Fordmods Logo

So my car runs rich as F**k... 

 

Page 1 of 1 [ 14 posts ] 

 
 Post subject: So my car runs rich as F**k...
Posted: Fri Feb 08, 2008 8:46 am 
Getting Side Ways
Offline

Age: 31

Posts: 1279

Joined: 5th Apr 2005

Gallery: 2 images

Ride: Toyota Supra RZ

Location: Burwood Nights
VIC, Australia

yo yo

I've just recently borrowed dans (dansedgli) wideband oxygen setup (innovate lm-1) and not suprisingly my car runs (still runs...) rich as F**k..

at idle it sounds around 15:1 and after its warmed up while cruising it hovers around 14.7 like its supposed to.. however as soon as i get say over 50% throttle it starts dropping down to say 13:1 and once the revs get up it drops down as far as 10:1

my cars an EBII with EL XR motor/ECU... whys it running so rich?

I noticed when it was cold it ran rich but once it warmed up it seemed okay so im ruling out coolant temp sensor...

I'm tempted to try to run it with a stocko fuel reg instead of the XR one, will this help ?
Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Fri Feb 08, 2008 9:18 am 
Getting Side Ways
Offline

Age: 34

Posts: 3406

Joined: 7th Feb 2005

Ride: AU2 Ute

Location: melbourne
VIC, Australia

MS2 will fix it.
Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Fri Feb 08, 2008 9:48 am 
Fordmods Junkie
Offline
User avatar

Age: 38

Posts: 5051

Joined: 5th Nov 2004

Ride: Kia Rio - 1.4L Auto

Power: 238 rwkw

Location: Westside
VIC, Australia

That is a *TAD* overly rich by XR ECU standards, but nothing out of the ordinary. WOT AFR's on an XR/Ghia ECU are usually somewhere between 11:1 and 10.5:1, so no problems there.

Putting a stock fuel reg wont fix the problem. The ECU will only pump more fuel in at WOT to make its mixtures right.

As Dan said, you need a tunable ECU to fix it.
Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Fri Feb 08, 2008 11:04 am 
Getting Side Ways
Offline

Age: 31

Posts: 1279

Joined: 5th Apr 2005

Gallery: 2 images

Ride: Toyota Supra RZ

Location: Burwood Nights
VIC, Australia

arm79 wrote:
That is a *TAD* overly rich by XR ECU standards, but nothing out of the ordinary. WOT AFR's on an XR/Ghia ECU are usually somewhere between 11:1 and 10.5:1, so no problems there.

Putting a stock fuel reg wont fix the problem. The ECU will only pump more fuel in at WOT to make its mixtures right.

As Dan said, you need a tunable ECU to fix it.


I thought these ecu's only used the hego on light cruising and stuff, i know when its cruising it dances around 14.7 and i thought that when u booted it they went off the fixed map in the ecu?

however, im going home this weekend so i will be able to get the usb to serial converter for the laptop and plug in the ms2 and play with it.

I might stick a stock reg on just to see if theres any difference at all, or possibly muck around with the knock sensor because to be honest i'm not 100% sure its connected properly.. and its not the best sensor to have to get access too but thinking about it now i can use the pit at home.. woo!
Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Fri Feb 08, 2008 4:34 pm 
Getting Side Ways
Offline
User avatar

Age: 32

Posts: 1833

Joined: 3rd May 2007

Gallery: 8 images

Ride: AUII XR6 Uterus

Location: South Coast
NSW, Australia

thats not out of the ordinary at all, you have to remember that ford eec can't cater for wideband so it does the best it can with a narrow band sensor and it's better running rich than lean..

 

_________________

Not to get technical, but according to chemistry alcohol is a solution.

Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Fri Feb 08, 2008 4:39 pm 
Fordmods Addict
Offline
User avatar

Age: 31

Posts: 7958

Joined: 1st Jun 2005

Gallery: 13 images

Ride: Falcon

Power: 237 rwkw

Location: Melbourne
VIC, Australia

glenneaux wrote:
arm79 wrote:
That is a *TAD* overly rich by XR ECU standards, but nothing out of the ordinary. WOT AFR's on an XR/Ghia ECU are usually somewhere between 11:1 and 10.5:1, so no problems there.

Putting a stock fuel reg wont fix the problem. The ECU will only pump more fuel in at WOT to make its mixtures right.

As Dan said, you need a tunable ECU to fix it.


I thought these ecu's only used the hego on light cruising and stuff, i know when its cruising it dances around 14.7 and i thought that when u booted it they went off the fixed map in the ecu?

however, im going home this weekend so i will be able to get the usb to serial converter for the laptop and plug in the ms2 and play with it.

I might stick a stock reg on just to see if theres any difference at all, or possibly muck around with the knock sensor because to be honest i'm not 100% sure its connected properly.. and its not the best sensor to have to get access too but thinking about it now i can use the pit at home.. woo!

Yeah thats right Glenn, but what it leanrs in closed loop it then uses to modify the open loop maps.
So if its running lean in closed loop and has to inject more fuel, it learns this and applies the correction to open loop as well.
Tricky s**t.
So if you run a non xr reg with the xr ecu, it will lean it out for awhile, but it will eventually learn around and get back to where you started, or worse.

 

_________________

ED XR8 Sprint - S-Trim, V500, 249rwkw
BF MKII F6 Tornado - 237rwkw

Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Fri Feb 08, 2008 9:51 pm 
Getting Side Ways
Offline
User avatar

Age: 51

Posts: 918

Joined: 6th Aug 2007

Gallery: 4 images

Ride: BA XR8

Location: Kellyville
NSW, Australia

Dansedgli wrote:
MS2 will fix it.
\
Hey,

My 4.0L is starting to run rich, which i have put down to a fuel pressure problem. Have you had any experience with MS2?? i was considering it, but i think i will go with a Stinger.

Cheers

8-) Daz 8-)

 

_________________

BA XR8 Boss 260
DAZFAB......Now Mobile
Mink = GAY
DAZFAB MEMBERS ,,,,DA22LE, XTT909, TERRORISTGHIA, TROYMAN, SWC, FAT245

Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Fri Feb 08, 2008 9:59 pm 
Getting Side Ways
Offline
User avatar

Posts: 3363

Joined: 27th Dec 2004

Gallery: 4 images

Ride: MCMXCV Falcon

Location: G town
VIC, Australia

you could try putting the new reg on then disconnecting the O2 sensor..

I was driving around for ages with no O2 (car had flat battery for ages so ECU was reset) the fuel econ was as good as normal..

be interesting to see what the base map is like

 

_________________

Image

Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Fri Feb 08, 2008 10:19 pm 
Stock as a Rock
Offline
User avatar

Age: 40

Posts: 140

Joined: 7th Jul 2007

Gallery: 21 images

Location: sidunee
NSW, Australia

i may be wrong but isnt above 13 to 1 getting lean and 12.2 to 12.6 being the optimal zone for power production.

 

_________________

bf xr6turbo siemens injectors, full plazmaman 800 hp intercooler kit, 5 inch cat and custom dual 2.5 inch zorst, billet flywheel with mal wood clutch kit, braided hoses, big brakes, 3.2L surge tank/w twin 044's rebuilt motor with forged and billet everything 420+ rwkw on 98. holden killer.

Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 12:49 am 
Getting Side Ways
Offline

Age: 31

Posts: 1279

Joined: 5th Apr 2005

Gallery: 2 images

Ride: Toyota Supra RZ

Location: Burwood Nights
VIC, Australia

bfhoon wrote:
i may be wrong but isnt above 13 to 1 getting lean and 12.2 to 12.6 being the optimal zone for power production.


hey mate 14.7 is stoichiometric

below that is rich , above that is lean

its the AFR, air fuel ratio so when its higher (more air than fuel) its lean and vice versa ;)

its slighty richer than 14.7 (so <147) that is optimal for power
Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Thu Feb 14, 2008 8:03 am 
Parts Gopher
Offline

Posts: 53

Joined: 13th Nov 2004

Location: Sydney
NSW, Australia

The standard EF/EL fuel pressure regulator will drop the pressure down a little.
Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Thu Feb 14, 2008 8:53 am 
Moderator
Offline

Posts: 14513

Joined: 7th Nov 2004

Ride: ford falcon au3 xr8

Location: a shit suburb in sydney
NSW, Australia

glenneaux wrote:
bfhoon wrote:
i may be wrong but isnt above 13 to 1 getting lean and 12.2 to 12.6 being the optimal zone for power production.


hey mate 14.7 is stoichiometric

below that is rich , above that is lean

its the AFR, air fuel ratio so when its higher (more air than fuel) its lean and vice versa ;)

its slighty richer than 14.7 (so <147) that is optimal for power



that makes me wonder about my air fuel ratio..
on my dyno run at about 6o km the af ratio starts at about 15 when it gets to about 85 km the afr drops to 13.5 and keeps droping at 140 km the arf is at about 11.3 then it fluctuates from 11.3 to 11.7 untill 180km.
does this seem out of whack..??

60km@ wot= 15
85km@ wot= 13.5
140km@wot=11.3
180km@wot=11.7

how is this measured??
is it (eg)13.5 parts oxigine to 1 part petrol??
Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Thu Feb 14, 2008 6:44 pm 
Fordmods Addict
Offline
User avatar

Age: 31

Posts: 7958

Joined: 1st Jun 2005

Gallery: 13 images

Ride: Falcon

Power: 237 rwkw

Location: Melbourne
VIC, Australia

AFR is air to petrol yes, so 14.7 to 1 is 14.7 parts to 1 part fuel.
Thats prefectly normal for a stock ECU troyman, every single E-Series I've seen does pretty much the exact same thing.

 

_________________

ED XR8 Sprint - S-Trim, V500, 249rwkw
BF MKII F6 Tornado - 237rwkw

Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Thu Feb 14, 2008 8:42 pm 
Moderator
Offline

Posts: 14513

Joined: 7th Nov 2004

Ride: ford falcon au3 xr8

Location: a shit suburb in sydney
NSW, Australia

cheers thanks steady
Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:
Sort by  
 Page 1 of 1  [ 14 posts ] 

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 22 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

 

 

It is currently Thu Dec 14, 2017 12:36 am All times are UTC + 11 hours

 

 

(c)2014 Total Web Solutions Australia - Australian Web Hosting and Domain Names