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Dyno Vs Dyno ! 

 

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Posted: Mon Aug 22, 2005 8:13 pm 
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What changed between 11am and now?

Dyno figures always always a great conversation starter over dinner! :D

 

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Posted: Mon Aug 22, 2005 8:19 pm 
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Waggin wrote:
Dyno figures always always a great conversation starter over dinner! :D


Lol, more political than politics....

I can see where V8Capri is coming from...

However, the concept remains valid (i.e. the "dyno crawl"...) and i'd be willing to chip in a few bucks to see someone do it...

One day, maybe. Frankly im suprised such a test (read: controlled environment) hasnt been done before... but then, if i were a dyno operator i'd be fairly reluctant as there is the possibility of some damage to reputation....

 

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Posted: Mon Aug 22, 2005 9:38 pm 
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Pretty disappointing, I was very eager to see how this turned out; either way I agree with both parties as you both possess valid points, that’s why the only way to settle this once and for all and of course to let names rest is to re-dyno.


-sigh- :roll:

 

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Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2005 3:21 am 
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v8capri wrote:
I'm considering pulling out of this.
Not because I am chicken ! But because I have nothing to prove.
I am not the dyno owner , nor the operator on the day. I merely hired Hallam Performance to hold Dyno comps for the public. ( and what a grateful lot you were !)
If you have a gripe, and it is quite clear that you do, take it up with Hallam Performance.

I held these dyno days to help everyone and have some fun, the critism that you get, almost makes it not worth it.


Thats a shame. I was very much looking forward to this. I think what we were trying to acheive here is a controlled experiment to see what the outputs were. I know you don't own the dyno, nor are the operator. However, you were one of the few people who are willing to participate in this experiment. I dont have a gripe with Hallam as such, nor with yourself, but the dyno itself. BTW, who said we were ungrateful for your efforts. If you should list my opinions as ungrateful, then you have completely misunderstood me.

But I would be interested in why the change of mind, considering how keen you were the last 2 days?

v8capri wrote:
Personally I don't live nor die by the dyno figure, even though I put it in my sig. maybe on another dyno it is lower, maybe higher, still my run is 600+ so I show off ! ( cause I can !)
For the record I haven't made 624 hp @ hallam yet ! I wish it was 17% as I would be over 700!


Still dont agree with you there. Your Group A exists because of the dyno, and the figures it produces. You strive for every last hp out of that car, and if it doesnt perform, its out with the old and in with the new. If it doesnt win nearly every dyno comp you enter, I'm sure you would be s**t. Hence the live and die by the figures this car makes.

Show off by all means. You did the hard yards, you deserve it.

Do you ever run your car at Hallam, apart from the days you host? If we ever question the shootout mode of Dyno Dynamics, it is entirely possible that it over quotes, and infact your 624hp might be less. Maybe your new signature should read "somewhere between 518hp and 730hp at the wheels, most places averaging 624hp"

v8capri wrote:
And to bag Dan, you know that is childish and not fair.


I've already apologised to Dan for busting up his thread. If you really felt so strongly about my comments, you should have said something like this before, not just accepted it as a friendly jibe and continued on. From what I can see now, this crack is a last ditch effort to make me look bad as you pull out.

v8capri wrote:
Out.


I was coming on here to say my guy has said yes to a Thursday evening run, but found this post. In which case, if you change your mind, let me know. My offer will always exist.
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Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2005 11:18 am 
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Hmmm
i was looking forward to seeing these results also

V8Capri im sorry to see your last post as this was set to be a great experiment and put an end to arguments about variations between Dyno Joints.
I must agree with Arm79 your last post does seem like a cop out but its a shame you feel that way.
However Adrian maybe we can use another car and tee something up with hallam. It doesnt have to be his car does it?

 

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Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2005 11:27 am 
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I could sub in instead, Ive been dynoed around the place :P

 

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Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2005 11:28 am 
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But I dont exactly have a dyno shop on call, lol

 

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Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2005 11:35 am 
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I can understand v8capri's point. It isnt his dyno, nor does he have anything to prove. From my point of view, he was a willing participant in this excercise. So I have no issues, apart from a little dissapointment from seeing this exercise no longer really viable.

My only issue is the last personal attack as he was leaving the thread. If he felt that way in the first place, he should have said something to that effect. Not attempt to b**ch slap me when my back was turned after the event.

Maybe there was a bit of "childishness" coming from not only my side in the end. :D

So from my point of view, unless v8capri wants to continue, this thread is dead and over. :(
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Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2005 11:53 am 
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I can understand where this is coming from but it is a pethatic call if you want a dyno figure on your car and then back to back it with mods go to the same dyno. My car has been on 2 different dynos (one being Hallam's) with no modifications done in between the 2 runs and added probably 30 000ks to the clock between runs and pulled with in .2 rwkw difference from 141.9 to 141.7rwkw and i will be able to back it up with a 3rd dyno in the next couple of weeks as it is going in for a custom dyno tune after the unichip is installed with before and after runs.

 

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Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2005 12:40 pm 
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ARM 79 you have a PM.

 

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Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2005 1:33 pm 
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i'm talkin for myself here, and what i've seen form my car.

i've had about 3 dyno runs done with my car.

1st - stock @ Hallam pulled 112rwkw on petrol.
2nd - current mods @ dynomotive pulled 122rwkw on LPG
3rd - current mods @ MK automotive pulled 124rwkw on LPG and 130rwkw on petrol.

while this doesn't say anything in regards to my car's overall performance at Hallam, John_xr6's car managed 132rwkw @ Hallam, at which point my car was in no state to run so i missed out.

now - at heathcote:
both our cars are autos
both run 3.45 LSD's
mine would be a little heavier (lpg stuff etc)
his was running stockies, i was running 17's.

he managed 15.6 @91ish mph
i managed 15.9 @ 88ish mph

in saying this, my dyno runs have been fairly consistant where ever i've gone and i have to agree with Paul when he said a lot of people have been dissapointed with the numbers they see @ hallam dyno days.
seen a number of 160rwkw+ cars, only manage just over 150rwkw.

it simply goes to show, you're *never* going to get comparable data from 2 different dyno's until there is complete uniformity in the testing conditions.

i honestly don't think this comparison would end up proving anything, i'm 100% certain that one of the 2 dyno's would end up reading higher then the other, weather its 17% or less, really doesn't matter.
and unless you're going to go and test ~100 dyno's, whos to say which dyno is *wrong*.

 

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 Post subject: why the differences??????????????????
Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2005 1:56 pm 
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EFFalcon wrote:
i'm talkin for myself here, and what i've seen form my car.

i've had about 3 dyno runs done with my car.

1st - stock @ Hallam pulled 112rwkw on petrol.
2nd - current mods @ dynomotive pulled 122rwkw on LPG
3rd - current mods @ MK automotive pulled 124rwkw on LPG and 130rwkw on petrol.

while this doesn't say anything in regards to my car's overall performance at Hallam, John_xr6's car managed 132rwkw @ Hallam, at which point my car was in no state to run so i missed out.

now - at heathcote:
both our cars are autos
both run 3.45 LSD's
mine would be a little heavier (lpg stuff etc)
his was running stockies, i was running 17's.

he managed 15.6 @91ish mph
i managed 15.9 @ 88ish mph

in saying this, my dyno runs have been fairly consistant where ever i've gone and i have to agree with Paul when he said a lot of people have been dissapointed with the numbers they see @ hallam dyno days.
seen a number of 160rwkw+ cars, only manage just over 150rwkw.

it simply goes to show, you're *never* going to get comparable data from 2 different dyno's until there is complete uniformity in the testing conditions.

i honestly don't think this comparison would end up proving anything, i'm 100% certain that one of the 2 dyno's would end up reading higher then the other, weather its 17% or less, really doesn't matter.
and unless you're going to go and test ~100 dyno's, whos to say which dyno is *wrong*.



HI

tend to differ here with ur last comment " honestly don't think this comparison would end up proving anything, i'm 100% certain that one of the 2 dyno's would end up reading higher then the other, weather its 17% or less, really doesn't matter.
and unless you're going to go and test ~100 dyno's, whos to say which dyno is *wrong*."

like i said in another thread in the INLINE 6 cylinder section two of the same dynos made by the same manufacturer should have no LARGE 17 % discrepancy .

It is a reasonable question to ask why the HUGE difference in readings ???
ARM79 is asking a valid question its not a charactor assassination or a witch hunt.

I as a paying customer if i went to two different dyno workshops and had my car on two the same dynos ( manufactured by the same people ) would deffently wanna know why the differences ???


I as a dyno operator have a dyno dynamics dyno and am willing to donate my dyno time free of charge just to see where the problems lies there is nothing else in it as some people perseve other than tackle the problem cause as i said we shouldnt see more than a few killwatts difference from a controlled test ( say two cars so we can compare )

lets see this thread through its not a challange just a issue that needs to be address and maybe taken up the manufacturer themself.

I will give another example Dyno Dynamics reads one reading with a particular car and on another brand of dyno,(DTS) Dynamic Test Systems dyno it reads upto 20 % higher so please explain this stituation???

SO WHO IS MAKING DYNOS TO A STARNDARD ?????

AND WHAT IS A STANDARD FOR DYNOS???

Remember this piece equipment are very expensive :idea: :idea: :?:

its a pitty the test has been cancelled

cya

 

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Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2005 2:00 pm 
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Its not definative but my car made 260 on the dyno used by gas research when it was owned by the previous owner and it made 261 on the hallam dyno with no further mods.

I dynoed it "stock" so I had a baseline.

Dyno figures prove nothing. The track is where it should be measured.
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 Post subject: PMSL
Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2005 2:08 pm 
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Dansedgli wrote:
Its not definative but my car made 260 on the dyno used by gas research when it was owned by the previous owner and it made 261 on the hallam dyno with no further mods.

I dynoed it "stock" so I had a baseline.

Dyno figures prove nothing. The track is where it should be measured.


PMSFL

its amazing how race teams spend hours and hours RD ing on engine dynos and chassis dynos and u tell me dyno figures prove nothing

hahahahahahahah :idea: :?:

people must understand never mind


and correct me if im wrong, thats what ARM79 is saying cars of the same configuration that have more power readings on a dyno are running slower times !!!!!! than cars that have less dyno figure power !!!

wouldnt be a reasonable assumption to say something is wrong with the dyno figures and ask the question why ???



cya

 

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 Post subject: Re: PMSL
Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2005 2:12 pm 
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FPV_GTp wrote:
Dansedgli wrote:
Its not definative but my car made 260 on the dyno used by gas research when it was owned by the previous owner and it made 261 on the hallam dyno with no further mods.

I dynoed it "stock" so I had a baseline.

Dyno figures prove nothing. The track is where it should be measured.


PMSFL

its amazing how race teams spend hours and hours RD ing on engine dynos and chassis dynos and u tell me dyno figures prove nothing

hahahahahahahah :idea: :?:

people must understand never mind

cya


Yes but do they go comparing their own cars to others that have run on different dynos? How many race teams would run there cars on one dyno one day then a different dyno the next?

They are a great tuning tool, noone is arguing that fact. The problem is people run their 130rwkw then cry when a similar car ran quicker on the track but less rwkw on a dyno run.

Dyno figures are not a 100% accurate and comparable to each other, everyone knows yet they still complain. I dont get it.

Quarter mile times dont lie.
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