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EF timing problem 

 

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 Post subject: Re: EF timing problem
Posted: Mon Jun 08, 2015 9:00 pm 
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vikketer wrote:
When I looped A and L to do the timing the timing mark on the pulley is approx 20 t0 30 mm on the right of the pointer so it is firing after TDC.
Provided you did a proper base timing check, sounds like it's running retarded.
TROYMAN wrote:
with the engine running (not in diagnostic mode) the ignition timing should be around 15-20 deg btdc..
And in your case, this might be around 0 deg, so confirms it's retarded. Gently increase revs - if timing advances, the ECU is not in LOS.

These EDIS ignition systems rely on where TDC is via the crank sensor and that toothed wheel, so there sounds like a damaged wheel, or misalignment. I haven't looked close enough to a balancer to see if the wheel is an outer fit, so it could move, or it is keyed to the crank.

 

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 Post subject: Re: EF timing problem
Posted: Mon Jun 08, 2015 10:38 pm 
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Have you checked to see if the Cat is blocked as suggested?

What happens when you try and rev it above 1200rpm?
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 Post subject: Re: EF timing problem
Posted: Tue Jun 09, 2015 12:33 am 
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Checked the cat.
When you try and rev it over 1200 it sometimes back fires , but it takes ages to get to 1200 gradually builds up . Without the timing bridged the timing stays retarded when trying to rev the motor
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 Post subject: Re: EF timing problem
Posted: Tue Jun 09, 2015 12:36 am 
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Will remove harmonic balancer tomorrow and have a good look at it, so much points to the signal being wrong.
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 Post subject: Re: EF timing problem
Posted: Tue Jun 09, 2015 12:41 am 
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as per snap and swc -
if you are definatly checking in base timing mode suggest checking your balancer against one at wreckers as I think it was this model that had problems with balancer turning on its rubber mounting when model was released putting teeth out of position


looks like you posted while I was typing which I suck at......
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 Post subject: Re: EF timing problem
Posted: Tue Jun 09, 2015 7:44 am 
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vikketer wrote:
Checked the cat.
When you try and rev it over 1200 it sometimes back fires , but it takes ages to get to 1200 gradually builds up . Without the timing bridged the timing stays retarded when trying to rev the motor

Does it advance from that position toward zero, or does the mark stay on the same retarded position ??

 

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 Post subject: Re: EF timing problem
Posted: Wed Jun 10, 2015 1:48 pm 
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Yay at last problem found, I removed the harmonic balancer and my first gut feeling was correct. The belt had jammed in between the pulley and the timing ring and had forced it toward the timing cover and spun it about 15 deg. It was actually chewing some aluminium of the timing cover. Fitted a new balancer and it started first go.
Thank you for all who have helped me with this puzzle, hopefully this may help someone else.
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 Post subject: Re: EF timing problem
Posted: Wed Jun 10, 2015 2:18 pm 
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Good find - and yes, chase the clues: evidence of a shredded fan belt.
The pickup wheel looks to be pressed onto the inner pulley, would take some force to dislodge it.

Post a pic if you could.

 

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97 EL Futura S/W: LPG, Alarm, LED int Lts, Trip Comp, F/Lane Dome Lt, Climate Ctrl, T5 Conversion

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 Post subject: Re: EF timing problem
Posted: Thu Jun 11, 2015 11:46 am 
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Hope this comes through OK note the space between the timing ring and the pulley. :D

 

 

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 Post subject: Re: EF timing problem
Posted: Thu Jun 11, 2015 11:48 am 
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And a top view

 

 

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 Post subject: Re: EF timing problem
Posted: Thu Jun 11, 2015 12:42 pm 
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Great pics - the missing tooth is nowhere near the timing mark.
If left on longer term, it would've given out, causing even more probs.

Dispells the myth you can adjust the timing in an EF. :?

 

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97 EL Futura S/W: LPG, Alarm, LED int Lts, Trip Comp, F/Lane Dome Lt, Climate Ctrl, T5 Conversion

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 Post subject: Re: EF timing problem
Posted: Thu Jun 11, 2015 6:07 pm 
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It's pretty easy to get the wheel off the balancer. I did so when inadvertently shipped an EL balancer when servicing my EF.

Cheers,
Jason
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 Post subject: Re: EF timing problem
Posted: Fri Jun 12, 2015 2:58 pm 
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I take it an EL balancer is the same as an EF one, just doesn't have the toothed wheel pressed on ?

 

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97 EL Futura S/W: LPG, Alarm, LED int Lts, Trip Comp, F/Lane Dome Lt, Climate Ctrl, T5 Conversion

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