Fordmods Logo

breaking down 4ltr turbo. 

 

Page 2 of 3 [ 37 posts ] Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next

 
Posted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 4:28 am 
Stock as a Rock
Offline

Posts: 107

Joined: 16th Nov 2005

Location: whyalla
SA, Australia

opto wrote:
Okay I have just gone through this, you have the same symptoms also and what you have said youhave done seems to indicate it s the same.

I used the original Dizzy with the TFI module and hooked up a Crane Hi6 Fireball ignition, but heres the cruncher, the dizzy through the TFI module puts out a Base TIMING signal that then goes to the ECU, an output signal called "Spark out" or "Spout" for short returns from the ECU to the TFI module then to the ignition coil. this is a triggered negative to the coil., the other side of the coil is held positive.

Your spark breakdown is due to the ignition timing no having any advance like it is only 10 degrees and not rising to say 22 degrees or 30 degrees.
I found this out because the dope who installed my ECU interceptor tapped into the TFI out signal similar thing.
I hope this answers your problem


howdy cheers all for the responses, i hooked up my mates computer the other day as he suggest the timing too, to have a look at what the dyno bloke had done, gave it a heap of revs and the timing started of at 13 then straight away sat at 10 all throught the rev range up untill it broke down 3800 i think, should the timing by advanceing more than that as the revs go up, is that what you mean, il check plugs again and see what he gapped them at there ba turbo plugs, but yer the timing defeinlty stays at 10 hot or cold, to be honest it starts at 13 then slightly drops down to around 7 at about 2000 revs then jumps straight up too 10 and stays at that for the whole rev range. when you check it with the timing light the mark on the harmolic bal, sits prob a inch or bit less than a inch back from the timing mark on the motor, then when you rev it, it goes up the the timing mark and stays there dead on the mark on the motor.
Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 11:11 am 
Getting Side Ways
Offline
User avatar

Age: 64

Posts: 3552

Joined: 7th Nov 2004

Gallery: 4 images

Power: 482 rwkw

Location: Penrith
NSW, Australia

Its blowing the spark out.. Close gap or get a stronger ignition...
You can close gap as close as .020 if you have to...
Initial I would start at .035...

Double check all your ignition connections.. Make sure plug leads are well separated from signal wires. Try to run them as close to engine to shield them. It helps if they are twisted..

 

_________________

As in ZOOM 126 edition
331 Dart block,3.25/ 4340 steel crank, Oliver rods,TFS ported track heat heads, TFS track heat inlet Twin SC61 turbo's
Project 1UZ-EF has started.. S475 Turbo 4.0 V8 Mustang Celica.....

Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 3:00 pm 
Getting Side Ways
Offline
User avatar

Age: 54

Posts: 744

Joined: 11th Nov 2004

Gallery: 15 images

Ride: ED Falcon

Location: Adelaide
SA, Australia

boosted22 wrote:
opto wrote:
Okay I have just gone through this, you have the same symptoms also and what you have said youhave done seems to indicate it s the same.

I used the original Dizzy with the TFI module and hooked up a Crane Hi6 Fireball ignition, but heres the cruncher, the dizzy through the TFI module puts out a Base TIMING signal that then goes to the ECU, an output signal called "Spark out" or "Spout" for short returns from the ECU to the TFI module then to the ignition coil. this is a triggered negative to the coil., the other side of the coil is held positive.

Your spark breakdown is due to the ignition timing no having any advance like it is only 10 degrees and not rising to say 22 degrees or 30 degrees.
I found this out because the dope who installed my ECU interceptor tapped into the TFI out signal similar thing.
I hope this answers your problem


howdy cheers all for the responses, i hooked up my mates computer the other day as he suggest the timing too, to have a look at what the dyno bloke had done, gave it a heap of revs and the timing started of at 13 then straight away sat at 10 all throught the rev range up untill it broke down 3800 i think, should the timing by advanceing more than that as the revs go up, is that what you mean, il check plugs again and see what he gapped them at there ba turbo plugs, but yer the timing defeinlty stays at 10 hot or cold, to be honest it starts at 13 then slightly drops down to around 7 at about 2000 revs then jumps straight up too 10 and stays at that for the whole rev range. when you check it with the timing light the mark on the harmolic bal, sits prob a inch or bit less than a inch back from the timing mark on the motor, then when you rev it, it goes up the the timing mark and stays there dead on the mark on the motor.



Advancing on a N/aspirated can go as high as 30 degrees advance, generally as far as I am aware, timing should increase to a certain point but as boost peaks timing can drop to 20 degrees.

You should see this with a good ignition timing light, and normally the TFI and ECU would control it, however if you have an aftermarket ECU, this will do the job but has to be setup to do so with tuning.

 

_________________

I post here cos the russian tank driver doesn't

Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 10:14 pm 
Stock as a Rock
Offline

Age: 37

Posts: 122

Joined: 7th Jan 2006

Gallery: 5 images

Ride: XE

Location: Melbourne
VIC, Australia

what coil are you running?
Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Tue Sep 16, 2008 3:46 am 
Stock as a Rock
Offline

Posts: 107

Joined: 16th Nov 2005

Location: whyalla
SA, Australia

Concord wrote:
what coil are you running?


msd blaster, and msd 6al -2, gonna check plug gaps etc just havent had time.
Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Tue Sep 16, 2008 4:03 am 
Getting Side Ways
Offline
User avatar

Age: 38

Posts: 1228

Joined: 5th Mar 2006

Gallery: 25 images

Ride: FALCON EB TURBO, EL XR6

Location: Sydney
NSW, Australia

Go back to the stock coil, as i said i had the blaster on mine and had breakdown at high rpm. Trust me you wont be dissapointed. Oh and still run the msd of course. Just hook up the orange wire to the + and the black to - and you'll be fine. I used an old fuel injector plug off an old loom on the coil as there the same.
I even tryed a fire control c4 coil which puts out 60,000 volts, and weighs about 0.5kg (that fkrs huge!) but still got more power out of the stock bosch. Figure that out???

 

_________________

FALCAHOLIC

IF AT FIRST YOU DON'T SUCCEED
DESTROY ALL EVIDENCE THAT YOU EVEN TRIED


Image

Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Tue Sep 16, 2008 10:24 am 
Stock as a Rock
Offline

Posts: 107

Joined: 16th Nov 2005

Location: whyalla
SA, Australia

FLASH wrote:
Go back to the stock coil, as i said i had the blaster on mine and had breakdown at high rpm. Trust me you wont be dissapointed. Oh and still run the msd of course. Just hook up the orange wire to the + and the black to - and you'll be fine. I used an old fuel injector plug off an old loom on the coil as there the same.
I even tryed a fire control c4 coil which puts out 60,000 volts, and weighs about 0.5kg (that fkrs huge!) but still got more power out of the stock bosch. Figure that out???



howdy yer we tried one of them coils of a customers car the day i tried to dyno it, but was worse.
Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Tue Sep 16, 2008 10:26 am 
Stock as a Rock
Offline

Posts: 107

Joined: 16th Nov 2005

Location: whyalla
SA, Australia

it wouldnt be the injectors would it, im running rochester 65lb low independence, but i have wired them just in normal bank fire 1 drier too 3 injectors, butprob not as on the dyno there was no hesitation or ups and downs in the fuel side leading up to were it broke down.
Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Tue Sep 16, 2008 2:50 pm 
Getting Side Ways
Offline
User avatar

Age: 64

Posts: 3552

Joined: 7th Nov 2004

Gallery: 4 images

Power: 482 rwkw

Location: Penrith
NSW, Australia

Have you changed the ECU to low impedance setting??

 

_________________

As in ZOOM 126 edition
331 Dart block,3.25/ 4340 steel crank, Oliver rods,TFS ported track heat heads, TFS track heat inlet Twin SC61 turbo's
Project 1UZ-EF has started.. S475 Turbo 4.0 V8 Mustang Celica.....

Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Sat Sep 20, 2008 7:48 pm 
Getting Side Ways
Offline

Posts: 6449

Joined: 11th Nov 2004

boosted22 wrote:
Concord wrote:
what coil are you running?


msd blaster, and msd 6al -2, gonna check plug gaps etc just havent had time.



MSD blaster what? blaster 2/3, blaster SS blaster HVC, they are not all the same.

a blaster SS with out a CDI but using 16v supply will do just fine, I've seen it used with 25psi with out a problem, running a 0.75mm plug gap.

what leads and plugs are using? where is the coil mounted?

running a very small small plug gap with a very high output ignition will can be the cause of misfire.

 

_________________

PERMANENTLY BANNED

Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Sun Sep 21, 2008 12:57 pm 
Stock as a Rock
Offline

Posts: 107

Joined: 16th Nov 2005

Location: whyalla
SA, Australia

what ive done,
fitted another dissy
new bosch leads
new ba turbo plugs. gabbed to 0.8
new rotor, cap,
msd 6al2, msd blaster 2 coil, ive just got it sitting right near the dissy using the smallest lead i could get.
changed my cam back to the standard cam, and fitted my good valve springs from my good motor,
redone my earths lots of ground points,
but still hasnt changed a thing, the s**t problem about it is my laptop using usb adaptor cant pick up the ecu, so cant get on there to see what the dyno guy done.
Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Sun Sep 21, 2008 1:03 pm 
Stock as a Rock
Offline

Posts: 107

Joined: 16th Nov 2005

Location: whyalla
SA, Australia

why couldnt some of yous guys live in whyalla, then you could come around and have a look lol.
Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Sun Sep 21, 2008 2:40 pm 
Getting Side Ways
Offline
User avatar

Age: 29

Posts: 975

Joined: 26th Nov 2004

Ride: el falcon

Power: 608 rwkw

Location: Waroona
WA, Australia

ba turbo spark plugs are iridium, iridium spark plugs are not meant to be gaped because it damages the electrode tip.

also iridium plugs just don't seem to last in the turbo sohc 4l, they are a waste of money

change the spark plugs, to el xr6 or lpg plugs and gap them to .8

and i would find a new tuner!

 

_________________

# 1997 EL Falcon GLI - 600+rwkw

# 2008 FPV FG GTE - Xa Coilovers, 20x8/ 20x10 Fairladys

Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Sun Sep 21, 2008 9:38 pm 
Getting Side Ways
Offline

Posts: 6449

Joined: 11th Nov 2004

boosted22 wrote:
what ive done,
fitted another dissy
new bosch leads
new ba turbo plugs. gabbed to 0.8
new rotor, cap,
msd 6al2, msd blaster 2 coil, ive just got it sitting right near the dissy using the smallest lead i could get.
changed my cam back to the standard cam, and fitted my good valve springs from my good motor,
redone my earths lots of ground points,
but still hasnt changed a thing, the s**t problem about it is my laptop using usb adaptor cant pick up the ecu, so cant get on there to see what the dyno guy done.


Why are you using such a small gap with a CDI?

Are the bochs leads a suppression type or a spiral wire type?

as for plugs just run a BP7EY and gap it to 1 .

 

_________________

PERMANENTLY BANNED

Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Mon Sep 22, 2008 6:49 am 
Stock as a Rock
Offline

Posts: 107

Joined: 16th Nov 2005

Location: whyalla
SA, Australia

tickford_6 wrote:
boosted22 wrote:
what ive done,
fitted another dissy
new bosch leads
new ba turbo plugs. gabbed to 0.8
new rotor, cap,
msd 6al2, msd blaster 2 coil, ive just got it sitting right near the dissy using the smallest lead i could get.
changed my cam back to the standard cam, and fitted my good valve springs from my good motor,
redone my earths lots of ground points,
but still hasnt changed a thing, the s**t problem about it is my laptop using usb adaptor cant pick up the ecu, so cant get on there to see what the dyno guy done.


Why are you using such a small gap with a CDI?

Are the bochs leads a suppression type or a spiral wire type?

as for plugs just run a BP7EY and gap it to 1 .




becuase im still learning all this stuff my self, hell you should of seen how excited i was that i even got it to run, the dyno bloke gapped the plugs down to try fix the problem on the day, i think its gotta be some thing in the comp, every thing ive tried or fitted has made no defference what so ever, it hasnt got slightly better etc, its done the same thing from the very first start up, or there something in the wireing im not seeing.
Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:
Sort by  
 Page 2 of 3  [ 37 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 10 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

 

 

It is currently Wed Dec 13, 2017 8:01 pm All times are UTC + 11 hours

 

 

(c)2014 Total Web Solutions Australia - Australian Web Hosting and Domain Names