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| dope dogg |
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this forum should be posted to everyone young punk who wants to get their falc to warp speed on public road.
Just be thankful that this happened on a dyno
_________________ Now I'm disgruntled; before this I had been relatively gruntled |
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| Steady ED |
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This should almost be a sticky actually.
_________________ ED XR8 Sprint - S-Trim, V500, 249rwkw |
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| downingj |
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dope dogg wrote: this forum should be posted to everyone young punk who wants to get their falc to warp speed on public road.
Just be thankful that this happened on a dyno Hmmm. There seems to some VERY mature 20+ year olds on this forum who seem to know everything when it comes to speeding, and can apparantly tell you what sorts of speeds are appropriate for your car, the driver, the weather conditions, the road conditions, road usage, etc etc. Very smart people indeed... |
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| joolz |
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Its not a matter of the V8 shafts being stronger. Its simply because they are made of alloy and are lighter. If you look at the pics the shaft has ripped in the centre and not at the ends, this shows that the shaft flexed and would have been bending like a banana just before breaking. Now the steel shafts are heavier making it alot easier to flex in the centre at higher speeds, the alloy shafts being a lighter material can with stand flexing in the centre at higher speeds. The twist force on an alloy shaft is around 1200nm and steel is a little higher which is still alot more torque than any falcon can produce
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| TROYMAN |
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opto wrote: hans hartman wrote: stockstandard wrote: Ive had it happen to me. Took out the tailshaft, gearbox, and snapped the bellhousing in half. Scary s**t! we used to shear uni-joints,pinion drives and the welds on custom made tail shafts 25-30 years ago,with highly moded 6s and 8s, had to use 2 tail shaft hangers-loops.i am suprised street drag meets dont enforce using them,for the same reason.we had cars shear the gearbox uni-joint and dig the shaft in to the road and flip ,roll,some fatal. appears to be aluminium tail shaft or super light steel, for stock fraud,increase dia, of tude and wall thickness to suit kw of torque output and use v8s unis. used to run 140-160mph back in the 60s-70s but now radar!!!! better to find out on dyno-----than the road Yet somehow poeple think its safe to drive at 180kph+  So V8 tailshafts are stronger, will they fit in I6 auto from V8 auto ? hi i dont know how much stronger they are but the v8 tail shaft will fit straight into a 6. i have just fitted a ef/el xr8 tailshaft into my ea 5 speed (+ed diff) although im having some issues with the tailshaft rubbing on the floor on hard accelleration but that could be because its low..... |
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| data_mine |
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LWB (Fairlanes/LTDs) have a longer shaft than SWB (Falcons/Fairmonts).
I've picked up a XR shaft, and it's currently getting a thorough going over by the Diff Dr. here in Canberra. Balanced, new yoke, new unis. This will tide me over until I can get a better shaft made. Got to see under the car today. - Fuel / brake lines are OK 
- Trans tunnel has some big a** dings in it - Exhaust will need a new cat to first muff pipe otherwise it's fine. - Airbag 'smoke' stinks, and lingers like a f@rt in a elevator. - extension housing on the auto box is f**k to say the least, the rest of it is in pretty bad nick, you can see very far into the box. It managed to dump almost all of its oil, the tilt tray had a few drops on it after the trip home.
_________________ 1998 DL LTD in Sparkling Burgundy, daily, 302W, stereo, slow |
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| JOSE |
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funny you say it let got at 192 KMH, ive heard people say that the limiter is there because the auto boxes s**t themselvs at just over 190 in some cases, maybe the extension housing on the box let go first?
_________________ Because i can. |
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| twase |
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data_mine wrote: Now does anyone know if an XR6T BTR box will bolt up to an e-series ??? If so it'd be great, I'll get one of those. I would say you would need the ute box so you get the speedo sender and you will also need to swap your bell housing as they have different pattern to suit the sump of the BA, I would think everything else would be OK excepting the shifter connection. BTW I did a tailshaft at speed in my younger days when the circlip came out after a doggy install, all good except for the shaft and the gearbox extension housing snapped off.
_________________ BF Fairmont Ghia Series II update. Last edited by twase on Wed May 10, 2006 9:08 pm, edited 1 time in total. |
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| data_mine |
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JOSE wrote: funny you say it let got at 192 KMH, ive heard people say that the limiter is there because the auto boxes s**t themselvs at just over 190 in some cases, maybe the extension housing on the box let go first?
Funny you mention that, that thought went through my head earlier, cause I can't see how the tailshaft by itself could snap the extension housing.
_________________ 1998 DL LTD in Sparkling Burgundy, daily, 302W, stereo, slow |
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| JOSE |
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would explain how it came apart without any vibrations, if its from thrust forces in the extension housing they would just increase with speed, untill the housing broke and then that would cause the tailshaft to fail.
_________________ Because i can. |
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| Spork |
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data_mine wrote: JOSE wrote: funny you say it let got at 192 KMH, ive heard people say that the limiter is there because the auto boxes s**t themselvs at just over 190 in some cases, maybe the extension housing on the box let go first? Funny you mention that, that thought went through my head earlier, cause I can't see how the tailshaft by itself could snap the extension housing. No way. The box itself is the same one behind the XR6, and essentially the one behind the BA XR6 turbo and is rated to approximately 250km/h. I've done some work with tailshafts. you probabily hit the resonant frequency of the shaft. It's a 2nd order vibration that you don't always feel, it will suddenly increase in magnitude at a particular frequency causing tailshaft wirl. It's best to imagine it as a corkscrewing motion. This natural tendency would be magnified by the increased torque your engine is putting out and possibly by the harmonics coming out from your engine, especially given it's raised rev limiter. Basically your shaft failed in the middle where the vibrations are at their worst. The broken shaft was probabily close to 6000 RPM and this inertia is well enough to crack the extension housing. I have seen a shaft on an engine dyno break and it actually cracked the trans in two pieces! Hard luck. But a valuable lesson.
_________________ Manual EL Gli.
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| Dusty_Rhodes |
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Age: 44 Posts: 22 Joined: 2nd May 2006 Ride: 429 CJ XR7 & EL 5.0 Ghia Location: Coffs Harbour |
so what about wagon and fairlane owners? do they get a FBT tailshaft (ultra rare) or do they just get one custom made?
whats involved in custom making a tailshaft...is it like a 3inch thick steel rod or will that crack under pressure too.... and as for speed limiters, its not just that...its the monster torque figures some cars on here have achieved, a stock tailshaft wouldn't be use to it so the same thing that happened to DM could happen to a car with over 500nm of torque with an EF-EL tailshaft correct? As in, if someone with a twin turbo V8 or turbo 6 making 300rwkw decides to boot their EF-EL at 100km/h, the tailshaft could snap flipping the car into Rodger Commuter and his family of 3? Or how about seeing the tailshaft pierce the floor of your car impaling your passenger or yourself? Tailshaft loops for me it seems....
_________________ "Commodores are an error I intend to correct." |
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| joolz |
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This cracks me up so hard, all these people on here who think they know all about drive shafts and what different designs do. Yet not one of them work for a company that produces over 400 per day for the blue oval range of cars!!! No one even takes into account the info i give them yet they still know all.....i give up!!
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| hans hartman |
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data_mine wrote: Dyno read 192KM/H at the break point. I though engineers gave 30% tolerance. stock cars are built to spec. to handle all conditions,with warranty,and will do it for years easy,ive got 1.5 million ks on a stock diff., when you mod the motor,the motor will take it,any thing behind it has to be looked at,for replacement.thats why they require engineers certified,and they can get wrong due to unforseen problems,its a learning curve that costs time and money, in your case, the torque factor,most try to use less,and more revs to gain top end. good luck you can over power the body -stress cracks,hows your brakes? hmmmmmmmm
_________________ R.I.P HANS HARTMAN |
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| Mr EL XR6 5sp |
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So I wonder how far can a 5sp xr6 Tailshaft go?
I have had my EL past 220KM/hr (as far as the speedo goes) On a private road I might add. |
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