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Dansedgli
Fordmods - Getting Side Ways
Age:24
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Location: melbourne VIC, Australia
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 Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2008 1:51 pm Post subject: |
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What prices were you getting to come to a $10,000 turbo install? Can you list out where it all goes?
If you go low boost then the same mods would need to be done to cope with your bolt on raptor kit anyway. |
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ebs_4l
Fordmods - Getting Side Ways
Age:24
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Location: kadina SA, Australia
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| Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2008 2:26 pm Post subject: |
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| Redford wrote: | a point to make here is that the volumetric efficency at low cranking speed should be at its highest for that engine and will drop off as the rpm increases.
a better flowing intake manifold, a cam with more lift, duration and overlap, opening up the head ports, bigger valves and a free flowing exhaust will increase power by raising the volumetric efficiency but the NA engine will allways create some vacuum on the intake stroke. the best built naturally aspirated engine will never achieve 100 percent volumetric efficiency because atmospheric pressure can only do so much to overcome the restrictions and turbulence in the intake system. as rpm goes up, volumetric efficiency drops off.
the only way to overcome the limitation is to add a forced induction system to increase the volume or atmospheric pressure giving the air more "push" as it enters the cylinders so the efficiency goes up and the engine makes more power. it can then breathe at 100 percent volumetric efficiency or higher depending on how much pressure is used. |
sorry, you are wrong
1) greatest volumetric efficiency is not at cranking speed..
2) the thought that volumetric effieciency drops with rpm is also half wrong..
3) and N/A engines can in fact exceed 100% VE...
VE of an engine peaks exactly at the peak torque rpm.. this is the point where the cylinders are breathing the maximum amount of air as mechanically possible for the engine combination in question... cranking speed is the worse VE point of an engine, dont beleive me, try a compression test with a brand new battery cranking it at 300rpm, then do it with a near flat battery, the slower cranking speed will yield lower compression gauge results..
VE of the engine climbs from idle all the way up to the torque peak, only after the torque peak does the torque figure decrease with rpm
N/A engines with a well designed inlet and exhaust manifold can exceed 100% VE, figure that the scavenging effect off a well designed header with tuned scavanging pulses will produce about a 6psi suction on the cylinder, and the pressure drop of the piston moving down the bore is usually no more than about 2psi, so the header is providing a major source of the engines breathing potential.. a correctly setup inlet tract/manifold, with tuned pressure wave motion can be used to time a high pressure wave with the valve opening events, remember that the charge air and exhaust gas both have an amount of inertia. get the air travelling towards the cylinder and also away from it at precisely the right time... and the net outcome is better than 100% cylinder filling |
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Redford
Fordmods - Getting Side Ways
Age:40
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| Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2008 2:36 pm Post subject: |
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| Priestly007 wrote: | has there been any dyno figures or even pics of this kinda setup?
Its amazing these charger 'guys' are bagging out the turbo setups etc and saying that 'we' (the turbo guys) dont want to hear the truth yet I havent seen pics or anything like that of the charger setup itself...... |
in this thread or in general?
seriously, turbos and blowers like powerdyne, raptor, vortech and the like all use "centrifugal displacement" NOT "positive deplacement" which is what the topic started out as. then peeps like cookie coming in on page 2 and starting a totaly different topic about raptors on boost when it wasnt even mentioned in the first place.
edit: thanks ebs_4l i just saw your post and i think you are right, i was calling it the way i understood it. i have heard of NA reaching figures close to %100ve but i didnt know it was acheivable. |
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Slick
Fordmods - Getting Side Ways
Age:39
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Location: Hobart TAS, Australia
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| Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2008 4:38 pm Post subject: |
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| EL XR8 wrote: |
Forced induction, doesn't include turbo's.... are you serious??? WTF do you think a turbo is? |
You're taking it out of context. What I mean was, the way you two were carrying on, its like we were in you space. it almost sounded like you felt threaten with the influx of S/C threads. before,,, this front page was full with turbo threads. its quite understandable mate, its a natural defensive mechanisms to be negative. LOL
Forced induction is just that, forcing or ramming air mechanically down the engines throat.
Come on ladies, lets share the love, ideas & be friends! LOL |
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Steady ED
Fordmods Addict
Age:22
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| Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2008 4:54 pm Post subject: |
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Slick, EL XR8 has a supercharger, so your comment misses the mark a bit.
Personally I couldn't give a stuff that theres a void that CAPA has left, that Raptor are trying to fill.
It doesn't give there affiliates/customers any excuse to come on this forum and spam it, making out as if they are the greatest thing since sliced bread.
Especially when I can't even find a compressor map for something that purports, and I quote..
| Tradewind wrote: | | With an ultra high speed Gear Drive in Raptor V all other superchargers in this class could not compete .... end of story. The impeller and cover are that good. |
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Slick
Fordmods - Getting Side Ways
Age:39
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Location: Hobart TAS, Australia
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| Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2008 5:34 pm Post subject: |
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I think everyone is missing the mark cause this thread was about positive displacement chargers.
can we get back on topic in regards to twin-screws & roots?
a matter of fact, there is a lot of useful information in this thread. like like formulas I forgot it existed. its like a refresher crash course into fluid machenics. LOL |
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xcabbi
Fordmods - Getting Side Ways
Age:26
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Location: Wollongong NSW, Australia
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| Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2008 5:36 pm Post subject: |
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| Steady ED wrote: | Slick, EL XR8 has a supercharger, so your comment misses the mark a bit.
Personally I couldn't give a stuff that theres a void that CAPA has left, that Raptor are trying to fill.
It doesn't give there affiliates/customers any excuse to come on this forum and spam it, making out as if they are the greatest thing since sliced bread.
Especially when I can't even find a compressor map for something that purports, and I quote..
| Tradewind wrote: | | With an ultra high speed Gear Drive in Raptor V all other superchargers in this class could not compete .... end of story. The impeller and cover are that good. |
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I get ya. How many times have I wanted further information on a product only to be fed something along those lines. And I'm not just talking about car parts. Pretty much all products and services I've come across recently end up with vague statements being released as technical information. |
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sly
Fordmods - Smokin em up
Age:46
Posts: 284
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Location: Newcastle NSW, Australia
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| Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2008 5:56 pm Post subject: |
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| Steady ED wrote: | | It doesn't give there affiliates/customers any excuse to come on this forum and spam it, making out as if they are the greatest thing since sliced bread. |
One person, who as I said before, has taken the negative feedback on board and toned it down. The only ones making the noise now are those who gave him the negative feedback and just seem to want to keep perpetuating it. Don't you know when to stop and make an effort to get back on topic?
Thanks "mate", you've just reminded me why I CBF logging on here for more than a year. I'm over it. TTFN. |
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badcooky
Fordmods Tyre Shredder
Posts: 300
Joined: 27 Jan 2007
Location: Toowoomba QLD, Australia
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| Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2008 6:22 pm Post subject: |
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,don't get me wrong terdbo's are wicked but you have to drive them wicked i know i've had a few.
They basically saved the diesel from going the way of the Dodo and for a younger bloke they're great.
I like Terdbo's but the aftermarket jobs are like social problems everyones got one.
OK as i'm pushing the blower so bad someone tell me how to upload pics and doc's.as i just went 242RWKW on the stock Raptor setup after work this afternoon.
One run and i'd say we should find some KW's with the tune dialled in and some more exhaust..
Will get the tune sorted ASAP. |
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Dansedgli
Fordmods - Getting Side Ways
Age:24
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Location: melbourne VIC, Australia
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| Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2008 6:27 pm Post subject: |
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www.photobucket.com
Log on and follow what it says.
242rwkw. Doesnt a standard XR6T make that after an off the shelf tune is flashed in for $1000?
If the kit retails for over $5k I would reconsidering how much I wanted to keep the same car. A 12k BA XT + $5k can get you an XR6T these days. |
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badcooky
Fordmods Tyre Shredder
Posts: 300
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| Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2008 6:44 pm Post subject: |
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242rwkw. Doesnt a standard XR6T make that after an off the shelf tune is flashed in for $1000?
If the kit retails for over $5k I would reconsidering how much I wanted to keep the same car. A 12k BA XT + $5k can get you an XR6T these days.[/quote]
What a sad little man.
I figured it out but can only get the pics up,they suck but hey.
Can't get the readout up ,YET.
Dyno time has cost me nuthin as i know the dude we should get a few KW's he reckons about 15 to 20 rear as stock tune is a bit off at the mo.
"I would reconsidering" WTF is that Dan i see you got a cool car you could trade it for a turbo or maybe not never mind you'll get there....honest. |
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badcooky
Fordmods Tyre Shredder
Posts: 300
Joined: 27 Jan 2007
Location: Toowoomba QLD, Australia
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| Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2008 6:45 pm Post subject: |
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| Hey i posted the pics in the BA ute thread i think. |
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Steady ED
Fordmods Addict
Age:22
Posts: 6770
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Location: Melbourne VIC, Australia
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| Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2008 6:51 pm Post subject: |
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| sly wrote: | | Steady ED wrote: | | It doesn't give there affiliates/customers any excuse to come on this forum and spam it, making out as if they are the greatest thing since sliced bread. |
One person, who as I said before, has taken the negative feedback on board and toned it down. The only ones making the noise now are those who gave him the negative feedback and just seem to want to keep perpetuating it. Don't you know when to stop and make an effort to get back on topic?
Thanks "mate", you've just reminded me why I CBF logging on here for more than a year. I'm over it. TTFN. |
LOL, catch ya later champ.
badcooky, 242rwkw on how many PSI?
And what size pulley?
Is it running off the stock serpentine setup belt, or does it have its own?
If it's got its own belt setup, what is the diameter of the crank pulley?
Basically, how far away is it from shredding its internal belts... |
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badcooky
Fordmods Tyre Shredder
Posts: 300
Joined: 27 Jan 2007
Location: Toowoomba QLD, Australia
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| Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2008 6:55 pm Post subject: |
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! 10 psi.
2 Don't know.
3 Has it's own belt.
4 Crank pulley is stock Ford.
5 you have problems. |
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Redford
Fordmods - Getting Side Ways
Age:40
Posts: 555
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Location: Brisbane QLD, Australia
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| Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2008 6:57 pm Post subject: |
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| Steady ED wrote: | | sly wrote: | | Steady ED wrote: | | It doesn't give there affiliates/customers any excuse to come on this forum and spam it, making out as if they are the greatest thing since sliced bread. |
One person, who as I said before, has taken the negative feedback on board and toned it down. The only ones making the noise now are those who gave him the negative feedback and just seem to want to keep perpetuating it. Don't you know when to stop and make an effort to get back on topic?
Thanks "mate", you've just reminded me why I CBF logging on here for more than a year. I'm over it. TTFN. |
LOL, catch ya later champ.
badcooky, 242rwkw on how many PSI?
And what size pulley?
Is it running off the stock serpentine setup belt, or does it have its own?
If it's got its own belt setup, what is the diameter of the crank pulley?
Basically, how far away is it from shredding its internal belts... |
Sly was right, you are a s**t stirrer |
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badcooky
Fordmods Tyre Shredder
Posts: 300
Joined: 27 Jan 2007
Location: Toowoomba QLD, Australia
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| Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2008 7:01 pm Post subject: |
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Red are you following me?
Look at our post times 2 times twice time 2. |
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Steady ED
Fordmods Addict
Age:22
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| Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2008 7:01 pm Post subject: |
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hahaha, I'm just telling the truth.
Blowers with internal belt drives shred belts when you spin them too fast.
You can "aircool" them, you can run tricky belts, whatever.
It still happens.
And I think it's wrong to push them without highlighting that. |
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badcooky
Fordmods Tyre Shredder
Posts: 300
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| Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2008 7:02 pm Post subject: |
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| Good for you ED. |
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Dansedgli
Fordmods - Getting Side Ways
Age:24
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Location: melbourne VIC, Australia
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| Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2008 7:14 pm Post subject: |
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| badcooky wrote: | | dansedgli wrote: | 242rwkw. Doesnt a standard XR6T make that after an off the shelf tune is flashed in for $1000?
If the kit retails for over $5k I would reconsidering how much I wanted to keep the same car. A 12k BA XT + $5k can get you an XR6T these days. |
What a sad little man.
I figured it out but can only get the pics up,they suck but hey.
Can't get the readout up ,YET.
Dyno time has cost me nuthin as i know the dude we should get a few KW's he reckons about 15 to 20 rear as stock tune is a bit off at the mo.
"I would reconsidering" WTF is that Dan i see you got a cool car you could trade it for a turbo or maybe not never mind you'll get there....honest. |
Get where?
lol at commenting on my typo while posting that grammatical masterpiece. |
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