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I'd still need to install the thermostat housing from an E series falcon, because the AU's don't have the thread tapped into them for a sensor, and i wouldn't want to tap a thread that large into cast alloy (eeek). I bet the heater hose will be fused to the housing aswell and i probably will have to go on a mission to find the gasket. I got a much simpler solution:
{DESCRIPTION} I'll simply screw it down onto whatever i can find on the engine with the same thread as the lug which is a tiny M3, then based on what the datasheet that comes with i'll choose a resistor (that i have on hand) to accentuate the temperature range around 60C. I'll probably try and find a thermistor with an M6 lug so i can connect it to the thread on the thermostat housing (maybe with a little drilling out) when i used to work at d**k we had thermistors which had like M5 or M6 lugs on them but alas DSE sucks these days so i'll have to look around, i'm not too fussed about getting the exact coolant temp so rekon an external bolt on solution will be the way to go
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dont take shortcuts... use a proper sensor, and change the thermostat housing if you have to.
How reliable do you think that thermistor will be, with its 0.5mm leads and the engine vibrations... and you want a sensor that will read > 100*C You need accuracy, if you ever intend on runnning thermo fans off the megasquirt |
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I intend to use the stock ECU for controlling the thermofans, i only really need a temperature reading so the MSII knows when to use HEGO closed loop control and when to stop startup-fuel-enrichment and a couple of other things. My understanding that exact temperature knowledge isn't essential, especially when simply knowing the temperature of the coolant only tells you a fraction of the story. It would be best to calculate the actual heat transfer to the coolant, so you'd need to know the temperature of the coolant before it cools the engine, the temperature after the cooling and the flow rate (ideally the density curve and the specific heat capacity curve with temperature at a particular concentration of coolant). I think its a fair assumption to assume that the thermostat housing eternal temperature is ~equal to the coolant temperature and can be assumed to represent the block temperature. I'll defo need a thermistor that'll go above 105C. The proper sensor is just an NTC thermistor anyway.
I agree with you tho lol, those leads will probably wear out fairly quickly and i doubt i'll be able to find a thermistor with a lug big enough to bolt onto anything existing anyway. I'm reluctant because i remember trying to remove a thermostat housing from an EA engine in the past and the heating pipe was completely fused to it. In the end i removed the pipe as well, (i was replacing the thermostat housing in my old EB). Do you know how those heating pipes are sealed onto the thermostat housings? is it just a press fit? the use of sillicone? I might try coventries and see how much it costs to buy an EA housing new (if they are available) i went in there a little while ago and they couldn't get hold of the gaskets any more, so i'll have to use sillicone  . I noticed that the AU housing is basically the same as the EA/EB but they haven't tapped the thread for the sensor. Would you say its worth tapping my own thread insitu to match the stock sensor thread?
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God its about time I updated my progress
 (or lack of it)Got a nice soldering station for christmas, none of the plug in jobbies I had would of been sutable for this job  What size solder are you guys using though? and temp do your run the soldering iron at? I plan to have the car running on the MS by april, I want to have completly backwards compatabe though so if I have to go back to the EEC I can without fuss, I'll leave the dissy in to plug the hole until I know I have it down pat then I'll put the AU item in. Love reading the posts in this thread, very informative. 
_________________ {DESCRIPTION} < Click on it! You know you want too! Quote: Thats not the point *a**hole
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{USERNAME} wrote: Do you know how those heating pipes are sealed onto the thermostat housings? is it just a press fit? the use of sillicone? I might try coventries and see how much it costs to buy an EA housing new (if they are available) i went in there a little while ago and they couldn't get hold of the gaskets any more, so i'll have to use sillicone . I noticed that the AU housing is basically the same as the EA/EB but they haven't tapped the thread for the sensor. Would you say its worth tapping my own thread insitu to match the stock sensor thread?They seal with an O-ring if I remember correctly, I have a spare AU lower housing spare if you want it. I would think you could get the upper and lower housings new though. The AU/EB lower housings have the same bolt pattern on the head end but not the thermostat end. EA/EB/ED use a rubber ring around the thermostat to seal but the AU's use a proper gasket. I have an AU engine in my ED, so I'm using the sensors in the thermostat housing, but if possibe I'm going to use the AU temp sensor in the back of the head for the MS as its brand new.
_________________ {DESCRIPTION} < Click on it! You know you want too! Quote: Thats not the point *a**hole
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thanks for the offer on the lower housing, i'm going to look into tapping the thread into the existing one, hopefully i can do that without taking it off the engine but we'll see i don't want to get swarf in my coolant system so maybe i'll pull it out, and if i pull it out i'll just get an ea/eb one from a wreker lol. theres no point grabbing it if your in SA its a bit of a drive lol, maybe when i'm tuning the MSII but then i wouldn't need it then. i can't wait till my next wrekker trip lol, i wanna get hold of the tickford plastics to shroud the engine and the XR8 intake snorkle and maybe a spoiler. its no suprise i never have money for all that long, i wish i had a spare few hundred dollars for a broadband O2 sensor
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hay i took control of fuel the other yesterday (worked straight away), i was trying to tune the fuel map, although the signal from my hego sensor goes from say 0.75V then drop to 0.05V then jump back up again. Is that just characteristic of a narrow band sensor, or is there a loose wire somewhere? i noticed it jumping around all over the place when it was connected to the stock ecu, but i figured that was due to s**t closed loop tuning.
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a narrowband sensor is only good for indicating the stoic point, as you have noticed the voltage changes rapidly either side of stoic.
Your best off using a wideband o2 to get an indication of the a/f ratios. Also a new version of tunerstudio was released with a beta ve analyser live function |
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it jumps even when i havent made any changes and its rich, could it be due to the stock ecu adjusting the spark timing?
like the revs n baro is constant, the injection duty cycle is constant, one second its .75 then occassionally drops to nothing at all (~0.05v). i will get a broadband when i got a spare $200, would make tuning alot easier! is there a widely available car that has the broadband element and element controller, that i could find in a wrecker or something? so far DIYautotune looks like my best option when it comes to finding a broadband controller and element
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it could be a bad sensor, or the sensor could be fouled from being too rich,
Also if its too rich, the sensor will show as lean, due to the unburnt fuel. try leaning it out a bit and see what happens. best using an LC-1 or , doubt you will find anything at wreckers |
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f**k it, i'll just buy one on credit card. i'll worry about it later, good thing the aus dollar is strong against the US atm
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did it, ended up costing AUS$290, which isn't bad, i should get it in the next three days
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{USERNAME} wrote: God its about time I updated my progress (or lack of it)Got a nice soldering station for christmas, none of the plug in jobbies I had would of been sutable for this job What size solder are you guys using though? and temp do your run the soldering iron at? I plan to have the car running on the MS by april, I want to have completly backwards compatabe though so if I have to go back to the EEC I can without fuss, I'll leave the dissy in to plug the hole until I know I have it down pat then I'll put the AU item in. Love reading the posts in this thread, very informative. i'd love a temp controlled station but never had one lol, i think when i put my board together i was using a 20watt soldering iron, now i got 20W with a 130W "boost" button, which is great as when its heating up it'll run at 40W. most of the components on the board are fairly robust so i don't think you have to worry about cooking them. I cant give you an exact temp tho lol, i guess if your station is 0-100W or something then (provided the control knob is linear) maybe only turn it one fifth the way around or whatever, since 20W does me absolutly fine. You don't want to get "cold" joins, so provided your not going to cook anything hotter is better in my opinion
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{USERNAME} wrote: a narrowband sensor is only good for indicating the stoic point, as you have noticed the voltage changes rapidly either side of stoic. Your best off using a wideband o2 to get an indication of the a/f ratios. Also a new version of tunerstudio was released with a beta ve analyser live function is tunerstudio okay to use on MSe? --- sorry to answer my question, yes it is lol. should look before asking thanks
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{USERNAME} wrote: you can piggyback the stock VR sensor brown wire, but you need to connect the stock VR - (grey wire) to the MSII gnd also. It will work. Generally set you MSII pots full CCW, then 1 turn CW on each. Tooth 1 angle is 60* btdc, therefore the missing tooth is 70*. This is how the ecu's determine the ign timing - if tooth 1 was TDC then it could only predict the timing, not calculate it. Dont worry too much about the injector banks and sequencing causing it not to idle, just set it up with the two banks, 1-2-3 and 4-5-6, 2 squirts simultaneous. You dont need to use the sync sensor, but you can connect it if you want to set up semi-seqential or sequential injection at a later stage (MS3). You need to build a second VR interface for the sync sensor, using an LM1815 is the best way to go. for the PWM valve, a TIP120 will work, but your much better off using an IGBT for it (same as coil driver) also a 1N4004 diode from the - side of the PWM valve and band side to +12v ign to reduce flyback effects. the PWM settings are a bit tricky to get right, but persevere with it, and you will get good results. i'm having some problems!! turns out the ms2e sparks in the order r29 r27 r26, i thought it was r26, r27, r29, so i had to swap around coil one and coil three. i can't get it to start tho! so what do i put for my trigger angle/offset, how many pulses? is it rising edge caption? what should i have for cranking dwell and cranking advance? i got 6ms and 10deg is tooth #1 the missing tooth, or the tooth after? so tooth #1 angle btdc is 70 or 60 deg (i had 60)
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