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gogetta
Fordmods - Getting Side Ways
Posts: 2559
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Location: melbourne, sunshine VIC, Australia
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 Posted: Sun Apr 27, 2008 5:25 pm Post subject: 4spd auto onto 4.1 engine |
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can it be done...
im looking at an XF and really want to keep the 250 but hate 3spd autos...yes i could put XG running gear in but dont really want the 4.0lt
am not going to change it to manual either so dont bother with the usual autos are crap thing (unless I cant convert to 4spd) |
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84_Fairlane
Fordmods Stock as a Rock
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Location: Wodonga VIC, Australia
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| Posted: Mon Apr 28, 2008 9:25 pm Post subject: |
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| they wont phisicaly fit in the trans tunnel without enlargement, and you also have the belhousing and torque conveter issue |
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Macca
Fordmods - Getting Side Ways
Age:36
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| Posted: Wed Apr 30, 2008 12:24 am Post subject: Re: 4spd auto onto 4.1 engine |
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| gogetta wrote: | can it be done...
im looking at an XF and really want to keep the 250 but hate 3spd autos...yes i could put XG running gear in but dont really want the 4.0lt
am not going to change it to manual either so dont bother with the usual autos are crap thing (unless I cant convert to 4spd) |
Anything is possible, that is why this forum was created, just it depends on money or skills or both.  I do not remember if how different the bell housings are on the 4.0L to the 4.1, I am sure someone would have one they could take a picture of, you might need an adaptor plate and spacer to space the flex plate to towards the gearbox.
Not sure about the tranny tunnel, I have a V8 4sp auto outside and it doesn't look any bigger than an FMX from memory, FMX fits with heaps room as the tunnel is basically the same as fitted to XD-XE. I am happy to be proved wrong here  .
Nothing is going to be as simple as a pull out and bolt in no matter what you do.
You would either have to use an EA or pre EBII tranny ecu or V8 tranny ecu, you would then need to hook up a throttle position switch, speedo transducer is the same, gearbox yolk is the same but I think the 4 spd is a longer gearbox, so the tailshaft would need shortening.
Then you have to mount your new 4sp shifter.
So why do you hate the old BW auto? If you think you will kill it, you could instead bolt in a C4, as they were an option on some of the older Falcon 4.1, lower first gear and much stronger. |
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84_Fairlane
Fordmods Stock as a Rock
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Location: Wodonga VIC, Australia
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| Posted: Wed Apr 30, 2008 8:40 pm Post subject: |
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4spd's dont fit - its been tryed many times with a OHC conversion, all end up 3spd auto or manual
and C4's never came out behind 6's, but c9's did (had to clarify as ive seen wrong box's purchased before!) |
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gogetta
Fordmods - Getting Side Ways
Posts: 2559
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Location: melbourne, sunshine VIC, Australia
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| Posted: Wed Apr 30, 2008 8:43 pm Post subject: |
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| 84_Fairlane wrote: | 4spd's dont fit - its been tryed many times with a OHC conversion, all end up 3spd auto or manual
and C4's never came out behind 6's, but c9's did (had to clarify as ive seen wrong box's purchased before!) |
so u mean to say that ford redesigned the trans tunnel on the XG? |
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84_Fairlane
Fordmods Stock as a Rock
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| Posted: Wed Apr 30, 2008 8:45 pm Post subject: |
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| yes and sever other subtle bits and peices |
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briney
Fordmods - Smokin em up
Posts: 221
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Location: wilcannia NSW, Australia
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| Posted: Sat May 17, 2008 6:36 pm Post subject: |
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| have you given it a try to see how close it goes to fitting ? it may just need some hammer action. i put a C10 onto an escort motor once. i just got the centre hole in the escy's auto bellhousing bored out. then welded on some plates so it could all be bolted together. that was 5 years ago and it's still going strong. wiring in the trans computer won't be too hard either. you would need a tps somewhere. the relevant manual would tell you what other inputs you need. andd if everything went to plan, you might even be able to use the 4.0's converter. have you considered an aod ? still get the overdrive with less hassle. |
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gogetta
Fordmods - Getting Side Ways
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| Posted: Sat May 17, 2008 6:41 pm Post subject: |
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an AOD???
whats that, what are they out of? |
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snap0964
Technical Contributor
Age:44
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| Posted: Sat May 17, 2008 9:23 pm Post subject: |
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| gogetta wrote: | | so u mean to say that ford redesigned the trans tunnel on the XG? |
I think you'll find they just used an E series pressing - same for the XH too. |
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briney
Fordmods - Smokin em up
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| Posted: Sun May 18, 2008 2:19 pm Post subject: |
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| gogetta wrote: | an AOD???
whats that, what are they out of? |
they were used in the states behind 5.0 in mustangs ? still some friggin' with the bellhousing i suppose. |
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Xauterus
Fordmods Newbie
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| Posted: Sat Jun 07, 2008 6:01 pm Post subject: |
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I cant see why the 4 speed auto would not fit the tunnel. I have a XG and 4 speed in an XE ute and the only thing that hit was the gearbox mount which has to be modified to suit the 4 speed anyway.
Corey
PS I have a C4 behind a six that was factory |
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carnut1100
Fordmods Oompa Loompa
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| Posted: Tue Jun 10, 2008 3:54 pm Post subject: |
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That's good to know.
I am considering a 4.0 4sp conversion to an XE wagon.
It's gotta stay auto, or believe me, it wouldn't.
And I too hate the slug-o-matic.
I did 10,000km in 3 months in an auto XF and by the end I hated it with a passion!!! |
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XR9UTE
EFI Guru
Age:43
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| Posted: Wed Jun 11, 2008 12:06 am Post subject: |
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4spd auto's do fit in everything from XR-up without enlarging the trans tunnel...even V8 ones which have a bigger bellhousing!
AND FOR THE FOUR MILLIONTH TIME THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A f**k C9!
It's a 6 cylinder C4 for chrissake!!!!! |
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Gavsed
Fordmods Parts Gopher
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| Posted: Wed Jun 11, 2008 9:18 pm Post subject: |
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| i dont think ther is to much of a difference maybe im almost sure its just the bellhousing if anything |
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aaron_hogan
Fordmods - Smokin em up
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| Posted: Tue Jul 08, 2008 10:23 am Post subject: |
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i had a long hard think about this one. Given that the bellhousing is the issue, and there is no off the shelf part available to mate it to a crosslfow. What you have to do is get a BW35 or BW40 bellhousing and mill it so you are just left with the ring that bolts to the engine. The you'd have to get the BTR bellhousing and mill that in a similar way so that you maintain the depth of teh BTR bell. There is some degree of mis-match in height of the top bolts compared to crossflows but provided the majority of the bell housing is the same shape (and really it has to be as dictated by the size of the ring gear being the same) then it should be no problem to get it welded together by someone who knows what they are doing.
In saying to do this there is a point of caution that you would have to ensure that it is perfectly aligned. Even the slightest bit of mis-alignment or run-out willl destroy the gearbox and torque convertor. A respected car nut acquaintance of mine suggests more than 0.002" is enough to break things.
Then its just a case of wiring it up, tailshaft (maybe just an e-series one is the correct length???). Crossmember mods and shifter. VOILA!
Somebody give this a go! i reckon it would be really neat.
FWIW the only mod you can do to a 3spd BW is to stick a once cent coin in there for firmer shifts. They are still a s**t gearbox even with this mod done. |
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