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Really Rich Idle after Head & Cam 

 

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 Post subject: Re: Really Rich Idle after Head & Cam
Posted: Fri Oct 30, 2009 7:30 am 
Oompa Loompa
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QLD, Australia

Yea to me it sounds a low. My BA has an idle vacuum of about 20In.Hg.
I ran out of time last night to test compression but i will do it this arvy. I have disconnected the battery to reset the computer and start fresh.

 

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 Post subject: Re: Really Rich Idle after Head & Cam
Posted: Fri Oct 30, 2009 6:29 pm 
Oompa Loompa
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Location: Charters Towers
QLD, Australia

Due to the compression gauge I borrowed i could only test the compression on the no 1 cylinder. It was 1100kpa which is ok according to the manual.
I still cant get the car to go into diagnostic mode to set the timing properly however I tried to advance and retard the timing and went for a drive.

The car loves to rev now and i can feel the improvement of the head and cam. But this idle is giving me the pox. its that rich that if it idles for too long while I'm testing it, it will foul the plugs.

 

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 Post subject: Re: Really Rich Idle after Head & Cam
Posted: Sat Oct 31, 2009 3:34 pm 
Oompa Loompa
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Location: Charters Towers
QLD, Australia

Update:

I finally got my car to go into diagnostic mode. Before it kept giving me code 67 which is A/C on or not in neutral. I shorted the neutral switch on the side of my T5 and now it giving me code 11 which is "no faults found".

I checked this timing and from when i was playing with it yesterday i allredy had it on the money. just a little advance from the ING mark.

So with timing elimanated now it back to "vacuum leak????????"

Just thinking now also. when i did my head i only put a short term exhaust gasket from a tube because i was going put extractors on after the head change. Would a leak on the exhaust headers cause it to run this rich and only really at idle??

 

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 Post subject: Re: Really Rich Idle after Head & Cam
Posted: Sat Oct 31, 2009 8:02 pm 
Oompa Loompa
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Power: 297 rwkw

Location: Charters Towers
QLD, Australia

Update:

Replaced Exhaust gasket and........................same old result. black smoke and low vacuum. About 14In.Hg from PCV/Fuel Reg and purge solenoid........................................................
..............................................................................................................sigh..............................

 

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 Post subject: Re: Really Rich Idle after Head & Cam
Posted: Sun Nov 01, 2009 12:33 pm 
Oompa Loompa
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Location: Charters Towers
QLD, Australia

When I pull the fuse for the fuel pump and it starts to lean out the vacuum increases to about 20in.hg before stalling.

So far as i know it's running rich to cause low vacuum that causes it to run rich in a vicious cycle. So what can cause it to run rich originally???? I put a hose on the fuel return line from the regulator into a bottle to rule out a blocked return line causing high fuel pressure but no luck.

I checked to see if i had a leaking injector and they all hold pressure.

What else could it be.

Fuel regulator?

 

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 Post subject: Re: Really Rich Idle after Head & Cam
Posted: Sun Nov 01, 2009 12:44 pm 
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its actually the other way around its the low vac thats making it run rich. vac increases and it leans out when the fuel pump fuse is pulled because the rpm rises befor it stalls..
try sucking the vacuum line to the map sensor while the engine is running, if the idle increases and smooths out its either a tired engine or i hate to say it maybe a cam related issue?
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 Post subject: Re: Really Rich Idle after Head & Cam
Posted: Sun Nov 01, 2009 9:29 pm 
Oompa Loompa
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Ride: EF Falcon GLi

Power: 297 rwkw

Location: Charters Towers
QLD, Australia

Ok righto. I will try that.

I hope it isn't a tired engine as it didn't skip a beat since i bought it (even tho it had a buggered head gasket). I will try the map sensor trick and post the results.
Thanks Troyman

 

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 Post subject: Re: Really Rich Idle after Head & Cam
Posted: Mon Nov 16, 2009 3:43 pm 
Parts Gopher
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hey beeksy, get the ute sorted?
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 Post subject: Re: Really Rich Idle after Head & Cam
Posted: Mon Nov 16, 2009 7:14 pm 
Getting Side Ways
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maybe this is why my EL is rich as hell on idle! i shall try the MAP sensor thing..

 

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 Post subject: Re: Really Rich Idle after Head & Cam
Posted: Mon Nov 16, 2009 8:47 pm 
Getting Side Ways
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as I said, the stage 2 or a 2a never run rich at idle, there always is another reason !! & they don't need ECU mods..... the stage 3 will, but as soon as you get it over 1200rpm the ecu will go back into close loop & have correct fuel control & then when you nail it, it will go into open loop & so on just how the ECU is ment to work

Brett when you get a chance give me a call

thanks
Joe
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 Post subject: Re: Really Rich Idle after Head & Cam
Posted: Tue Nov 17, 2009 12:20 am 
Getting Side Ways
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alfy wrote:
maybe this is why my EL is rich as hell on idle! i shall try the MAP sensor thing..


Alfy, dont worry about your map sensor as by replacing it won't make a difference assuming it is ok !!..... the stage 3 was deigned to still run with the factor computor but as it is right on the thresh hold with the map sensor for idle, but in saying that the ones that I have fitted dont produce black clouds of smoke at idle as some suggest..... with the stage 3 cam the idle speed control motor cant be used again, due to its lopy idle & the tps need to be modified as the idle need to be adjusted by the stop screw which then changes the tps voltage..... I've spent many hours getting the best combination with the stage 3 & making it run with our factory componets & what to modify to get them to work ......... I designed it, I know what & how it works...the problem here is some people buy stuff with lack of info or being mis informed ?? any one that buys a CMS cam from me gets told what they can & cann't do even in some case I don't recommed it & they still go & buy it.....I proudly stand beind all of my products in fact evey dyno comp that my set up cars entered win the 6 clyinder n/a dyno chalanage....

If you need to know about something call me

thanks

Joe
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 Post subject: Re: Really Rich Idle after Head & Cam
Posted: Thu Nov 19, 2009 11:51 am 
Oompa Loompa
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Ride: EF Falcon GLi

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Location: Charters Towers
QLD, Australia

Sorry for No updates. About a week and a half ago a replced the timing chain and chain guides and reset all the cogs to TDC. Well that afternoon the engine fan sheered off and went through my radiator so its been off the road for about a week. Its back now and back into trying to get it sorted. I took it to one of the mechanics and he had a listen and he couldn't pick too much (more of a carby mechanic and trans builder).
Also as symptoms go it has a small sort of a surging or drivline shunt when cruising about 60 that i never noticed before.
Yesterday i was playing with the timing and when i re set it it had onme hell of a lope at idlers the the vac guage was dipping from 14in.hg to about 10 with the lope. prob just part and parcel with the whole rich thing.

What are my chances the regulator is buggered. I haven't got a fuel pressure guage to test it but when I pull the regulator vac line off it doesn't change idle at all.

(as for trying the map sensor suck thing i haven't got the required suck to register 20 inhg for the map sensor to work)

is there a chance my ecu is just up to sh*t????

 

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All I want is less to do,
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and higher pay for not getting it done!

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 Post subject: Re: Really Rich Idle after Head & Cam
Posted: Thu Nov 19, 2009 8:26 pm 
Parts Gopher
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dam sounds like you've had a bad run, i know my ea changes slightly at idle when i take the vac line of the reg, try crimping the return line and the fuel line see if theres a change?? other wise find a good mechanic :lol: i know i have to my car is draining batt real quick, bloody cars!
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 Post subject: Re: Really Rich Idle after Head & Cam
Posted: Thu Nov 19, 2009 8:54 pm 
Oompa Loompa
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Age: 30

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Ride: EF Falcon GLi

Power: 297 rwkw

Location: Charters Towers
QLD, Australia

Yea there great...

Joe is sending me a 2a cam to rule out that the cam i got may have been mis stamped or something so this should hopefully rule out any cam related issues, fingers crossed

 

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All I want is less to do,
more time to do it,
and higher pay for not getting it done!

Just Remember
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arrange to have them beaten!!!

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 Post subject: Re: Really Rich Idle after Head & Cam
Posted: Sat Nov 21, 2009 7:57 pm 
Parts Gopher
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Location: brisbane
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hope you get to the bottom of this problem, thats good of joe to send another cam, really helps when they offer help, not like others, my cars being looked at monday sick off disconnecting the batt every time i leave it :(
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