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timing chain rattle 

 

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 Post subject: timing chain rattle
Posted: Fri Jul 04, 2008 9:56 pm 
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have we worked out what is the main cause

im doing the reasearch and planning on a rebuild...

im going to be taking a fair bit off the deck and head and am concerned if this is going to cause chain rattle

also why does it seem to affect cars with aftermarket cams mostly ?

 

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Posted: Fri Jul 04, 2008 11:09 pm 
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i just did mine and it ratles when i first start... wtf
the self tenchiner dont work to good...

 

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 Post subject: Re: timing chain rattle
Posted: Sat Jul 05, 2008 12:25 pm 
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gogetta wrote:
have we worked out what is the main cause

im doing the reasearch and planning on a rebuild...

im going to be taking a fair bit off the deck and head and am concerned if this is going to cause chain rattle

also why does it seem to affect cars with aftermarket cams mostly ?


The timing chain tensioner mechanism consists of a spring and oil pressure along with a stepped wear retensioning mechanism.

The aftermarket cams normally have a bigger than standard profile creating greater lift, holding the tension on the chain requires a greater spring tension to counter this effect.

Otherwise the guides on the side and bottom are worn/damaged.

 

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Posted: Sat Jul 05, 2008 8:20 pm 
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by rattle, you mean you can hear rattley metal? or the engine shakes?

 

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Posted: Sat Jul 05, 2008 11:09 pm 
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fiftyone wrote:
by rattle, you mean you can hear rattley metal? or the engine shakes?


no you can here the chain rattling against the guides....youll know it when u hear it, fairly common

 

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Posted: Sat Jul 05, 2008 11:51 pm 
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so where would you get a heavier spring for the tensioner and how are you to no how much heavier to ask for
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Posted: Sun Jul 06, 2008 5:32 am 
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pettsy351 wrote:
so where would you get a heavier spring for the tensioner and how are you to no how much heavier to ask for


Good question, I dont think they make one, however I have found a suitable spring and created a double spring to act on the tensioner, i got the original spring and took it to a spring manufacturer and found one to suit.

I never really tried it but the theory was good.

The other solution is to replace the guides, tensioner shoe and cam chain may solve the problem as the load of all the new s**t may keep enough tension for sometime. maybe a few years.

 

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Posted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 2:27 pm 
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thanx for that
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Posted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 8:59 pm 
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I dont think that a spring is going to help at all because isnt the tensiioner controlled by oil pressure....the spring is there to hold it in place at startup

 

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 Post subject: Re: timing chain rattle
Posted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 9:15 pm 
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gogetta wrote:
have we worked out what is the main cause

im doing the reasearch and planning on a rebuild...

im going to be taking a fair bit off the deck and head and am concerned if this is going to cause chain rattle

also why does it seem to affect cars with aftermarket cams mostly ?


the best thing you can do is use hi compression pistons and not shave the head as much.
all new timing set- chain, guides and tensioner.

and don't use JMM cams shafts

 

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Posted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 9:17 pm 
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gogetta wrote:
I dont think that a spring is going to help at all because isnt the tensiioner controlled by oil pressure....the spring is there to hold it in place at startup


True But how much pressure is being produced by the oil, and how much bleedoff is there ?, Im not sure myself.

 

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Posted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 9:33 pm 
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opto wrote:
gogetta wrote:
I dont think that a spring is going to help at all because isnt the tensiioner controlled by oil pressure....the spring is there to hold it in place at startup


True But how much pressure is being produced by the oil, and how much bleedoff is there ?, Im not sure myself.


ahell of alot more then the spring could ever hope do.

the tensioner is feed by the same gallies that feed the head. this intern if feed from the same gallies that feed the crank. IF there was that much bleed off the rocker gear would starve for oil.
that i can assure you of. I've seen it happen.
the head gaskets can leak oil from the oil feed at the front of the deck, it leaks into the timing cover so you never see it. but it ends up starving the rocker gear of oil and killing all the HLAs.

 

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 Post subject: Re: timing chain rattle
Posted: Mon Aug 11, 2008 2:03 am 
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tickford_6 wrote:
gogetta wrote:
have we worked out what is the main cause

im doing the reasearch and planning on a rebuild...

im going to be taking a fair bit off the deck and head and am concerned if this is going to cause chain rattle

also why does it seem to affect cars with aftermarket cams mostly ?


the best thing you can do is use hi compression pistons and not shave the head as much.
all new timing set- chain, guides and tensioner.

and don't use JMM cams shafts


Can someone explain to me WHY JMM's camshafts seem to cause this problem?

I've got a full DEV 5 set-up ...and recently had 2 chain guides replaced cos of bad wear resulting in chain rattle (timing cover was worn too) ...but now the rattle seems to have come back ...and I get an annoying ticking sound at idle that seems to be coming from the bottom of the car AND the engine between the Rocker cover and BBM?

NOTE: Can't be the lifters ...had all of those replaced last week.

 

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Posted: Tue Aug 12, 2008 8:50 am 
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what most people think is a rattle is in fact the injectors doing there thing.

some extractors can also produce a type of noise that sounds like ticking,,its not unusual and in most cases is not harmful.

the timing chain tensioner is feed by a special regulator type thing in the front of the block,it is designed to maintain oil pressure in the adjuster and the spring is just there to apply pressure when the motor is not running.

from experience the rattle we all get and I've heard right through from ea to Au is just something we have to put with.

we have auto adjusting tappets and they are not solid thus the ticking noise on start up.
once filled up the noise should go away,if it don't then you have problems.

 

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Posted: Mon Aug 18, 2008 4:59 pm 
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I had the DEV5 cam/head package and had the same rattle. I changed back to the stock cam (xr) no rattle, changed back to DEV5, got the rattle back and finnally went to my current lumpy surecam cam, which has no rattle. No other changes were made.

Just my 2 cents.

 

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