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Wolf 3d v4 in ef 

 

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 Post subject: Wolf 3d v4 in ef
Posted: Tue Dec 06, 2005 2:56 pm 
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Hey, im just wondering what needs to be changed to fit a wolf to a ef running the coil packs. I remember a while back speaking to someone from microtech and they said the coils had to be changed to run one of their computers, is this the same with the wolf? Also can i use the stock water and air temp sensors? as i dont have the wolf ones. Any help would be great.

 

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Posted: Tue Dec 06, 2005 5:00 pm 
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hi

the ciol pack on ur ef can be run with the 3D wolf version4

u have to get a special igniter to make the coil pack work in conjuction witht he wolf which is extr dollars

most other engine managment systems need the 3 module igniter also to make the coil pack work with ECU

the igniter sells between $200 upto $350 depending what brand u buy they all varry in prices

yes u can use ur standard air and water temp sensors on the wolf

let me know if u need one i can supply u a unit and also help with other wolf associated stuff and information


cheers

 

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Posted: Tue Dec 06, 2005 6:10 pm 
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FPV_GTp wrote:
hi

the ciol pack on ur ef can be run with the 3D wolf version4

u have to get a special igniter to make the coil pack work in conjuction witht he wolf which is extr dollars

most other engine managment systems need the 3 module igniter also to make the coil pack work with ECU

the igniter sells between $200 upto $350 depending what brand u buy they all varry in prices

yes u can use ur standard air and water temp sensors on the wolf

let me know if u need one i can supply u a unit and also help with other wolf associated stuff and information


cheers


The group buys ivan do they also need to purchase the extras for the ignition system

 

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Posted: Wed Dec 07, 2005 8:33 am 
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Big Kev wrote:
FPV_GTp wrote:
hi

the ciol pack on ur ef can be run with the 3D wolf version4

u have to get a special igniter to make the coil pack work in conjuction witht he wolf which is extr dollars

most other engine managment systems need the 3 module igniter also to make the coil pack work with ECU

the igniter sells between $200 upto $350 depending what brand u buy they all varry in prices

yes u can use ur standard air and water temp sensors on the wolf

let me know if u need one i can supply u a unit and also help with other wolf associated stuff and information


cheers


The group buys ivan do they also need to purchase the extras for the ignition system


hi kev

depends on what ignition system ur running BigKev , no module is supplied with the system .


what ignition system are u running ?? year and make of ur vehicle ?

and if u plan to run a turbo application then one should consider a higher energy coil and module system as for boost application the spark has to be stronger as compared to normally aspirated engines where the standard ignition system will not cope with the higher cylinder pressures.

wolf allows u to run one coil right upto a waste spark system V12 cylinder engine or even individual coil setup per cylinder application

MSD is a american brand that most people use but is not the best value for money there is a M&W company here in sudtralia that i deal with and they make all the igniters and CD high energy systems for the touring car racing teams so they must be good if these teams are using them.

cheers

 

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Posted: Wed Dec 07, 2005 9:29 am 
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Righto thanks heaps for that FPV_GTp, when it comes time to install the wolf i'll be in touch about the ignighter

 

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Posted: Wed Dec 07, 2005 9:16 pm 
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FPV_GTp wrote:
Big Kev wrote:
FPV_GTp wrote:
hi

the ciol pack on ur ef can be run with the 3D wolf version4

u have to get a special igniter to make the coil pack work in conjuction witht he wolf which is extr dollars

most other engine managment systems need the 3 module igniter also to make the coil pack work with ECU

the igniter sells between $200 upto $350 depending what brand u buy they all varry in prices

yes u can use ur standard air and water temp sensors on the wolf

let me know if u need one i can supply u a unit and also help with other wolf associated stuff and information


cheers


The group buys ivan do they also need to purchase the extras for the ignition system


hi kev

depends on what ignition system ur running BigKev , no module is supplied with the system .


what ignition system are u running ?? year and make of ur vehicle ?

and if u plan to run a turbo application then one should consider a higher energy coil and module system as for boost application the spark has to be stronger as compared to normally aspirated engines where the standard ignition system will not cope with the higher cylinder pressures.

wolf allows u to run one coil right upto a waste spark system V12 cylinder engine or even individual coil setup per cylinder application

MSD is a american brand that most people use but is not the best value for money there is a M&W company here in sudtralia that i deal with and they make all the igniters and CD high energy systems for the touring car racing teams so they must be good if these teams are using them.

cheers


Ivan Just the stock ignition system in the 96 EF XR6 - havent modififed it at all

 

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Posted: Thu Dec 08, 2005 8:41 am 
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I had trouble piddy backing the temp sensors between the Ford ECU and my Wolf(Could just be because I'm dumb :D ). With the Coil Packs I've used a M&W igniter to fire the coils. All seems to be working well with it, but I have had 2 broken coil packs, (Most likely unrelated to the M&W unit)

I had trouble getting the 36-1 setup running, and Wolf needed to make up a filter board to get it to work correctly. The setup is still not perfect, as the car has a miss at low RPM/load. I'm still trying to get hold of Wolf to try and fix the problem.

I would be interested in hearing from people running the Wolf on their EF/AU's to see if they are having the same problem.
Also if you need a base map to get started send me a PM, I'll be happy to help out..

Cheers
Tim
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Posted: Fri Dec 09, 2005 8:39 am 
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tjb45 wrote:
I had trouble piddy backing the temp sensors between the Ford ECU and my Wolf(Could just be because I'm dumb :D ). With the Coil Packs I've used a M&W igniter to fire the coils. All seems to be working well with it, but I have had 2 broken coil packs, (Most likely unrelated to the M&W unit)

I had trouble getting the 36-1 setup running, and Wolf needed to make up a filter board to get it to work correctly. The setup is still not perfect, as the car has a miss at low RPM/load. I'm still trying to get hold of Wolf to try and fix the problem.

I would be interested in hearing from people running the Wolf on their EF/AU's to see if they are having the same problem.
Also if you need a base map to get started send me a PM, I'll be happy to help out..

Cheers
Tim



where and whom did u buy the wolf from ???

firstly if ur coils are broken like u said has nothing to do with the wolf or the M&W igniters , thats common problem with coil packs where one coil or multi coils fail and cause all sorts of probleems

yes u need a filter box to staberlize the hall affect sensor signal from the crankshafter referance signal as the voltage out of thoses sensors are eratic

Base map would help to start the engine and have at least , just wondering if u have set all the paramaters correctly in ur wolf

probabley a better setup of the ignition coils would be individual coils and module for each cylinder its a bit combussom but at least if one coil fails u just replace one not the the whole coil pack . inital coil setup will be a bid dearer but its worth it in the long run.

i should have my coil pack system up and running soon in my EA will inform u , but i should see no problem the wolf running the system cause it can have seen it on other coilpacked cars.

i would be re-checking the setup again its is most likely a slight error on ur behalf , seen it so quiet often .

cheers

 

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Posted: Fri Dec 09, 2005 9:14 am 
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Thanks FPV.
Like I said I don’t think the Wolf had anything to do with the Coil Packs, I think I've just been a little unlucky.

In relation to the Miss. When I first put the wolf in, I was told the 36-1 setup from the EF would work fine. I set the Wolf up to suit, but could'nt get it to read the RPM correctly, it would read about 80,000 RPM at cranking speed. I called Wolf and they said they hadn’t tested the 36-1 on a car yet, but said if I modified my trigger wheel ( grind nearly all the teeth off) that it would work. I did that, but then the Ford ECU stopped picking up RPM, the auto didn’t work correctly, the Air con wouldn't work and so on.
After about 6 months wolf released an update to fix the 36-1 setup. I got mine updated, put a new trigger wheel (harmonic Balancer) on my car, and set it up, as per instructions. The car started and run fine. but would not rev over 3500rpm, it was like it would hit a rev limiter. (No miss at low RPM)
I took the car down to Melbourne and left it with Steve from Wolf, and he made up the filter board, and setup the wolf again. After that it would Rev correctly, but it had a random miss around 1000rpm. This wasn't much of a problem as it only gave a little miss as I accelerated slowly from a stop every now and then.
After getting it tuned a few weeks ago, the Random miss has now moved to be around 1500rpm. As you could imaging this has become highly annoying as the car is at that RPM quite often, and therefore it miss’s heaps while driving around town.
I got someone to check on the laptop while I was driving, and the miss mainly happens at the 28 load point.
Considering Steve from Wolf, actually setup the triggering side of the Wolf in my car I would of assumed it to be correct.

What sort of coil setup are you running on your car? I assume you are going to be running V4 plus to run a coil on plug setup?? Also are you running the EF/AU style crank angle sensor? I was thinking about the late model commodore Coil setup to replace mine, but im unsure if they will provide a stronger spark or not..

I’ll upload a map tonight, The only thing is, it has been tuned with 360cc injectors, but you should be able to work out fuel rates roughly with the modifying the overall trim.

Cheers
Tim
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Posted: Fri Dec 09, 2005 2:31 pm 
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tjb45 wrote:
Thanks FPV.
Like I said I don’t think the Wolf had anything to do with the Coil Packs, I think I've just been a little unlucky.

In relation to the Miss. When I first put the wolf in, I was told the 36-1 setup from the EF would work fine. I set the Wolf up to suit, but could'nt get it to read the RPM correctly, it would read about 80,000 RPM at cranking speed. I called Wolf and they said they hadn’t tested the 36-1 on a car yet, but said if I modified my trigger wheel ( grind nearly all the teeth off) that it would work. I did that, but then the Ford ECU stopped picking up RPM, the auto didn’t work correctly, the Air con wouldn't work and so on.
After about 6 months wolf released an update to fix the 36-1 setup. I got mine updated, put a new trigger wheel (harmonic Balancer) on my car, and set it up, as per instructions. The car started and run fine. but would not rev over 3500rpm, it was like it would hit a rev limiter. (No miss at low RPM)
I took the car down to Melbourne and left it with Steve from Wolf, and he made up the filter board, and setup the wolf again. After that it would Rev correctly, but it had a random miss around 1000rpm. This wasn't much of a problem as it only gave a little miss as I accelerated slowly from a stop every now and then.
After getting it tuned a few weeks ago, the Random miss has now moved to be around 1500rpm. As you could imaging this has become highly annoying as the car is at that RPM quite often, and therefore it miss’s heaps while driving around town.
I got someone to check on the laptop while I was driving, and the miss mainly happens at the 28 load point.
Considering Steve from Wolf, actually setup the triggering side of the Wolf in my car I would of assumed it to be correct.

What sort of coil setup are you running on your car? I assume you are going to be running V4 plus to run a coil on plug setup?? Also are you running the EF/AU style crank angle sensor? I was thinking about the late model commodore Coil setup to replace mine, but im unsure if they will provide a stronger spark or not..

I’ll upload a map tonight, The only thing is, it has been tuned with 360cc injectors, but you should be able to work out fuel rates roughly with the modifying the overall trim.

Cheers
Tim


hi

interesting reading , the misfire i have answer , im going to finish connecting all my gear soon and will give u some feed back


i still would be checking plugs leads coilpack ???????

cheers

 

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Posted: Fri Dec 09, 2005 4:53 pm 
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Tried two different coil packs, brand new 10mm leads (made no difference to the standard 8mm ones) put soooo many difference sets of plugs in it.. Tried difference plug gaps... new crank angle sensor, ran a separate cable from the crank angle sensor around out side of the car, just to make sure there is no noise from the loom interfering.

I'm fairly sure its to do with the ECU, as it was missing at 1000rpm then after a tune it moved to around 1500rpm.

Will be good to hear how you go when you get yours running..

Cheers
Tim
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Posted: Fri Dec 09, 2005 4:57 pm 
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tjb45 wrote:
Tried two different coil packs, brand new 10mm leads (made no difference to the standard 8mm ones) put soooo many difference sets of plugs in it.. Tried difference plug gaps... new crank angle sensor, ran a separate cable from the crank angle sensor around out side of the car, just to make sure there is no noise from the loom interfering.

I'm fairly sure its to do with the ECU, as it was missing at 1000rpm then after a tune it moved to around 1500rpm.

Will be good to hear how you go when you get yours running..

Cheers
Tim


hi

can u pin piont what cylinder is misfiring ??

but if u had a poor tune u may have tranfered the misfire to a different rev range



cheers

 

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Posted: Fri Dec 09, 2005 5:01 pm 
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hi

dont know how u installed the 3D wolf version4 into ur car meaning how much wiring u cut into

but to eliminate the msfire , how hard would it be to fun the ford factory ECU back on ur car ?

and run the car under load and check for misfire

cheers

 

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Posted: Sat Dec 10, 2005 9:11 am 
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I don’t think I could run the Ford ECU now, I've got different injectors, different base fuel pressure, just to name a few things. Also the miss only occurred when the filter board was put in the car, so I'm fairly sure it is related to that. There is a lot of difference between the two tunes (one with the miss at 1000rpm, and the second with the miss at 1500rpm) so it might be that its using a different load setting at that RPM

I'm not sure I have the equipment to find out if it is an individual cylinder that has the miss or not. Under full acceleration the miss doesn't appear to be there also under no load (in neutral) I cant make it miss., Its only under light acceleration that it appears. I might load the old map and see if I can find any similarities when the miss occurs at 1000rpm...
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Posted: Sat Dec 10, 2005 9:53 am 
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This is my original Map, over a year old, It was done using the Modified trigger wheel, and standard fuel system. It started and run great, but had very little power.
http://www.wssc.vic.edu.au/turbo/hp%20tune.wmf

This is about 6 months ago. Setup is with standard EF trigger wheel(harmonic balancer), with filter board from wolf installed. Has 360cc injectors, walbro fuel pump, and 2-1 malpassi regulator running 80psi at idle (way to high I know). Started ok but had a bit of a rev flare at starting (up to about 1700rpm) and a few problem with holding at 2000rpm in natural some times. Easy problems to fix with a few setting changes.
Also this is the tune that had the random miss between 900-1300rpm

http://www.wssc.vic.edu.au/turbo/Miss%2 ... 0-1300.wmf

I hope this helps a little.

The last file represents a bit over $2000 worth of collective tuning.. Sad I know, but I had my car tuned at some very average places before I decided to take it to Melbourne to find someone that knew what they were doing...
Moral of the story, find a good tuner, and stick with them, I got sucked into placed that said they knew how to tune my car, but had no idea at all, in the end they did more damage then good.


Good luck..
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