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Lost spark cyl 5 and 6 

 

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Posted: Tue Aug 28, 2007 1:37 am 
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daggy082 wrote:
This is gonna sound really dumb but how do u change ova the packs?


It's a real pain in the a**
You need a small ratchet (a 1/4" would be handy, but I did it with a 3/4"), a very short extension bar, and a 7mm socket.
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Posted: Tue Aug 28, 2007 3:24 pm 
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do i have to take anything else off? And where are the nuts located... See my last car was a XF falcon so i know nothing (well even less then normally) about coil packs...

 

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Posted: Tue Aug 28, 2007 3:39 pm 
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Do yourself a favour and get a workshop manual. They save you money just in saving you breaking things trying to remove them. $50 well spent and you can always sell it on Ebay if you sell the car

 

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Posted: Wed Aug 29, 2007 6:36 pm 
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falconea wrote:
Do yourself a favour and get a workshop manual. They save you money just in saving you breaking things trying to remove them. $50 well spent and you can always sell it on Ebay if you sell the car

Took ya advice and bought a manual... $32 and it tells u its easier to get it from the bottom so yeh ill give it a go that way. Tells me how to test it aswell so thats kewl. But i found out that its Cyl 1-6 2-5 3-4 that are coupled together so i doubt that 5&6 goin would be result of the coil... but then again i know bugger all :D

 

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Posted: Wed Aug 29, 2007 10:25 pm 
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the coils on these are a "wasted spark" type system, meaning thoeretically cyls 1 and 6, 2 and 5, and 3 and 4 fire at the same time as each other, so if you are only getting no spark on 5 or 6 it basically has to be a coil pack/plug lead issue.
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Posted: Wed Aug 29, 2007 10:30 pm 
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I was lead to believe that the system only caused a spark in the cylinder under compression and no spark in the other. Same as the old VN Commodore system. See if you can get the coil pack tested or get a loan of another pack to try.

 

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Posted: Wed Aug 29, 2007 10:47 pm 
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as far as im aware thats incorrect, i'll look into it though
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Posted: Wed Aug 29, 2007 10:51 pm 
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taken from AUII workshop manual however EF EDIS is very similar/the same


Quote:
DESCRIPTION AND OPERATION
All engines use an Electronic Distributorless Ignition
System (EDIS).
EDIS consists of the following parts:
1. Crankshaft Position Sensor (CKP sensor) and timing
wheel: the sensor is a single pole inductive pickup; the
toothed wheel has 35 teeth at 10° intervals, with the
36th tooth missing. The CKP sensor reads both the
crankshaft speed and the crankshaft position.
2. Coil pack: the coil pack contains 3 or 4 separate coils
with a common B + terminal. The other end of each coil
is connected to the EEC module. Inside the EEC
module, each coil is connected in series to a 100 mW
resistor (for current sensing) and a transistor that
connects the coil to ground.
Each ignition coil fires two spark plugs simultaneously:
• One spark plug on the compression stroke. This
spark plug uses the majority of the ignition coil
energy.
• One spark plug on the exhaust stroke. This spark
plug uses very little of the ignition coil stored energy.
Since these two spark plugs are connected in series:
• The firing voltage of one spark plug will be negative
with respect to ground.
• The voltage of the other will be positive with respect
to ground.
3. EDIS CPU (built into the EEC module). The EDIS CPU
processes the signals from the CKP sensor, and sends
a synthesised PIP signal to the EEC CPU. It receives
timing information from the EEC CPU and controls both
the spark timing and the coil dwell.
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Posted: Thu Aug 30, 2007 4:50 pm 
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Cheers Xpression :D.. i got the coil out today just waiting for a volt meter to check the resistance on it... thanks 4 the advice

 

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Posted: Thu Aug 30, 2007 8:09 pm 
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Update... Just checked the resistance on the coil pack and it seems to be ok... The primary resistance was supposed to be 0.6 ohm and its reading 0.8 to 0.7 and the secondary resistance it was supposed to be 9.2 k-ohms. It was ranging around 8.9 - 9.0 k-ohms. Seems to be in resonably close but does it have to be exact or is there room for error. Any idea's?

 

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Posted: Thu Aug 30, 2007 8:31 pm 
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Thats close enough, but coil testing by meter is only so good there can be problems that will only show up under load. If you can loan a pack from a mates car and test would be good or I suggest auto electrician. I f you have a mate thats willing to swap ECU for a test that would be good but you may have to pay an autoelectrician. Check if there are any codes being given by the ECU

 

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Posted: Thu Aug 30, 2007 8:42 pm 
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falconea wrote:
Thats close enough, but coil testing by meter is only so good there can be problems that will only show up under load. If you can loan a pack from a mates car and test would be good or I suggest auto electrician. I f you have a mate thats willing to swap ECU for a test that would be good but you may have to pay an autoelectrician. Check if there are any codes being given by the ECU

Codes was my next step morro. Starting to get p****d off :@

 

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Posted: Thu Aug 30, 2007 8:57 pm 
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Know the feeling Good luck

 

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Posted: Fri Aug 31, 2007 2:24 pm 
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Wat is the worst case scenario with my prob? Could it be more then electical? Valve or something like that?? Still no spark from 5&6..

 

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Posted: Fri Aug 31, 2007 3:30 pm 
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Is it possible for you to do a compression check on 5 & 6.
I was just thinking if there was a head gasket broken between cylinders 5 & 6 there would be no compression and hence no spark, as it requires compression to make the coil spark. Just a thought. Unlikely a valve problem on 2 cylinders.

 

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