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Advancing timing on EL falcon 

 

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Posted: Sun Apr 27, 2008 12:04 pm 
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So to advance the timing a little, the marker has to be on the left hand side?

 

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Posted: Sun Apr 27, 2008 10:46 pm 
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do you have to put the car in base ign timing mode on eb to adjust timing??
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 Post subject: Re: Advancing timing on EL falcon
Posted: Mon Dec 28, 2009 7:20 pm 
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just want to thank you for your detailed instructions for doing the base timing

ive had my EL Fairmont for 2 years and got a timing light yesterday, after reading this post out i went to do my own car.

low and behold mine was retarded with the notch sitting about 4-6mm to the right of the mark.

a quick twist of the dizzy, tighten the nut and a road test proved to be most enjoyable.

i thought my car had some oomph before but wow, setting it at 4deg btc has made a huge and i mean huge difference albeit i was running retarded to start with.

much more low end power, smoother idle, and an all round a better, smoother, more responsive car to drive.

thanks again EL__Fairmont

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 Post subject: Re: Advancing timing on EL falcon
Posted: Mon Dec 28, 2009 8:19 pm 
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Mine is an ED, and I have it running at 16.9* advanced ( in set timing mode ), and I use 95 RON.
Thats using an OTC timing light. It doesn't ping, even on hot days, or up hills.
Definately feels better on cool nights.

 

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Posted: Sun Feb 06, 2011 1:31 pm 
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fiftyone wrote:
GeZza200 wrote:
fiftyone wrote:
EL__Fairmont wrote:
Well I advanced it about 4 degrees just to be safe. Very happy with the results.


f**k! if thats 4 deg advance, i must be running about anywhere from 10 to 20! i just happen to find a light the other day and i checked and the timing is WAY out.

still get relitivly good fuel econony tho. just get absolute s**t house performace


Are you the dude that siad you car does 0-100 in like 10seconds or somthing? if you are, get your timing set asap. Im sure thats why yours is not going so good.


mate try the 100 in 12! its dead slow. that pic of the timing light, was that taken with the car in diag mode (paper clip in the fuse box area) to calibrate? cause i did mine normally. it was around here somewhere



is the green mark bad because thats where my marks is. i think my timing is out

 

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 Post subject: Re: Advancing timing on EL falcon
Posted: Mon Sep 08, 2014 3:35 pm 
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Hi Folks, I know there are a million posts out there on this subject, but I thought I would post my findings in the view they might help you.

I bought a OTC 5605 Compression kit, OTC 5613 Vacuum Kit and a Equus Innova 5568 timing light off Amazon $232.76 the lot delivered. Magic.

I've got a 98' EL Futura Wagon Sapphire II, one of the last ones made which I've had since new. Those in Perth its the Silver Artic Frost Wagon that looks like an XR6.

I fitted a BFII XR6T/V8 top snorkel that came of another car, K&N, and Redback 2.5" mandrel bent exhaust system and hi-flow metal cat.
NGK leads, plugs and O2 sensor. Bosch dizzy cap and arm. Run it on 98 and have done, since it became available.

I had a play with the base timing a while ago and set it to 12deg as that's what I read on line was safe to go to. Ho Hum, still a bit sluggish. Got there but took its time.

So my toys arrived from the states last week and I thought Il have another go. Did a lot of reading on line etc, there are some great articles on setting timing etc. I read one guy who was running 18deg Base timing with no problems. emmmm?

Years ago, I was shown by an old guy who worked on Manx Nortons, Vincents, and old racing cars how to set the base timing using a Vacuum gauge and timing light. Never forgotten it, he was a legend.
So I did a compression test on my 16yr old car with 140K on the clock. Dry they were between 180-185! I couldn't believe it. Wet 190-200. Some were taken with the butterfly shut as I forgot to open it! so I was rapt, she's in good nick. Gave me an idea of how much advance it would take.

So I hooked up the timing light and connected the vacuum gauge to the brake booster hose. Easy.
Took the air box and snorkel off etc. Got it all warmed up.
Shorted out the pins in the fuse box etc and started it up. WAITED for it to do its thing and drop the timing in Base Mode. Measured 12deg, nothing had moved. Loosened off the dizzy bolt and turned the dizzy anti clock wise. I was surprised how much I was able to turn it, keeping an eye on the vacuum gauge waiting for it to run rough etc.
Found the point and as the Legend said, "Now back the timing off till the vacuum gauge drops by 2 inches or 2deg which ever is greater".
I knocked it back by 2 and a bit inches of vacuum, which is more than 2deg's just to be safe.

I then checked the timing. Guess what it was? The EL now has 18deg of base timing at idle in TEST Mode and 38deg of Dynamic Advance at idle in NON Test mode. Ie normal.
So I took it for a spin expecting to hear it ping it's head off. NO. So I found some steep hills to go up under full load. No pinging, not a sound. What?
So I checked the exhaust note. The Legend said it should make a "POP" misfire sound. Hard to explain it here, but like a brurr, pop, pop, burr, pop etc sound. Perfect!

WOW what a difference. No problems starting, in fact it starts easier now and no funny Rich smelling exhaust. It spins up quicker and no hesitation. Doesn't run any hotter, run on or anything.

You don't have to worry about the idle as the ECU and idle speed take care of all of this.
I wish I'd done this 16yrs ago! I'm tempted to give it a bit more. There's probably only a degree or so in it, but it's on the side of caution, no need to collapse the lands then go oh oh.

I hope this helps and gives some idea on how far you can go. Proceed with caution. Don't forget I'm running RON98.

 

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 Post subject: Re: Advancing timing on EL falcon
Posted: Sat Sep 13, 2014 4:07 am 
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The el Fairmont is still going great. Gifted the car to my mother in law. Although I service it. I got a 4x4s now, got a triton Dualcab .....base timing is 10 degrees advanced of ign timing. So yeah that sounds ok

 

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 Post subject: Re: Advancing timing on EL falcon
Posted: Fri Sep 26, 2014 5:52 pm 
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Well i have an Dual Fuel EL and i was wondering if i can adjust the time for the LPG so it goes better and is not as sluggish....

And if could how much timing i would have to adjust?
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 Post subject: Re: Advancing timing on EL falcon
Posted: Fri Sep 26, 2014 9:30 pm 
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Just follow the steps I did and also reset your ecu using the correct procedure works a treat.

 

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 Post subject: Re: Advancing timing on EL falcon
Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2014 11:54 am 
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Ok, but i know LPG and petrol have different degrees on the timing tho, and i want to know how much to advance it?
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 Post subject: Re: Advancing timing on EL falcon
Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2014 12:10 pm 
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what petrol do you run when not on lpg? if you run 91 octane there is no point adjusting the timing more than a couple degrees, if you run the car on 95 or 98 when on petrol it would be fine to go up 5 or so degrees without a problem.

 

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 Post subject: Re: Advancing timing on EL falcon
Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2014 12:35 pm 
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You can get a box that will alter the timing when on LPG. Taxi mobs fit them.
If you don't want to bother with this, follow my instruction.
Use a vacuum gauge and adjustable timing light.
Listen for pinging, the knock sensor will kick in, but you don't want to run on it.

The vacuum gauge will tell you when you've gone far enough. Then back it off 2deg or 2" which ever is the greatest.
Mike

 

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 Post subject: Re: Advancing timing on EL falcon
Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2014 9:48 pm 
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I do run 91 on petrol, But i run mostly LPG but i want to advance the timing to get more torque, so i want to know how much to advance.
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 Post subject: Re: Advancing timing on EL falcon
Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2014 10:26 pm 
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E'mm, in one hand you have 91RON and in the other you have LPG with a RON correct me if I'm wrong of about 110.
Your options as far as I know, would be to tune your dizzy to suit 91 and get one of those boxes that advances the timing when you switch to LPG.
or
Switch to 98RON and set your tune to it, then when you switch over to LPG you wont hurt anything as the RON of LPG is higher!

I'd confirm with your LPG provider just to be sure. But when we were playing around with LPG they always run smoother and have more pep, providing you tune for it!

I dont know what sort of system you have, (mixer on top of the carb or throttle body) but a taxi management client of mine said Air Cleaners were real important to performance etc.
To free and they wont pull the gas properly, clogged and it will pull to much. So you have to have it tuned with the air cleaner in good shape, K&N I guess.

Good Luck.

 

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 Post subject: Re: Advancing timing on EL falcon
Posted: Mon Sep 29, 2014 7:33 am 
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OK, so do you know what the LPG box is called to advance the timing?

I might try to switch to 98 and advance the timing on both and i need to change the air filter any way.

My setup up is vapour, an IMPCO mixer and convertor, so its an Model L 200 mixer with an Power adjuster.
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