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Oil burning problem 

 

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 Post subject: Oil burning problem
Posted: Mon Dec 27, 2010 10:33 pm 
Getting Side Ways
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well i rebuild my EL XR6 motor about 60,000 ago and i just move to brisbane from geelong. now from geelong to brisbane my oil was full when i left cause i top it up to the full mark. i left at 9.30pm that night and got there around 6.30pm the next day. the next morning i check the oil dip stick and all there was on it was a dap of oil on it. im really annoyed about this cause did a compression test a week after i started it up from the rebuild and also 2 weeks ago and both were 195 in all cylinders. there int any oil leaks so that counts that out. so if anyone got any ideas what it might be it be very helpful or i might have to gt it built again?
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 Post subject: Re: Oil burning problem
Posted: Tue Dec 28, 2010 10:10 am 
Getting Side Ways
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Could be leaking sump or maybe the rear main seal is leaking? The rear main seals on E series did leak a lot and they improved the seal towards the end of EFs, maybe you have an earlier seal or an after market one from a gasket kit? Might also pay to check around where the oil filter is as it might have been put on with the seal dry?
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 Post subject: Re: Oil burning problem
Posted: Tue Dec 28, 2010 10:57 pm 
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so if its leaking out the rear main seal i would be able to see oil spots on the ground but there hasn't been any oil on the ground or can it just leak when the car is running under pressure and get blow back on the gearbox?
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 Post subject: Re: Oil burning problem
Posted: Wed Dec 29, 2010 12:02 am 
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If no leaks check if its spitting oil up the breather and into the intake?? Can happen especially if you rev it hard
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 Post subject: Re: Oil burning problem
Posted: Wed Dec 29, 2010 12:14 am 
Parts Gopher
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Ok a bit of a long shot but after lots of city driving, mostly short distances, when the engine is off, left over fuel can leak past the rings in the cylender small amounts at a time. the fuel then desolves the oil slowly, also filling the sump slowly as some oil is consumed making it look like you have more than you actually do. Then once you go on a long trip and have car running at highway speed for some time and having the engine hot for a long time this petrol/oil mix evaporates off and feeds its way through the PCV and gets burned. Leaving you with alot less oil. Its a long shot but it happens.

 

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 Post subject: Re: Oil burning problem
Posted: Wed Dec 29, 2010 2:37 pm 
Getting Side Ways
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well my brothers EF fairmont didnt use any oil driving from New Castle to Geelong. but mine use alot of oil driving from Geelong to Brisbane and its pretty much rebuilt motor with 60,000kms on it so im thinking the oil rings are s**t and havent seal properly. because the compression is still the same from when i rebuilt it.
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 Post subject: Re: Oil burning problem
Posted: Wed Dec 29, 2010 7:01 pm 
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valve stem guides & seals if comp figures are still the same--???
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 Post subject: Re: Oil burning problem
Posted: Wed Dec 29, 2010 7:23 pm 
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When are people going to learn that oil rings seal oil and compression rings do not.

A compression test will only give you an indication of how well pressure is being sealed are sealing in pressure. If you find a low reading a 'leak down' test will then show you how bad the leak is and where the leak is. Leakage points are rings, valves and head gaskets.


there really is now way to 'test' your oil rings. You could use a bore scope to look at the cylinder walls and check for damage glazing.

I would say you have glazed bores due to improper break-in.
The fact that you needed to top up the oil before you went on the trip indicates you had a problem to begin with. An engine of that age shouldn't be needing the oil to be topped up at all.


You could try Fuchs Cargo Max its a 10w40 synthetic heavy duty diesel oil, it has worked miracles on a number of the early toyota landcruiser V8s that had glazing issue due to poor bore finish.
No a diesel oil wont hurt your engine.

 

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 Post subject: Re: Oil burning problem
Posted: Thu Dec 30, 2010 1:01 am 
Getting Side Ways
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sorry forgot to add that i did a air leakage test the same time i did the compression test and the results were all the same in each bore.
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 Post subject: Re: Oil burning problem
Posted: Thu Dec 30, 2010 2:10 am 
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tickford_6 wrote:
When are people going to learn that oil rings seal oil and compression rings do not.

A compression test will only give you an indication of how well pressure is being sealed are sealing in pressure. If you find a low reading a 'leak down' test will then show you how bad the leak is and where the leak is. Leakage points are rings, valves and head gaskets.


there really is now way to 'test' your oil rings. You could use a bore scope to look at the cylinder walls and check for damage glazing.

I would say you have glazed bores due to improper break-in.
The fact that you needed to top up the oil before you went on the trip indicates you had a problem to begin with. An engine of that age shouldn't be needing the oil to be topped up at all.


You could try Fuchs Cargo Max its a 10w40 synthetic heavy duty diesel oil, it has worked miracles on a number of the early toyota landcruiser V8s that had glazing issue due to poor bore finish.
No a diesel oil wont hurt your engine.


Is the only hope for an engine with chronic blowby (fills a 500mL catch can in under 5 minutes) a rebuild? The engine in my brothers ute is blowing oil out the breathers like there is no tomorrow, and also pops the dipstick under load and sprays oil everywhere.

 

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 Post subject: Re: Oil burning problem
Posted: Thu Dec 30, 2010 6:30 am 
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67RCE wrote:
tickford_6 wrote:
When are people going to learn that oil rings seal oil and compression rings do not.

A compression test will only give you an indication of how well pressure is being sealed are sealing in pressure. If you find a low reading a 'leak down' test will then show you how bad the leak is and where the leak is. Leakage points are rings, valves and head gaskets.


there really is now way to 'test' your oil rings. You could use a bore scope to look at the cylinder walls and check for damage glazing.

I would say you have glazed bores due to improper break-in.
The fact that you needed to top up the oil before you went on the trip indicates you had a problem to begin with. An engine of that age shouldn't be needing the oil to be topped up at all.


You could try Fuchs Cargo Max its a 10w40 synthetic heavy duty diesel oil, it has worked miracles on a number of the early toyota landcruiser V8s that had glazing issue due to poor bore finish.
No a diesel oil wont hurt your engine.


Is the only hope for an engine with chronic blowby (fills a 500mL catch can in under 5 minutes) a rebuild? The engine in my brothers ute is blowing oil out the breathers like there is no tomorrow, and also pops the dipstick under load and sprays oil everywhere.



Plumb the catchcan into the sump and "reclaim" that oil. Thats chronic blowby for sure.

I would be 100% certain that a rebuild is the remedy. Damn it i cannot tell if you being serious, so I gave a littel from column "A" and a little from column "B" in my answer.

 

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 Post subject: Re: Oil burning problem
Posted: Thu Dec 30, 2010 1:46 pm 
Getting Side Ways
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dc_todd wrote:
67RCE wrote:
tickford_6 wrote:
When are people going to learn that oil rings seal oil and compression rings do not.

A compression test will only give you an indication of how well pressure is being sealed are sealing in pressure. If you find a low reading a 'leak down' test will then show you how bad the leak is and where the leak is. Leakage points are rings, valves and head gaskets.


there really is now way to 'test' your oil rings. You could use a bore scope to look at the cylinder walls and check for damage glazing.

I would say you have glazed bores due to improper break-in.
The fact that you needed to top up the oil before you went on the trip indicates you had a problem to begin with. An engine of that age shouldn't be needing the oil to be topped up at all.


You could try Fuchs Cargo Max its a 10w40 synthetic heavy duty diesel oil, it has worked miracles on a number of the early toyota landcruiser V8s that had glazing issue due to poor bore finish.
No a diesel oil wont hurt your engine.


Is the only hope for an engine with chronic blowby (fills a 500mL catch can in under 5 minutes) a rebuild? The engine in my brothers ute is blowing oil out the breathers like there is no tomorrow, and also pops the dipstick under load and sprays oil everywhere.



Plumb the catchcan into the sump and "reclaim" that oil. Thats chronic blowby for sure.

I would be 100% certain that a rebuild is the remedy. Damn it i cannot tell if you being serious, so I gave a littel from column "A" and a little from column "B" in my answer.

I'm serious, it's got a completely screwed bottom end, trying to con my brother into Spool rods and CP Pistons for the rebuild

 

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ILL60 - EF XR8, Sunroof, Ticky Kit, 19x8.5/19x11 TE37's, 347, AFr185's, TFS BoxRcustom converter, Hurst Quarterstick, huge billet cam.

51TER - DL LTD. Stock.

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 Post subject: Re: Oil burning problem
Posted: Thu Dec 30, 2010 2:12 pm 
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67RCE wrote:
dc_todd wrote:
67RCE wrote:
tickford_6 wrote:
When are people going to learn that oil rings seal oil and compression rings do not.

A compression test will only give you an indication of how well pressure is being sealed are sealing in pressure. If you find a low reading a 'leak down' test will then show you how bad the leak is and where the leak is. Leakage points are rings, valves and head gaskets.


there really is now way to 'test' your oil rings. You could use a bore scope to look at the cylinder walls and check for damage glazing.

I would say you have glazed bores due to improper break-in.
The fact that you needed to top up the oil before you went on the trip indicates you had a problem to begin with. An engine of that age shouldn't be needing the oil to be topped up at all.


You could try Fuchs Cargo Max its a 10w40 synthetic heavy duty diesel oil, it has worked miracles on a number of the early toyota landcruiser V8s that had glazing issue due to poor bore finish.
No a diesel oil wont hurt your engine.


Is the only hope for an engine with chronic blowby (fills a 500mL catch can in under 5 minutes) a rebuild? The engine in my brothers ute is blowing oil out the breathers like there is no tomorrow, and also pops the dipstick under load and sprays oil everywhere.



Plumb the catchcan into the sump and "reclaim" that oil. Thats chronic blowby for sure.

I would be 100% certain that a rebuild is the remedy. Damn it i cannot tell if you being serious, so I gave a littel from column "A" and a little from column "B" in my answer.

I'm serious, it's got a completely screwed bottom end, trying to con my brother into Spool rods and CP Pistons for the rebuild


Depending on what he intends on doing with it, If boosting then yeah I agree with your combo, if not, just get the stock rods shot peened and throw some flat top CP's in. If the rings are shot then the bore will need a hone at a minimum, but intil its inspected you will have no idea if you can go stock or oversized pistons depending on the amount of material to be removed.

As a last chance option to try and get the last out of it, try very heavy oil. but odds on the bearings are stuffed already as the oil would have been fueled up and diluted, Had this same issue on mine before my overbudget build. bearings were down to copper, bottom end had more slop than a cheap hooker on a long weekend. The head was about all that was salvaged.

Time for a rebuild, careful not to put 10k into your crank though! Sorry had to put it in.

 

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 Post subject: Re: Oil burning problem
Posted: Thu Dec 30, 2010 5:59 pm 
Oompa Loompa
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To the original question, how much oil did it take to get back to full from E? I reckon its only about half a litre, maybe a litre from full to empty by the dipstick on a falcon. Depending how you drove, its probably not as bad as you first think, considering at high revs engines do tend to use a little bit of oil.

Apart from that, dont say you have no oil leaks just because it isnt leaking on the ground, we get Falcons at work all the time that dont drip on the ground but are leaking from almost every place you can think of, front crank seal, rear main, sump, rocker cover, timing cover etc. it just doesnt get noticed.
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 Post subject: Re: Oil burning problem
Posted: Thu Dec 30, 2010 6:01 pm 
Getting Side Ways
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Age: 29

Posts: 4182

Joined: 30th May 2005

Ride: 1993 EB XR8

Location: BrisVegas
QLD, Australia

dc_todd wrote:
67RCE wrote:
dc_todd wrote:
67RCE wrote:
tickford_6 wrote:
When are people going to learn that oil rings seal oil and compression rings do not.

A compression test will only give you an indication of how well pressure is being sealed are sealing in pressure. If you find a low reading a 'leak down' test will then show you how bad the leak is and where the leak is. Leakage points are rings, valves and head gaskets.


there really is now way to 'test' your oil rings. You could use a bore scope to look at the cylinder walls and check for damage glazing.

I would say you have glazed bores due to improper break-in.
The fact that you needed to top up the oil before you went on the trip indicates you had a problem to begin with. An engine of that age shouldn't be needing the oil to be topped up at all.


You could try Fuchs Cargo Max its a 10w40 synthetic heavy duty diesel oil, it has worked miracles on a number of the early toyota landcruiser V8s that had glazing issue due to poor bore finish.
No a diesel oil wont hurt your engine.


Is the only hope for an engine with chronic blowby (fills a 500mL catch can in under 5 minutes) a rebuild? The engine in my brothers ute is blowing oil out the breathers like there is no tomorrow, and also pops the dipstick under load and sprays oil everywhere.



Plumb the catchcan into the sump and "reclaim" that oil. Thats chronic blowby for sure.

I would be 100% certain that a rebuild is the remedy. Damn it i cannot tell if you being serious, so I gave a littel from column "A" and a little from column "B" in my answer.

I'm serious, it's got a completely screwed bottom end, trying to con my brother into Spool rods and CP Pistons for the rebuild


Depending on what he intends on doing with it, If boosting then yeah I agree with your combo, if not, just get the stock rods shot peened and throw some flat top CP's in. If the rings are shot then the bore will need a hone at a minimum, but intil its inspected you will have no idea if you can go stock or oversized pistons depending on the amount of material to be removed.

As a last chance option to try and get the last out of it, try very heavy oil. but odds on the bearings are stuffed already as the oil would have been fueled up and diluted, Had this same issue on mine before my overbudget build. bearings were down to copper, bottom end had more slop than a cheap hooker on a long weekend. The head was about all that was salvaged.

Time for a rebuild, careful not to put 10k into your crank though! Sorry had to put it in.

my guess is that bearings are stuffed, it's fuelled up the bottom end a fair bit. It's going to get a wreckers engine until we pull down and rebuild the original motor. My old man thinks he knows alot and is trying to say just a re ring will solve the problem. He doesn't think it needs bearings or anything like that!

Also, my brother wants 15psi+ and 11sec passes, so T5 and AU rods are a no go, he needs a T56!

 

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