToranaGuy

 

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 Post subject: Re: AU head gasket on an EF???
Posted: Thu Mar 18, 2010 1:11 am 
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I'll take a pic of the AU MLS gasket tomoro if I remember, as well as the block and head holes.

 

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 Post subject: Re: AU head gasket on an EF???
Posted: Thu Mar 18, 2010 8:11 am 
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ToranaGuy wrote:
Welding them up to then open them to the gaskit size i think would be a waste of time (unless corroded), and iirc the holes in the gaskit were smaller, which would reduce coolant & oil flow. That wouldn't be good. If you were to do anything, better to open the gaskit up to the hole size in the block and head.

Cheers

ToranaGuy

yeh the gallerys where corroded which is why doing that was on the cards but would have cost the same amount to have them welded up then re opened as it would to buy a second hand head basicly.
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 Post subject: Re: AU head gasket on an EF???
Posted: Thu Mar 18, 2010 11:16 am 
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On the AU MLS, water galleries on the passenger side of the gasket are blocked off. The water galleries on the drivers side are about the size of a 6mm drill bit. IIRC.

I had noticed doing my ef one the these galleries on the passenger side where mostly blocked off with s**t anyhow. So whether this was a common thing and ford had incorporated this into the design of the au gasket I don't know. The small hole size means that you better look after your cooling system or they might block off lol.

But having said all that. 9 months and plently of flogging all is well.

 

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 Post subject: Re: AU head gasket on an EF???
Posted: Thu Mar 18, 2010 12:32 pm 
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benryanau wrote:
I don't always use ties as I like to free-rotate the engine on starter with the head off to check the bores and to listen for any noises that might indicate something's not right.


um...... good way to snap chain guides
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 Post subject: Re: AU head gasket on an EF???
Posted: Fri Mar 19, 2010 9:32 am 
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FordFairmont wrote:
benryanau wrote:
I don't always use ties as I like to free-rotate the engine on starter with the head off to check the bores and to listen for any noises that might indicate something's not right.


um...... good way to snap chain guides


Yep, got that souvenir too. Fishing out broken bits from the sump via the timing cover wasn't the best way to spend a few hours. That was from a head that wouldn't crack the seal.. though on your advice I might avoid spinning them over now!
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