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supercharger engine upgrades 

 

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 Post subject: Re: supercharger engine upgrades
Posted: Mon Sep 28, 2009 10:38 am 
Getting Side Ways
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Ride: Fordrunner 5.0 Turbo

Location: Wollongong
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Raptor1603 wrote:
it just about to hit 150,000, but i service it every 5000, including gearbox and diff oils along with the usual service!! It loves to have a bit of fun every now n then, but its a brilliant engine that gets spoilt come service time lol

i am gettin a new transmission for it thou as the current on is stuffed! and i just replaced my speedo gears in the ext. housing!!



You do your diff and box oil every 5000kms? Um, normally box and dif oil service is at 50,000kms. And that's for a thrashed fleet vehicle.

Anyway back OT.

Troyman has made some decent numbers in His ED and its bone stock apart from the exhaust, EMS and Raptor blower. You probably wouldn't even need to touch the heads to get to 220kw, Just an off the shelf cam and a smaller blower pulley. I'd only go a custom grind if I was chasing every poofteenth of power possible. Far too many sheep have gone for custom grinds when off the shelf items would have been perfect for what they have wanted to achieve. And that is why there is a Billet cam blank shortage for the EA-Au falcon 6.
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 Post subject: Re: supercharger engine upgrades
Posted: Mon Sep 28, 2009 10:56 am 
Getting Side Ways
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Ride: Supercharged BA XL ute

Location: Gordonvale
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Yups think it through,do it once and do it right hey guys.
Then flog the guts out of it.

 

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BA XL ute.
P'maker headers',Hi flow cat,3" sports sytem,
Raptor V-clutched lightweight not intercooled,no tranny cooler,no worries.

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 Post subject: Re: supercharger engine upgrades
Posted: Mon Sep 28, 2009 8:13 pm 
Parts Gopher
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Ride: Falcon AUII XR6 HP

Power: 184 rwkw

Location: Newcastle
NSW, Australia

badcooky wrote:
Yups think it through,do it once and do it right hey guys.
Then flog the guts out of it.


Thats the best attitude i have ever seen lol!!

i spose ya right, ill just go off the shelf!!!
so i should still go surecam or jmm??

 

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184 rwkw with more to go!

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 Post subject: Re: supercharger engine upgrades
Posted: Mon Sep 28, 2009 10:58 pm 
Getting Side Ways
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Ride: Fordrunner 5.0 Turbo

Location: Wollongong
NSW, Australia

Surecam are custom. JMM/CMS/Wade/Crow/Camtech/all the rest are off the shelf cams.
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 Post subject: Re: supercharger engine upgrades
Posted: Tue Sep 29, 2009 5:52 pm 
Getting Side Ways
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keen to see what you able to achieve mate.

Good to see another AU getting a Raptor fitted.

Tim,
Interesting comment you made about the A2A intercooler option. Is there a reason why you dont like them other than they arent as efficient in cooling as the w2a?

Not trying to make a mountain out of a mole hill, just wouldnt mind a professionals opinion. PM me if you like to avoid going OT on this thread.

To the OP, sorry for hijacking your thread. :oops:

 

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 Post subject: Re: supercharger engine upgrades
Posted: Tue Sep 29, 2009 9:50 pm 
Getting Side Ways
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Ride: Fordrunner 5.0 Turbo

Location: Wollongong
NSW, Australia

My guess is a cross between packaging, stealthy appearance and efficiency.

I'm looking into designing a multiple pass water to air intercooler with ice box for a turbo I6 and there is not much out there in terms of schematics and flow patterns.

Anyway Nathan, did the cam suppliers get back to you? Any suggestions?
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 Post subject: Re: supercharger engine upgrades
Posted: Wed Sep 30, 2009 11:37 am 
Getting Side Ways
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Shav Tim is the designer and builder of his system,he knows it better than us.
Any idiot can buy his product screw it up and then bad mouth his product.
Once his product goes out the door it's a lottery as to what happens.
Run an air to air do a really tight power run with a tune and then blow it to bits when it's totally heat sunk from some dufus in traffic and who looks bad,not the fugged up dufus he'll biatch and moan that it wasn't his deal.
Buy and run Tims water to air it's built and designed by Raptor for Raptor it's the thing dude..
No animals were harmed.
Just about to plug in my new tune guys.

 

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BA XL ute.
P'maker headers',Hi flow cat,3" sports sytem,
Raptor V-clutched lightweight not intercooled,no tranny cooler,no worries.

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 Post subject: Re: supercharger engine upgrades
Posted: Wed Sep 30, 2009 11:56 am 
Getting Side Ways
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badcooky wrote:
Shav Tim is the designer and builder of his system,he knows it better than us.
Any idiot can buy his product screw it up and then bad mouth his product.
Once his product goes out the door it's a lottery as to what happens.
Run an air to air do a really tight power run with a tune and then blow it to bits when it's totally heat sunk from some dufus in traffic and who looks bad,not the fugged up dufus he'll biatch and moan that it wasn't his deal.
Buy and run Tims water to air it's built and designed by Raptor for Raptor it's the thing dude..
No animals were harmed.
Just about to plug in my new tune guys.


cheers cooky. I understand what your saying. I like to get a wider perspective of both sides of the fence so Im well informed thats all. Not trying to take away anything from anyone here. I realise Tim is developing the w2a kit to suit the Raptor alone and it will be backed up with proven test results. Thats what I like about it. Its designed to suit the car, the engine, and the setup.

A2A while common on the turbo cars is good for them, I understand that it could be harmful for the raptor. That still doesnt prove to me that an A2A is crap for superchargers in general. I think it comes more down to the tuners ability rather than a air core itself. Just it isnt as efficient in delivering the results a water core can bring. Air cores are more widely known and some what predictable. Water core I think is the next level higher for street driven cars and when it does take off more in australia, we will see even turbo cars go down this route more often.

Not to sound like a broken record but, Id like to get professional opinions based on facts. Tim will prove this I believe with his w2a unit, I just would have liked his opinion on why he didnt like a2a that much.

 

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 Post subject: Re: supercharger engine upgrades
Posted: Wed Sep 30, 2009 12:06 pm 
Getting Side Ways
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Cool bananas dude.
You are right about A/A being known and understood,but we are getting consistent dyno figures from first pull to the last pull with W/A 8 runs later there's 1 or 2 rwkw's difference, an air to air as you know is heat soaked and dropping hp numbers.
The W/A is so consistent it's the one to use.
I'm different i'm going to use an air tank for a truck and blow it through a W/A as we know that when a compressed gas like air is let go it tries to freeze, then the waste air will wash over the compressor housing to cool it as well.
Hope i haven't confused ppl here.
P.S. do not do what i do as i am wierd and wired.

 

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BA XL ute.
P'maker headers',Hi flow cat,3" sports sytem,
Raptor V-clutched lightweight not intercooled,no tranny cooler,no worries.

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 Post subject: Re: supercharger engine upgrades
Posted: Wed Sep 30, 2009 12:13 pm 
Getting Side Ways
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Location: melbourne
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Cooky got it right.

W2A is more efficient and the temps stay stable. Once the car warms up and the water circulates a few times the temps will stay consistant. The tuner can tune to this and give good reliable results.

With an A2A cooler the temps arent as stable, they might cool better than a W2A on a cold night but on a hot day or after a decent thrashing the air temps might be much more. A tuner could tune for when the air temps are cold, not put enough thought into the air temp correction factors then the motor might ping and carry one once it has been thrashed or sitting in traffic.

With a supercharger with a relatively fixed boost output pressure drop from long piping through an A2A can make a big difference. A small water to air core and short piping will give less pressure drop which is beneficial. Unlike a turbo you cant just turn the boost up to make up for the pressure drop so its good to be as efficient as possible.
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 Post subject: Re: supercharger engine upgrades
Posted: Wed Sep 30, 2009 12:14 pm 
Getting Side Ways
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badcooky wrote:
Cool bananas dude.
You are right about A/A being known and understood,but we are getting consistent dyno figures from first pull to the last pull with W/A 8 runs later there's 1 or 2 rwkw's difference, an air to air as you know is heat soaked and dropping hp numbers.
The W/A is so consistent it's the one to use.
I'm different i'm going to use an air tank for a truck and blow it through a W/A as we know that when a compressed gas like air is let go it tries to freeze, then the waste air will wash over the compressor housing to cool it as well.
Hope i haven't confused ppl here.
P.S. do not do what i do as i am wierd and wired.


Sounds interesting cooky. Far too complicated for my mind though. lol

But as far the w2a runs, thats another plus you have mentioned. Consistency is a massive plus for anyone wanting to avoid detonation etc. Its hard to dispute numbers when they are right there for all to see.

I have put my name down on the list for a W2A kit, so will be keen to see the results of the first kit they trial. From what Tim has told me, I will be thoroughly impressed. God I hope so.

 

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 Post subject: Re: supercharger engine upgrades
Posted: Wed Sep 30, 2009 12:16 pm 
Getting Side Ways
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Dansedgli wrote:
Cooky got it right.

W2A is more efficient and the temps stay stable. Once the car warms up and the water circulates a few times the temps will stay consistant. The tuner can tune to this and give good reliable results.

With an A2A cooler the temps arent as stable, they might cool better than a W2A on a cold night but on a hot day or after a decent thrashing the air temps might be much more. A tuner could tune for when the air temps are cold, not put enough thought into the air temp correction factors then the motor might ping and carry one once it has been thrashed or sitting in traffic.

With a supercharger with a relatively fixed boost output pressure drop from long piping through an A2A can make a big difference. A small water to air core and short piping will give less pressure drop which is beneficial. Unlike a turbo you cant just turn the boost up to make up for the pressure drop so its good to be as efficient as possible.

KAPOW there it is,i'm not good at explaining stuff thanks Dan.

 

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BA XL ute.
P'maker headers',Hi flow cat,3" sports sytem,
Raptor V-clutched lightweight not intercooled,no tranny cooler,no worries.

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 Post subject: Re: supercharger engine upgrades
Posted: Wed Sep 30, 2009 12:18 pm 
Getting Side Ways
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Dansedgli wrote:
Cooky got it right.

W2A is more efficient and the temps stay stable. Once the car warms up and the water circulates a few times the temps will stay consistant. The tuner can tune to this and give good reliable results.

With an A2A cooler the temps arent as stable, they might cool better than a W2A on a cold night but on a hot day or after a decent thrashing the air temps might be much more. A tuner could tune for when the air temps are cold, not put enough thought into the air temp correction factors then the motor might ping and carry one once it has been thrashed or sitting in traffic.

With a supercharger with a relatively fixed boost output pressure drop from long piping through an A2A can make a big difference. A small water to air core and short piping will give less pressure drop which is beneficial. Unlike a turbo you cant just turn the boost up to make up for the pressure drop so its good to be as efficient as possible.


Thats a good enough reason alone to go W2A. But with the offset of costs compared to a A2A, do you think it would be worth it? Some would argue that point.

 

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 Post subject: Re: supercharger engine upgrades
Posted: Wed Sep 30, 2009 12:22 pm 
Getting Side Ways
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That's why i'm going my way with the W/A from Tim as the unit,any servo can fill my air tank up and it's self pumping, it'll run for 10 minutes to purge as well and weighs FA.
So on a cold night with this system i can be way under ambient and luvvin it.
Did i mention i got to fit my Water /meth thing up soon as well.
It's all too tiersome guys..
Now please let me go and load my killer tune.

 

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BA XL ute.
P'maker headers',Hi flow cat,3" sports sytem,
Raptor V-clutched lightweight not intercooled,no tranny cooler,no worries.

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 Post subject: Re: supercharger engine upgrades
Posted: Wed Sep 30, 2009 12:29 pm 
Getting Side Ways
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For a supercharger setup like you have then yep it would be worth it. You dont have much boost to play with so may as well make the most of it.

I wouldnt for a turbo setup because you can turn the boost up. Provided its tuned properly heat soak shouldnt matter.

When my EB got heat soaked all the timing was pulled out so it would run really slow and not boost until it cooled down again. The AU I had wasnt tuned the same and would ping its nuts off. I was always scared to give it a hard time after the first time it happened.
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