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Where should i set my vernier cam gear 

 

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 Post subject: Where should i set my vernier cam gear
Posted: Mon Apr 11, 2011 10:02 pm 
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As the topic states im wondering where I should be setting my vernier cam wheel. Long story short... Im about to get the car tuned for the first time since ive owned it, i know i have and RPD6 cam..(cant find any specs on it) and a cam wheel set at 2deg???? 2 notches advanced.

can anyone shed any light on the what, where and why i should be setting it? I want to see how much I can get out of this engine without spending any $$$ except tuning, as I am in process of building turbo engine on the side.

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 Post subject: Re: Where should i set my vernier cam gear
Posted: Mon Apr 11, 2011 10:12 pm 
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izedso wrote:
As the topic states im wondering where I should be setting my vernier cam wheel. Long story short... Im about to get the car tuned for the first time since ive owned it, i know i have and RPD6 cam..(cant find any specs on it) and a cam wheel set at 2deg???? 2 notches advanced.

can anyone shed any light on the what, where and why i should be setting it? I want to see how much I can get out of this engine without spending any $$$ except tuning, as I am in process of building turbo engine on the side.

Thanks


From what I know...each notch is actually 2 degrees, so 2 notches is 4 degrees advanced/retarded. Besides that I can't help you out.

My memory is shot, but I think R6 cam may need to advance cam by 2 degrees, not 4? But I can't remember...someone else will fill you in on that.

 

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 Post subject: Re: Where should i set my vernier cam gear
Posted: Mon Apr 11, 2011 10:26 pm 
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phongus wrote:
From what I know...each notch is actually 2 degrees, so 2 notches is 4 degrees advanced/retarded. Besides that I can't help you out.

My memory is shot, but I think R6 cam may need to advance cam by 2 degrees, not 4? But I can't remember...someone else will fill you in on that.


Not on mine it isn't. each mark is a degree. Put a protractor on and see what they are i guess?

 

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 Post subject: Re: Where should i set my vernier cam gear
Posted: Mon Apr 11, 2011 10:28 pm 
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Thanks Phongus, from reading old threads I think what I really need is some specs on the cam before I can make any changes.
Soooooo...... Pleeease HELP!!!!!! I know RPD hav'nt done regrinds in a few years but someone somewhere must know.

 

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 Post subject: Re: Where should i set my vernier cam gear
Posted: Mon Apr 11, 2011 10:46 pm 
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send "jaysen" a pm, he might be able to help you out with the old rpd cam specs
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 Post subject: Re: Where should i set my vernier cam gear
Posted: Tue Apr 12, 2011 12:05 pm 
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shyun wrote:
phongus wrote:
From what I know...each notch is actually 2 degrees, so 2 notches is 4 degrees advanced/retarded. Besides that I can't help you out.

My memory is shot, but I think R6 cam may need to advance cam by 2 degrees, not 4? But I can't remember...someone else will fill you in on that.


Not on mine it isn't. each mark is a degree. Put a protractor on and see what they are i guess?


Yeah not all of them...I know crow vernier gears have 2 degrees per notch.

 

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 Post subject: Re: Where should i set my vernier cam gear
Posted: Tue Apr 12, 2011 5:50 pm 
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if your getting it tuned the idea would be to tune the cam timing while your at it to best suit your needs. adjusting it will basically set what part of the rev range the cam will 'peak' at.. which is noticable by the seat of your pants-o-meter but best configured through tuning to gain the best overall effects from the cam.

 

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 Post subject: Re: Where should i set my vernier cam gear
Posted: Tue Apr 12, 2011 6:47 pm 
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get in contact with the RPD guys, i'm pretty sure they still use the forum, or profiles will still have email.

You would be looking for a Lift @ TDC spec. From there while on the dyno you can go 2 and 4 degrees in both directions to see how it affects the power curve.

 

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 Post subject: Re: Where should i set my vernier cam gear
Posted: Tue Apr 12, 2011 6:58 pm 
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I just used the search function, and you know what i found.

The same question was asked a while back. (search results had it half way down the first page of results)

Quote:
OK, TDC should be when intake is open 40 thou, your probably looking for about 3 degrees adv. but measure it properly


So you 40thou valve lift at TDC.
If you don't a solid checking lifter, you can set the dial gauge on top the roller and set it to 20thou of roller lift at TDC.
OR
you can set the dial gauge in the bleed hole in the tip of the rocker arm and use 40thou of rocker lift.


DO NOT put the dial gauge on the top of the retainer and measure 40thou of actual vlave lift.
Being hydraulic the HLA WILL bleed down and you will not get accurate measurement.

 

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 Post subject: Re: Where should i set my vernier cam gear
Posted: Tue Apr 12, 2011 11:16 pm 
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tickford_6 wrote:
I just used the search function, and you know what i found.

The same question was asked a while back. (search results had it half way down the first page of results)

Quote:
OK, TDC should be when intake is open 40 thou, your probably looking for about 3 degrees adv. but measure it properly


So you 40thou valve lift at TDC.
If you don't a solid checking lifter, you can set the dial gauge on top the roller and set it to 20thou of roller lift at TDC.
OR
you can set the dial gauge in the bleed hole in the tip of the rocker arm and use 40thou of rocker lift.


DO NOT put the dial gauge on the top of the retainer and measure 40thou of actual vlave lift.
Being hydraulic the HLA WILL bleed down and you will not get accurate measurement.



Cheers, Thanks.
@Lowrider I know what your saying, but the car feels pretty responsive already but im looking for some more technical info i can give to my tuner.

@tickford6 i would get in contact with the rpd guys, but who are they? i tried finding out 4 yrs ago when i first got the car but got nowhere and gave up.
re: your search results... are they specific to my cam? because "
So you 40thou valve lift at TDC." does not make a lot of sense to me.... but then again im no mechanic... just a humble TA trying to learn

 

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 Post subject: Re: Where should i set my vernier cam gear
Posted: Tue Apr 12, 2011 11:40 pm 
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izedso wrote:
tickford_6 wrote:
I just used the search function, and you know what i found.

The same question was asked a while back. (search results had it half way down the first page of results)

Quote:
OK, TDC should be when intake is open 40 thou, your probably looking for about 3 degrees adv. but measure it properly


So you 40thou valve lift at TDC.
If you don't a solid checking lifter, you can set the dial gauge on top the roller and set it to 20thou of roller lift at TDC.
OR
you can set the dial gauge in the bleed hole in the tip of the rocker arm and use 40thou of rocker lift.


DO NOT put the dial gauge on the top of the retainer and measure 40thou of actual vlave lift.
Being hydraulic the HLA WILL bleed down and you will not get accurate measurement.



Cheers, Thanks.
@Lowrider I know what your saying, but the car feels pretty responsive already but im looking for some more technical info i can give to my tuner.

@tickford6 i would get in contact with the rpd guys, but who are they? i tried finding out 4 yrs ago when i first got the car but got nowhere and gave up.
re: your search results... are they specific to my cam? because "
So you 40thou valve lift at TDC." does not make a lot of sense to me.... but then again im no mechanic... just a humble TA trying to learn


That info is specific to the RPD R6 cam.
A while back i was going to buy all of his cams. he had about 6 or so of various grinds. But i just didn't have the spare cash.

 

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 Post subject: Re: Where should i set my vernier cam gear
Posted: Wed Apr 13, 2011 12:07 am 
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Quote:
That info is specific to the RPD R6 cam.
A while back i was going to buy all of his cams. he had about 6 or so of various grinds. But i just didn't have the spare cash.


Thanks heaps, that will give me a positive baseline to start with. I'm guessing you dont have any other data such as lift, duration etc?

Thanks again.

 

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 Post subject: Re: Where should i set my vernier cam gear
Posted: Wed Apr 13, 2011 12:15 am 
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izedso wrote:
i would get in contact with the rpd guys, but who are they?



thats why i said to contact "jaysen" he is or i should say was one of the rpd guys...
or pm "justfordima" or "mitchg911" these guys were rpd.. they still get online from time to time...
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 Post subject: Re: Where should i set my vernier cam gear
Posted: Wed Apr 13, 2011 12:35 am 
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TROYMAN wrote:
izedso wrote:
i would get in contact with the rpd guys, but who are they?



thats why i said to contact "jaysen" he is or i should say was one of the rpd guys...
or pm "justfordima" or "mitchg911" these guys were rpd.. they still get online from time to time...


thanks troyman, out of those 3 mitchg911 is the only one posted since mid last yr so i have sent a pm and hopefully he has some specs.

 

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 Post subject: Re: Where should i set my vernier cam gear
Posted: Thu Apr 14, 2011 8:53 pm 
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tickford_6 has given the pertinent info for tuning that cam - his info - ie. 40 thou at TDC will make sense to a real mechanic / tuner.

The markings on the cam gear are only relevant to making changes FROM the specified baseline - and the changes don't need to be to the whole divisions - in fact tiny changes can make significant difference.

You COULD just biff it on and try going thru the range up to a couple of degrees each way (don't for heavens sake go more than 4 degrees unless you want bent valves - and even then only 2 would be safer) - and the effectiveness of that is not something I'm willing to poo poo out of hand - but the BEST way to do it is to have it set up to the specified setting and then work from there.

My background in this?: I'm not a motor mechanic but an Aircraft Engineer - so jets are really my thing but car engines seem fairly straight forward... My work car / fun machine has always been a Falcon. I have a JMM cam which is specified to 39 thou at TDC which I've set a number of times over the years myself - and used in my old ED and now in my "new" EF. I started out running my ED std cam at one tooth advanced (roughly 4 degrees) in 1995 - result was great town performance but gutless above 4000 or so rpm - car drove like a VN Commondung (which is nothing to scoff at as they are very nimble in the bottom end - but go flat at 140 or so - which is when Falcon is usually just gettin interested) - and fuel consumption was FANTASTIC. I then went to the JMM cam etc.

 

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