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 Post subject: EL brake problems
Posted: Sun Apr 01, 2007 1:45 pm 
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Hi guys I have an EL Xr6 with abs, i recently had the need to change the pads in it and now I have very little braking, it feels like it needs bleeding but I tried to do this but it was extremely difficult and obviously didn't work.
My question is is it something to do with the abs that stops me from bleeding it properly and if so how do I do it properly?
If not does anybody have any suggestions to get my brakes back (the car will stop but the pedal goeas a long way down to get it to stop)
Cheers....

 

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Posted: Sun Apr 01, 2007 2:06 pm 
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Make sure AFTER you have bled the system that you remove the brake proportioning switch from under the master cylinder and give the pedal a good pump then replace the switch and this should bring the pedal feel up a bit. New pade also need some time to bed in. :shock: :D :D

 

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Posted: Sun Apr 01, 2007 4:39 pm 
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The trouble is that it doesn't seem to want to bleed properly is there a trick to bleeding brakes fitted with an abs system?

 

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Posted: Sun Apr 01, 2007 8:39 pm 
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outlawxr6 wrote:
The trouble is that it doesn't seem to want to bleed properly is there a trick to bleeding brakes fitted with an abs system?


Were the bleeder nipples clean??? They have a habit of filling up with sh!t and getting blocked.
When you did the pads, did you check the caliper slides were free to move???
Use silicone grease to lube them.
Were the pistons hard to push back in???

There's more to changing pads than people think.

 

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Posted: Sun Apr 01, 2007 9:42 pm 
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The slides seemed ok the pistons were firm but not too tight at least I don't think they were too tight, but trying to bleed them I almost needed to push the pedal through the floor to get any fluid out of any of them.
Do I need to have the ignition on with the abs?

 

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Posted: Sun Apr 01, 2007 11:04 pm 
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did you use a bleed kit to help you out? I get my girlfriend to help me bleed the brakes in the ef. no abs tho but on my friends VR commonwhore It had abs, and we had no problems bleeding those...

you may have needed to loosen off the bleed Nipple a bit more eh

I had to use stilsens steelsens or whatever the spelling is on the ef's front callipers as they were seized into them.
put the ea nipples on it and was all good.

 

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Posted: Sun Apr 01, 2007 11:53 pm 
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i've been told that with the abs models you need to have the ignition on while bleeding....
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Posted: Sun Apr 01, 2007 11:59 pm 
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nah, the fluid has to go through the lines anyway with the ignition on or off wont make any difference.
the pump wont go if the wheels aren't turning and the abs module doesn't sense wheel lock up.
you will need slightly more fluid then the normal non abs equipped model, but that is the price you pay for safety :)

outlaw are you going on any cruises in the near future?

sam

 

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Posted: Mon Apr 02, 2007 10:23 am 
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I undid the nipples a couple of turns and fluid did come out albeit it was very hard pushing the pedal, and I was using a bleeder kit.
I will try it again today to see if the ignition makes any difference.
As far as the cruise goes, I don't know but I doubt that my wife will be all that interested but we will see.....

 

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Posted: Mon Apr 02, 2007 10:27 am 
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maybe you could try with the engine running so youve got a bit of booster assistance...

 

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Posted: Mon Apr 02, 2007 11:09 am 
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Hello,

Firstly, I assume you forced the caliper piston in without touching the bleeder screws ?
If you opened the bleeder screws to get the piston it then you would have let air in... hence your problem.... you'll need to bleed the brakes.

When bleeding, ensure the engine is running, is best as a two man job, although the "one-man bleeder kit is OK as well.
I'll assume you know about having a plastic tube, bottle, how not to allow air back in, etc.

If you did not touch the bleeder when forcing the pistons back in then.... OK, it could be something wierd that happened when do forced the pistons back it, never had this happen to me so cannot advise.

But, from my experience would most likely be disc related. What does the surface of the disc look like ? If it is ripply and smooth then that is the effect (no brakes) you'll get with new pads, especially standard pads. Machine the disks and deglaze the pads before putting them back on.

I've expereince this same effect so many times that I now always machine the discs every time I change pads (I'm lucky in that the local servo has a machine and I have free access because they like me because I am such a nice person :).

Hope that helps.
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Posted: Mon Apr 02, 2007 12:11 pm 
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strip and rebuild the calipers... The seal kits are cheap enough. I just bled my brakes and it took 1.5 litres to get it really cleaned out. It's 2 years since I rebuilt them last and machined up some teflon sleeves as I was sick of the stupid rubber sleeve seizing up. My brakes improved out of site after these simple mods. The other thing I have found is the wheel brearings loosen up over a few thousand kays after you change them and it causes shuddering through the brake pedal and the discs need machining. hope this helps.!
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Posted: Mon Apr 02, 2007 12:20 pm 
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I removed the calipers from the car to push the pistons back in hence the reason I was bleeding them.


It appears that the key must be on as I just bled the system with the key but engine not running and the brakes are all fine now, excellent in fact!!!

Thanks for all the help guys...

 

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Posted: Mon Apr 02, 2007 9:04 pm 
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good to hear outlaw... I was of the same opinion as samftr, and didn't think it would affect the bleeding process having the ignition on or off. But after doing it myself, and now that you've done it, it does seem you need to have the key on to bleed the system.

Should make a post in the technical documents to help other people that may come across this.
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Posted: Tue Apr 03, 2007 5:22 pm 
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outlawxr6 wrote:
I removed the calipers from the car to push the pistons back in hence the reason I was bleeding them..

Any reason why you did that?

Just keep the old pad in on the piston side and use a 'G' clamp.
do it while the calipers are still connected to the brake line , but unbolted.

 

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