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Timing Info 

 

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 Post subject: Timing Info
Posted: Tue Dec 30, 2008 11:26 am 
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Hi alJust curious, if I advance the timing in my ED Mont, will the revs increase or decrease .. and also how much should I advance it?

I have done now what i think is advancing it but it doesnt seem to really pull much harder if at all its hard to tell it would only be a minute difference. It just seems to make the revs hang?

Cheers for any help in advance

Jamo
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Posted: Tue Dec 30, 2008 11:56 am 
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Advancing the timing won't necessarily change revs (as the ECU controls idle anyway). You should only advance the timing by ~5 degrees, if you go to far, you will notice the engine will sound louder but not make anymore power (it will be knocking).

As for the difference, it will most likely be minute, we aren't talking alot of power gains here. Also, only do so if you're running high octane fuel (as in >95 octane, or LPG).

Hope this helps.

 

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Posted: Tue Dec 30, 2008 11:59 am 
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poita wrote:
Advancing the timing won't necessarily change revs (as the ECU controls idle anyway). You should only advance the timing by ~5 degrees, if you go to far, you will notice the engine will sound louder but not make anymore power (it will be knocking).

As for the difference, it will most likely be minute, we aren't talking alot of power gains here. Also, only do so if you're running high octane fuel (as in >95 octane, or LPG).

Hope this helps.
I already run 98 octane fuel and i havent got to the pinging stage yet, I was just curious as to how you would tell what 5 degrees is as there are no degree markings on there. Just the IGN and TDC marks. Also am I to assume that because these motors IGN is before TDC (to the left) that the further to the left i go the more advanced? or Is that retarding the timing ??

Thanks again

Jamo
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Posted: Tue Dec 30, 2008 12:11 pm 
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As the crank runs in a clockwise motion, yes, moving the mark (as seen with a timing light) to the left is advance.

As for the angle, get a piece of string, put a mark on it, line said mark up with the timing mark on the harmonic balancer, wrap the string around and make another mark at the other end of the string at the timing mark also. Now some simple maths is needed.

Measure the distance between the marks, this is the full circle, ie, it's 360 degrees. divide the measurement by 360 then multiply it by 5 or whatever the advance you want is.
Now, mark, from one of the 2 end marks, the derived length.
Wrap the string around the harmonic balancer again and put a dot of white-out on the balancer where the calculated mark lines up (remember that this needs to be on the RIGHT of the timing mark as this will become the new "TDC").

Put the ECU into diagnostic mode, wait for the computer to go into timing mode, and line the new mark up as if it were TDC.

Hope this makes sense.

 

_________________

Is the noise in my head bothering you? Because the noise in yours is annoying the s**t out of me.
El Futura Wagon - LPG, Wade 1636, Pacy 4499s, hi-flow cat, 2.5" Redback catback, mild shift kit, Sony HU, VDO 100WRMS Splits, Pioneer 30WRMS Coaxs, Pioneer 12" sub, Audioline 300WPMPO amp.

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Posted: Tue Dec 30, 2008 12:17 pm 
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poita wrote:
As the crank runs in a clockwise motion, yes, moving the mark (as seen with a timing light) to the left is advance.

As for the angle, get a piece of string, put a mark on it, line said mark up with the timing mark on the harmonic balancer, wrap the string around and make another mark at the other end of the string at the timing mark also. Now some simple maths is needed.

Measure the distance between the marks, this is the full circle, ie, it's 360 degrees. divide the measurement by 360 then multiply it by 5 or whatever the advance you want is.
Now, mark, from one of the 2 end marks, the derived length.
Wrap the string around the harmonic balancer again and put a dot of white-out on the balancer where the calculated mark lines up (remember that this needs to be on the RIGHT of the timing mark as this will become the new "TDC").

Put the ECU into diagnostic mode, wait for the computer to go into timing mode, and line the new mark up as if it were TDC.

Hope this makes sense.
Yer mate makes sense thanks, but i was under the impression that you need to time it in line with the IGN mark not the TDC mark as the 4.0i motors are timed at about 7 degrees BTDC IIRC. So that new mark should be to the left of both TDC and IGN mark on the motor, no ?

Thank you again in advance for your helpful info

Jamo
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Posted: Tue Dec 30, 2008 12:28 pm 
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Yes, that's right. I was thinking it was an EL (mine only has one mark on the timing cover). Anyway, yes, line the new mark on the balancer up with the IGN mark.

 

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Is the noise in my head bothering you? Because the noise in yours is annoying the s**t out of me.
El Futura Wagon - LPG, Wade 1636, Pacy 4499s, hi-flow cat, 2.5" Redback catback, mild shift kit, Sony HU, VDO 100WRMS Splits, Pioneer 30WRMS Coaxs, Pioneer 12" sub, Audioline 300WPMPO amp.

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Posted: Tue Dec 30, 2008 12:30 pm 
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ok thanks for your info. With the mild cam in it and the T5 i was just trying to get that little bit extra pull, spose it doesnt really matter lol. You have been a great help. I usually know what im talking about and end up being right in the 1st place but its always a great hepl to just double check and make sure ... Thanks heaps

Jamo
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Posted: Tue Dec 30, 2008 1:25 pm 
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the second mark on the ed timing cover marked ign is 10 deg btdc.
that is the std point of adjustment for ea to ed..
you can go furthur if you like..i got a aftermarket cam and mine is at aprox 14 deg btdc but to far and it will loose top end power and will ping...
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Posted: Tue Dec 30, 2008 1:31 pm 
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TROYMAN wrote:
the second mark on the ed timing cover marked ign is 10 deg btdc.
that is the std point of adjustment for ea to ed..
you can go furthur if you like..i got a aftermarket cam and mine is at aprox 14 deg btdc but to far and it will loose top end power and will ping...
yer i have a stage 1 crow cam in mine too and now have it set around the same. I run 98 octane too and would retard it a tad if it began to ping :)

ta

Jamo
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