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ATTN WOLF & MSII OWNERS: Ignition maps for 4.0s 

 

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 Post subject: ATTN WOLF & MSII OWNERS: Ignition maps for 4.0s
Posted: Thu Dec 25, 2008 9:59 am 
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Hi guys,

I wanted to start this thread to discuss and share ignition timing maps for 4.0s, modified or stock. If you have an aftermarket ECU of any description you should be able to screenshot or cut/paste your timing map.

I have recently taken my stock map and added between 5% and 10% to the advance and not had any pinging yet. Adding advance down the bottom end has made a big difference to take-off and makes the car feel a lot livelier.

There is a very noticable dip in the stock advance in an EF/EL map from 2300-3400rpm in the stock map. Not sure why this is but I had noticed the dip when driving (due to my hi-stall, there is practlally no load on the engine till 3 grand, but it would still hesitate in the upper 2000s). I have smoothed this dip out by adding more spark and have noticed it pulls a lot smoother through that range.

Before looking at these maps... note that no less than 4 spark maps are used in an EEC- max torque, borderline knock, and 2 of the same for cruise mode (MPG). I have taken the Maximum Brake Torque (MBT) table and replaced the others to make tuning simpler. This is a common trick done by the US ford tuners & with delcos and similar.

STOCK (note the dip, highlighted):
Image

MODIFIED:
Image

I havent dyno'd any of this yet.

So please post your maps and what kind of mods you are running. It would be good to share 'base maps' for boosted/lpg/na applications.

Jason

Last edited by galapogos01 on Sun Dec 28, 2008 11:56 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Posted: Fri Dec 26, 2008 11:52 pm 
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does this mean the timing on EF's can be moved as well now?

 

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Posted: Sat Dec 27, 2008 12:41 am 
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If you have read the tuning thread, its been editable using the open definitions for over a year now.

If you are refering to 'moving' the distributor, they dont have one.
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Posted: Sat Dec 27, 2008 3:48 pm 
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i realise they dont have one. there is some sort of offset plate you can get to advance it.

great work to make std tuning on these engines possible for all mate

 

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Posted: Sat Dec 27, 2008 5:02 pm 
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fiftyone wrote:
i realise they dont have one. there is some sort of offset plate you can get to advance it.

great work to make std tuning on these engines possible for all mate


I believe the ignition timing is referenced from the crank position sensor, not the sync sensor

 

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Posted: Sun Dec 28, 2008 12:03 pm 
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wouldnt recommend dodgy offset plates, you mess with the ECUs interpretation of timing of the whole engine, including delaying the injectors etc. its a cheap hack but a proper solution isnt that much more expensive.

please try keep it OT guys, id like to collect some info here but so far nothing useful has come up.
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Posted: Sun Dec 28, 2008 12:56 pm 
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soz mate

 

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Posted: Sat Jan 03, 2009 9:43 am 
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When I get home i'll fire up the laptop and grab the maps from my Wolf3D tune that Rank Rotary did, see if there is any interesting information.

Perhaps the best purpose for this thread is to show the factory values which will allow aftermarket ecu's to have a very good base tune put in that can then be improved upon?
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Posted: Sat Jan 03, 2009 7:35 pm 
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Here is the EL XR6 MBT spark map. Compare it to the standard one above; its a reasonable difference!!

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Posted: Sat Jan 03, 2009 10:46 pm 
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I assume that table is load vs RPM - if so does it go to 107% load like the wolf3d or?

Also that's a huge difference to the standard map - what is fuelling like?
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Posted: Sat Jan 03, 2009 11:04 pm 
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Image

This is the tune that was on my EA. It wasn't fantastic but hopefully is helpful. It did boost quite fast however, not sure if that is a side effect of the tune or not.

Also I can get that in 125rpm increments (not sure how far down it was tuned?) if you would like.
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Posted: Sat Jan 03, 2009 11:49 pm 
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the eec tables are map vs rpm... effectively load.

great work - thats just what im after.

quick boosting is a function of the tune amongst other things; more ignition timing down low can help get on boost quicker, as long as you take some timing out when boost comes in.

hopefully we can collect a few more of these, boosted and N/A.

Jason
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Posted: Sun Jan 04, 2009 5:35 pm 
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OK, had a bit more of a tweak of the spark table. low down response improved even more, even on a hot day with the AC running.

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Posted: Sun Jan 04, 2009 6:03 pm 
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is MBT (maximum brake torque) the same as full load timing?

whats on the Y axis?...obviously X is RPM

dont really understand why its called such a strange name...

EDIT : found this is it right

"The PCM uses two tables to determine WOT timing.
The PCM will select the lower of the two values in whichever table it wants.
If you add timing only in the WOT table, but do not add to the MBT table, the PCM will use the lower spark value from the MBT table and you will not get advanced timing
"

why do they do it like this?

 

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Posted: Sun Jan 04, 2009 7:02 pm 
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Probably for safety.
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