Fordmods Logo

Enough is enougH! 

 

Page 7 of 8 [ 117 posts ] Go to page Previous  1 ... 4, 5, 6, 7, 8  Next

 
Posted: Sat Aug 26, 2006 10:34 pm 
Parts Gopher
Offline

Age: 32

Posts: 95

Joined: 22nd Jan 2006

Ride: Falcon XR6

Location: Brisbane
QLD, Australia

All these numbers and big words... I can feel a headache coming on...
Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2006 3:06 pm 
Fordmods Newbie
Offline

Posts: 7

Joined: 24th Mar 2006

Location: Townsville
QLD, Australia

sleeperXR6 wrote:
Hi FordMods, this is my first post.
With regards to enlarged intake/pipe to throttle:
There is a reason why the pipe narrows before entering the throttle: it increases air velocity to the throttle body. The best way to explain this is using the example of a garden hose. Run a garden hose without a nozzle. You will find that you have low water pressure until you turn the hose on to near full. Next, run the hose with a nozzle, at nearly full pressure. Put your hand against the water. Can you feel how much more water pressure was created by simply having the water's passage restricted before exiting the hose?
This is how the pipe-to-throttle narrowing works in your Ford.


Incorrect for a couple of reasons, the first being that air acts completely different is it is suck as opposed to blown, the second is the air is compressible, water is not. The last is that it is about mass flow of air and as you example shows the mass flow of water is the same you just by default have increased the pressure to compensate. The fluid dynamics of what will work and what won't are quite complex and probably aren't worth going into here. The easiest way to test all of this is the to measure the restriction on the inlet with a manometer and try difference setups until you get the least restriction. This will give you the best flow, on a side note I would stand rooted if all Ford had to do to get another 10rwkw out of their engine was fit a big pod filter. IT would kind of make tickford feel sily messing around with variable cam timing and such :)

Cheers
Paul

 

_________________

[CENTER]ImageImage[/CENTER]
[CENTER][FONT="Arial "][SIZE="4"]Turbo Clubman 165kw atw.................Fairmont cruise car[/SIZE][/FONT][/CENTER]

Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2006 3:12 pm 
Fordmods Junkie
Offline
User avatar

Posts: 11739

Joined: 17th May 2005

Gallery: 11 images

Ride: EL Fairmont, VFR400 racer

Power: 144 rwkw

Location: Melbourne
VIC, Australia

nelpd96 wrote:
sleeperXR6 wrote:
Hi FordMods, this is my first post.
With regards to enlarged intake/pipe to throttle:
There is a reason why the pipe narrows before entering the throttle: it increases air velocity to the throttle body. The best way to explain this is using the example of a garden hose. Run a garden hose without a nozzle. You will find that you have low water pressure until you turn the hose on to near full. Next, run the hose with a nozzle, at nearly full pressure. Put your hand against the water. Can you feel how much more water pressure was created by simply having the water's passage restricted before exiting the hose?
This is how the pipe-to-throttle narrowing works in your Ford.


Incorrect for a couple of reasons, the first being that air acts completely different is it is suck as opposed to blown, the second is the air is compressible, water is not. The last is that it is about mass flow of air and as you example shows the mass flow of water is the same you just by default have increased the pressure to compensate. The fluid dynamics of what will work and what won't are quite complex and probably aren't worth going into here. The easiest way to test all of this is the to measure the restriction on the inlet with a manometer and try difference setups until you get the least restriction. This will give you the best flow, on a side note I would stand rooted if all Ford had to do to get another 10rwkw out of their engine was fit a big pod filter. IT would kind of make tickford feel sily messing around with variable cam timing and such :)

Cheers
Paul


can u like twist the piping so the piping looks like its a tornado? This would allow the air to move in an ordely fashion and not much congestion/restriction.....that COULD work.......but im only thinking in lamens terms.

phong =P~

 

_________________

phongus = Post whore 2006
EL XR6 motor, EL ECU + J3 chip, WADE 1673 Camshaft, 3" S/S intake, Pacy 4480, 2.5" Hi flow cat, 2.5" Lukey exhaust.
Max Power = 144.6 rwkw (03/05/2008)

Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2006 5:10 pm 
Parts Gopher
Offline

Age: 32

Posts: 95

Joined: 22nd Jan 2006

Ride: Falcon XR6

Location: Brisbane
QLD, Australia

those stupid hyclone things have been tested and are absolute B/S, just the same as vaporate, magnets and fuel tablets.
Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2006 5:24 pm 
Fordmods Junkie
Offline
User avatar

Posts: 11739

Joined: 17th May 2005

Gallery: 11 images

Ride: EL Fairmont, VFR400 racer

Power: 144 rwkw

Location: Melbourne
VIC, Australia

Ashman1985 wrote:
those stupid hyclone things have been tested and are absolute B/S, just the same as vaporate, magnets and fuel tablets.


but the concept sounds good =D ah wells i guess ill just stick with a stock one or get a mandrel bent intake =D.

cheers

 

_________________

phongus = Post whore 2006
EL XR6 motor, EL ECU + J3 chip, WADE 1673 Camshaft, 3" S/S intake, Pacy 4480, 2.5" Hi flow cat, 2.5" Lukey exhaust.
Max Power = 144.6 rwkw (03/05/2008)

Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2006 6:37 pm 
Parts Gopher
Offline

Age: 32

Posts: 95

Joined: 22nd Jan 2006

Ride: Falcon XR6

Location: Brisbane
QLD, Australia

It does sound good, but in reality turbulant air does not move as fast nor is it as dense.

Not to mention the fact that the twists and such acutally create a restriction.
Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2006 6:44 pm 
Getting Side Ways
Offline
User avatar

Age: 32

Posts: 420

Joined: 30th May 2006

Gallery: 6 images

Ride: XR6

Location: Gosford
NSW, Australia

nelpd96 wrote:
sleeperXR6 wrote:
Hi FordMods, this is my first post.
With regards to enlarged intake/pipe to throttle:
There is a reason why the pipe narrows before entering the throttle: it increases air velocity to the throttle body. The best way to explain this is using the example of a garden hose. Run a garden hose without a nozzle. You will find that you have low water pressure until you turn the hose on to near full. Next, run the hose with a nozzle, at nearly full pressure. Put your hand against the water. Can you feel how much more water pressure was created by simply having the water's passage restricted before exiting the hose?
This is how the pipe-to-throttle narrowing works in your Ford.


Incorrect for a couple of reasons, the first being that air acts completely different is it is suck as opposed to blown, the second is the air is compressible, water is not. The last is that it is about mass flow of air and as you example shows the mass flow of water is the same you just by default have increased the pressure to compensate. The fluid dynamics of what will work and what won't are quite complex and probably aren't worth going into here. The easiest way to test all of this is the to measure the restriction on the inlet with a manometer and try difference setups until you get the least restriction. This will give you the best flow, on a side note I would stand rooted if all Ford had to do to get another 10rwkw out of their engine was fit a big pod filter. IT would kind of make tickford feel sily messing around with variable cam timing and such :)

Cheers
Paul

i don't think he meant anything to do with more air getting in because of smaller piping he was refering to the air velocity increase due to the smaller pipe close to the TB, try blowing a piece of paper of the table with your mouth wide open
Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2006 6:58 pm 
Getting Side Ways
Offline

Posts: 6913

Joined: 6th Nov 2004

Gallery: 4 images

Ride: BF XR6, BF XT Wagon

Power: 197 rwkw

Location: Perth
WA, Australia

I run my car with no intake piping.
Just have the throttle body open to the engine bay.
I have no restrictions at all, not even an air filter.
Street lights became lines as I jumped to hyperspace.
Man what a rush.

 

_________________

EL XR8
Timmeh banned himself from being a moderator.

Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2006 8:11 pm 
Parts Gopher
Offline

Age: 32

Posts: 95

Joined: 22nd Jan 2006

Ride: Falcon XR6

Location: Brisbane
QLD, Australia

XR6 EF wrote:
nelpd96 wrote:
sleeperXR6 wrote:
Hi FordMods, this is my first post.
With regards to enlarged intake/pipe to throttle:
There is a reason why the pipe narrows before entering the throttle: it increases air velocity to the throttle body. The best way to explain this is using the example of a garden hose. Run a garden hose without a nozzle. You will find that you have low water pressure until you turn the hose on to near full. Next, run the hose with a nozzle, at nearly full pressure. Put your hand against the water. Can you feel how much more water pressure was created by simply having the water's passage restricted before exiting the hose?
This is how the pipe-to-throttle narrowing works in your Ford.


Incorrect for a couple of reasons, the first being that air acts completely different is it is suck as opposed to blown, the second is the air is compressible, water is not. The last is that it is about mass flow of air and as you example shows the mass flow of water is the same you just by default have increased the pressure to compensate. The fluid dynamics of what will work and what won't are quite complex and probably aren't worth going into here. The easiest way to test all of this is the to measure the restriction on the inlet with a manometer and try difference setups until you get the least restriction. This will give you the best flow, on a side note I would stand rooted if all Ford had to do to get another 10rwkw out of their engine was fit a big pod filter. IT would kind of make tickford feel sily messing around with variable cam timing and such :)

Cheers
Paul

i don't think he meant anything to do with more air getting in because of smaller piping he was refering to the air velocity increase due to the smaller pipe close to the TB, try blowing a piece of paper of the table with your mouth wide open


incorrect again, the engine is sucking air, not having it forced in.
Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2006 8:16 pm 
Getting Side Ways
Offline
User avatar

Posts: 3115

Joined: 20th Dec 2004

Ride: Falcon

Location: Adelaide
SA, Australia

Exactly

Try taking a deep fast breath with your mount wide open. Now open your mouth just a little and try it again. No doubt the velocity is higher when your mouth is mostly closed, but does it help get air in your lungs?

 

_________________

Stoke me a clipper, I'll be back for Christmas

Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2006 9:47 pm 
Parts Gopher
Offline

Age: 33

Posts: 85

Joined: 6th Dec 2004

Ride: EL XR6

Location: Perth
WA, Australia

Ashman1985 wrote:
those stupid hyclone things have been tested and are absolute B/S, just the same as vaporate, magnets and fuel tablets.


Yeah i agree, yet they still seem to sell a s**t load. I saw them at the Motor Expo here in perth. Where the hell do they get this R&D from anyway? Anyone can pull figures out of there a**.
Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2006 10:54 pm 
Parts Gopher
Offline

Age: 32

Posts: 95

Joined: 22nd Jan 2006

Ride: Falcon XR6

Location: Brisbane
QLD, Australia

its amazing what people will beleive when 'dyno figures' and a few select tesimonials are quoted.
Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2006 11:31 pm 
Getting Side Ways
Offline
User avatar

Age: 32

Posts: 420

Joined: 30th May 2006

Gallery: 6 images

Ride: XR6

Location: Gosford
NSW, Australia

stockstandard wrote:
Exactly

Try taking a deep fast breath with your mount wide open. Now open your mouth just a little and try it again. No doubt the velocity is higher when your mouth is mostly closed, but does it help get air in your lungs?

actually yes it does breathing in through your nose(smaller passage way) means using more depth in your lungs therefore much larger surface area for oxygen to transfer into blood vessels
Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2006 11:45 pm 
Getting Side Ways
Offline
User avatar

Posts: 3115

Joined: 20th Dec 2004

Ride: Falcon

Location: Adelaide
SA, Australia

XR6 EF wrote:
stockstandard wrote:
Exactly

Try taking a deep fast breath with your mount wide open. Now open your mouth just a little and try it again. No doubt the velocity is higher when your mouth is mostly closed, but does it help get air in your lungs?

actually yes it does breathing in through your nose(smaller passage way) means using more depth in your lungs therefore much larger surface area for oxygen to transfer into blood vessels


Then why do runners/sprinters not breath through there nose?
(I wonder how far this analogy will go...)

When you need to move lots of air fast - velocity comes second to flow.

 

_________________

Stoke me a clipper, I'll be back for Christmas

Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Mon Aug 28, 2006 6:41 pm 
Getting Side Ways
Offline
User avatar

Age: 32

Posts: 420

Joined: 30th May 2006

Gallery: 6 images

Ride: XR6

Location: Gosford
NSW, Australia

the first thing you learn if your a runner is in thru the nose out thru the mouth?
Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:
Sort by  
 Page 7 of 8  [ 117 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 4, 5, 6, 7, 8  Next

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot] and 17 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

 

 

It is currently Thu Dec 14, 2017 7:40 pm All times are UTC + 11 hours

 

 

(c)2014 Total Web Solutions Australia - Australian Web Hosting and Domain Names