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Variable Intermittent Wipers Into ED -- Help Needed!!! 

 

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 Post subject: Variable Intermittent Wipers Into ED -- Help Needed!!!
Posted: Thu Jan 21, 2010 6:15 pm 
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Hi All,

I'm doing a new mod into my ED, variable intermittent wipers.

I've set up a test sample on the work bench with a timer, wiper motor and home-made wiper switch and all works great, it will go in and just bypass the body module which operates both the intermittent and the park functions in the std system.

Now I'm building a timer for it from scratch to get the times and functionality I want (plus its way cheaper for only about 6 components). But to finalise the values for the time setting I first need to know about the EL variable knob on the wiper stalk, so someone who has one (spare or not in a car would be ideal), hopefully they can help me out to finish my prototype.

Firstly the variable knob, does it click in stages or is it one continuous smooth turn?

Secondly, if it is smooth is there two or three wires coming from inside the wiper stalk up to the potentiometer inside the stalk. If it is a click one it would be a rotary switch and I think there would be more wires (5 click one would be 6 wires)?

Thirdly, if you have a multimeter would you get an ohms reading of the potentiometer (if it is smooth operation) by measuring between the wires that come out, if there is only two wires then you'll need to turn the knob all the way one way to obtain the max reading (Im hoping for around 100k ohms) if it is three wires than you will measure three resistances (A-B, B-C, A-C), the two smaller ones should add to give roughly the big one, and that's what I need).

If someone can get me this info I can make up the PCB for the timer and just work with a bought rotary switch or potentiometer to get it all fine tuned... Then I'll buy the steering column and fit that and adapt the clock spring and cruise buttons and see how I go... It should all work (minus the air bag) and it'll hopefully be something no one else has done and I'll write a tech doc for those interested.

Like I said so far for the test sample on the bench works great... took heaps of tracing out (as I had no idea how the park function worked) and now I've drawing I've made of the circuit diagrams everywhere... None the less now it works and my dummy timer does too... Just trying to finalise it.

Thanks,
Tim

 

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93 Red ED 5spd Manual Build Thread

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 Post subject: Re: Variable Intermittent Wipers Into ED -- Help Needed!!!
Posted: Fri Jan 22, 2010 10:27 pm 
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Nobody out there who can help?

Cheers...

 

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93 Red ED 5spd Manual Build Thread

Performance: Complete AUII VCT Wiring & Power Train, Pacey Headers, 2.5" Exhaust, Exedy Clutch, DBA Rotors
Visuals: FG XR Wheel, XR Front, 17's, BA 5 Spd Shifter, BA Ghia Window Switches, NL Cluster
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 Post subject: Re: Variable Intermittent Wipers Into ED -- Help Needed!!!
Posted: Sat Jan 23, 2010 12:06 am 
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hmmm very interested in this but i Cant help as im in WA :( Would like to see how it finishes tho :)

 

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 Post subject: Re: Variable Intermittent Wipers Into ED -- Help Needed!!!
Posted: Sat Jan 23, 2010 8:22 am 
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Mate i will try and give you a little bit of help. In my EF the wiper stalk has 5 clicks for the time delay and there is only 2 wires coming from the switch inside the wiper stalk.

Hope this helps you a little bit
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 Post subject: Re: Variable Intermittent Wipers Into ED -- Help Needed!!!
Posted: Sat Jan 23, 2010 9:23 am 
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el_747 wrote:
Mate i will try and give you a little bit of help. In my EF the wiper stalk has 5 clicks for the time delay and there is only 2 wires coming from the switch inside the wiper stalk.

Hope this helps you a little bit


ah ha... now we are getting somewhere... thanks very much...

If it is not in the car or you can easily access it (as I don't wanna be a pain in bum)... but can you stick an ohmmeter across the two wires and measure it on all the clicks, maybe it has a resistor network built in...

IS anybody aware whether EF an EL combo switches are different or identical?

ELUZION wrote:
hmmm very interested in this but i Cant help as im in WA :( Would like to see how it finishes tho :)


I'll be doing up a tech doc on it so that everyone can see or make one... I'll make up the timers for those who want one and can they can wire them in how the see fit...

I'm making up patch harnesses to go in series with existing harnesses... Reason being that if something ever goes wrong when your in the middle of nowhere you can unplug where it goes into the two body looms (both easily accessible from drivers footwell) and plug the original looms back together and use the original system again through the body module... Just a nice safety feature...

All my system will do is bypass the body module (a small loom to bypass it) and a timer in my loom to time the intermittent. As above only intermittent and park require the body module, slow and fast speeds will work without the body module... So all i needed was a relay with an 87a contact a timer to trigger it and it works great...

Thanks for the help guys...

 

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93 Red ED 5spd Manual Build Thread

Performance: Complete AUII VCT Wiring & Power Train, Pacey Headers, 2.5" Exhaust, Exedy Clutch, DBA Rotors
Visuals: FG XR Wheel, XR Front, 17's, BA 5 Spd Shifter, BA Ghia Window Switches, NL Cluster
Tunes: 8" Pioneer Sub, JBL Speakers, Clarion Double DIN Headunit

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 Post subject: Re: Variable Intermittent Wipers Into ED -- Help Needed!!!
Posted: Sat Jan 23, 2010 12:36 pm 
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ok cool... thanks ash... just so that if I set these up for one type of combo switch they suit all types...

 

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93 Red ED 5spd Manual Build Thread

Performance: Complete AUII VCT Wiring & Power Train, Pacey Headers, 2.5" Exhaust, Exedy Clutch, DBA Rotors
Visuals: FG XR Wheel, XR Front, 17's, BA 5 Spd Shifter, BA Ghia Window Switches, NL Cluster
Tunes: 8" Pioneer Sub, JBL Speakers, Clarion Double DIN Headunit

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 Post subject: Re: Variable Intermittent Wipers Into ED -- Help Needed!!!
Posted: Sat Jan 23, 2010 12:47 pm 
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thats ok... I'll hopefully pick up a whole column soon and run an AU wheel and cruise buttons and clock spring so I don't have to keep replacing those expensive little pins the ED's use... plus then my cruise buttons won't fade anymore... I'll put my momo ED wheel away and keep it, might be worth big bucks one day seeing as though its in pretty good nic...

Cheers...

 

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93 Red ED 5spd Manual Build Thread

Performance: Complete AUII VCT Wiring & Power Train, Pacey Headers, 2.5" Exhaust, Exedy Clutch, DBA Rotors
Visuals: FG XR Wheel, XR Front, 17's, BA 5 Spd Shifter, BA Ghia Window Switches, NL Cluster
Tunes: 8" Pioneer Sub, JBL Speakers, Clarion Double DIN Headunit

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 Post subject: Re: Variable Intermittent Wipers Into ED -- Help Needed!!!
Posted: Sat Jan 23, 2010 1:17 pm 
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thats ok... was gonna with an EL ones coz I'd reckon they'd near be a direct fit and then I am guaranteed not to have any problems in case the combo switch or clock spring mounts different... And apparently EF, EL and AU wheels are interchangeable...

 

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93 Red ED 5spd Manual Build Thread

Performance: Complete AUII VCT Wiring & Power Train, Pacey Headers, 2.5" Exhaust, Exedy Clutch, DBA Rotors
Visuals: FG XR Wheel, XR Front, 17's, BA 5 Spd Shifter, BA Ghia Window Switches, NL Cluster
Tunes: 8" Pioneer Sub, JBL Speakers, Clarion Double DIN Headunit

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 Post subject: Re: Variable Intermittent Wipers Into ED -- Help Needed!!!
Posted: Sat Jan 23, 2010 1:25 pm 
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oh ok then I'll keep that mind...

yeah i like the blue momo wheels like this: http://cgi.ebay.com.au/FORD-MOMO-steeri ... 483913e49b

there is also one listed that has the buttons on it (the TE50 wheel) but I wouldn't have any use for the buttons so I don't see the bother...

Only some wheels take cruise buttons do they? a momo one would? Was there a momo airbag for the centre or something? or only the std on was used?

Cheers...

 

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93 Red ED 5spd Manual Build Thread

Performance: Complete AUII VCT Wiring & Power Train, Pacey Headers, 2.5" Exhaust, Exedy Clutch, DBA Rotors
Visuals: FG XR Wheel, XR Front, 17's, BA 5 Spd Shifter, BA Ghia Window Switches, NL Cluster
Tunes: 8" Pioneer Sub, JBL Speakers, Clarion Double DIN Headunit

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 Post subject: Re: Variable Intermittent Wipers Into ED -- Help Needed!!!
Posted: Sat Jan 23, 2010 1:42 pm 
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its not part of the horn? no airbags on ED... I thought to put the horn pad on it was part of the airbag, if I don't have to have one to mount the horn pad then I certainly wont... On EL's etc the cruise buttons are on the wheel not on the combo switch aren't they?

I paid $450 for my momo one on my ED in near great nic (bit faded but not split open) so 465 for a new one I thought was a reasonable buy (looks new anyway). Was there a "momo" horn pad or they just used the std ones (AU I assume as they are black?)

 

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93 Red ED 5spd Manual Build Thread

Performance: Complete AUII VCT Wiring & Power Train, Pacey Headers, 2.5" Exhaust, Exedy Clutch, DBA Rotors
Visuals: FG XR Wheel, XR Front, 17's, BA 5 Spd Shifter, BA Ghia Window Switches, NL Cluster
Tunes: 8" Pioneer Sub, JBL Speakers, Clarion Double DIN Headunit

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 Post subject: Re: Variable Intermittent Wipers Into ED -- Help Needed!!!
Posted: Sat Jan 23, 2010 6:04 pm 
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timmytimtim wrote:
but can you stick an ohmmeter across the two wires and measure it on all the clicks, maybe it has a resistor network built in...IS anybody aware whether EF an EL combo switches are different or identical?
I'll post the readings tomorrow if I remember.
EF/EL Combo setups are the same, only the colours are different. I think EF/EL stalks will also transfer onto the earlier combo setups - ask BenJ or Troyman on this.
EL's have speed sensitive setups too - only diff is a speed signal to the BEM. Not that I've noticed a big diff with them.

 

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 Post subject: Re: Variable Intermittent Wipers Into ED -- Help Needed!!!
Posted: Sat Jan 23, 2010 10:16 pm 
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ok cheers for that...

 

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93 Red ED 5spd Manual Build Thread

Performance: Complete AUII VCT Wiring & Power Train, Pacey Headers, 2.5" Exhaust, Exedy Clutch, DBA Rotors
Visuals: FG XR Wheel, XR Front, 17's, BA 5 Spd Shifter, BA Ghia Window Switches, NL Cluster
Tunes: 8" Pioneer Sub, JBL Speakers, Clarion Double DIN Headunit

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 Post subject: Re: Variable Intermittent Wipers Into ED -- Help Needed!!!
Posted: Sat Jan 23, 2010 10:25 pm 
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1--4.63kohm --->Longer interval
2--3.96kohm
3--2.70kohm
4--1.50kohm
5--0.83kohm --->shorter interval
The setup is basically a wiper arm which moves over a resistance card - the clicks are simply a spring loading.
You could use a 5 kohm pot to achieve the same thing electrically in this instance.

 

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 Post subject: Re: Variable Intermittent Wipers Into ED -- Help Needed!!!
Posted: Sun Jan 24, 2010 12:01 pm 
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ah ha... you're brilliant thanks very much... I'll adjust my capacitor and base resistor now to achieve the times I want, any idea what times these roughly achieve like maybe 1 sec through to 10 seconds in 2sec intervals?

You pulled it right apart to discover the resistance wire/card?

This isn't a spare you'd sell? I need something to test my dummy set up on the bench...

Thanks heaps...

 

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93 Red ED 5spd Manual Build Thread

Performance: Complete AUII VCT Wiring & Power Train, Pacey Headers, 2.5" Exhaust, Exedy Clutch, DBA Rotors
Visuals: FG XR Wheel, XR Front, 17's, BA 5 Spd Shifter, BA Ghia Window Switches, NL Cluster
Tunes: 8" Pioneer Sub, JBL Speakers, Clarion Double DIN Headunit

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 Post subject: Re: Variable Intermittent Wipers Into ED -- Help Needed!!!
Posted: Sun Jan 24, 2010 1:58 pm 
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this might not work very good now I crunch some numbers... I currently have it set up with a 100K pot and due to tolerances on the capacitor I get from 1 to 15 seconds time range. Because with a 555 timer to calculate time it is a straight multiplier equation the most I can get in terms of time differences is what ever the distance between the values in the stalk is which I can the most to be about 3 secs over 5 clicks...

I might have to go to a completely different type of timer that calcs its values differently using an exponential equation... anyone else out there good with electronics who can suggest a timer chip that I can use or maybe a different way of setting this up to get bigger time differences?

only way I can get around it is to use a massive capacitor to reverse the effects of how close the resistances are... a 2200uF with no base resistor will give me from 2 sec to 11 sec intervals (on paper) but due to tolerances with a value as big as 2200uF I could be looking at being drawn out to a minute, and it would never be constant (every timer would be different) as it is a tolerance... Unlike resistors with a 1% tolerance, this size cap with 20% could be massive... my dumby circuit should be from 1 to 10 sec and is at 15 with a 100uF cap... I could try a 1000 and a 470 in parallel (1470uF) and get 1.3 to 7.5secs, but again on paper...

my last concern is what is the minimum resistance than can be connected to the threshold and discharge pins? is less than 1k ok for this, all websites use 10k as a base example... i suppose i can try and see if it explodes, only 1.25 each so not that mush is lost...

I'll research anyway, if anyone has any input it'd be great to hear, (although I understand much of time might be over most peoples heads) anyone with ideas, criticism or help is welcome to have their say...

wouldn't be any fun if it were easy...

 

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93 Red ED 5spd Manual Build Thread

Performance: Complete AUII VCT Wiring & Power Train, Pacey Headers, 2.5" Exhaust, Exedy Clutch, DBA Rotors
Visuals: FG XR Wheel, XR Front, 17's, BA 5 Spd Shifter, BA Ghia Window Switches, NL Cluster
Tunes: 8" Pioneer Sub, JBL Speakers, Clarion Double DIN Headunit

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