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benefit of removing front bonnet rubber seal. 

 

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Posted: Wed Oct 12, 2005 12:47 am 
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Yeah Slick removing the seal will give more air flow pressure into the engine bay but thats not where you want it, the seal stops air flowing into the engine bay and channels it to the snorkel. All this air being collected across the head lights,grill and bonnet lip is directed straight to the snorkel creating a high pressure area, so the engine doesnt have to suck it in. Its not forced induction but along the same lines.

 

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Posted: Wed Oct 12, 2005 1:47 am 
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4.9 EF Futura wrote:
That's defectable as well. Having said this, im contemplating removing mine. There is a reasonable amount of ambient heat generated by the supercharger - it would be good to get it out of the bay as opposed to have it soak into the engine componentry....


good chance to install some ef xr6 vents? ;)

i was keen to do this. any problems with it? install ef xr6 vents to the bonet with it open to the engine bay so the hot air can escape?

 

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Posted: Wed Oct 12, 2005 6:20 pm 
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If the XR6 & 8 don't need it, so will I.
any way I got all the cold air I need from the two home made air scoop for the tickford snorkle & the extra supplementary intake tube.

Its a bit slippery in the rear now, jumpy of the lights & more responsive.

Many times I've reversed the inprovement I've made, back and forth, back & forth for the sake of comparision.

I can tell you now, that rubber weather, dust, air directional pressurizer strip did nothing compare to it now. :lol:

 

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Posted: Wed Oct 12, 2005 6:22 pm 
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hmmmm maybe u can leave the rubber abound the back and sides and around snorkle but take it off from the right of the snorkle the the edge of the battery sorta thing.

so u get cool air comming in and the air is directed to the snorkle and averything is still sealed ?

win win i just might do that what a great idea lollllllllllll and take of the plastic on my ef xr6 wooooohooooooo.
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Posted: Wed Oct 12, 2005 6:25 pm 
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BNKRBR wrote:
hmmmm maybe u can leave the rubber abound the back and sides and around snorkle but take it off from the right of the snorkle the the edge of the battery sorta thing.

so u get cool air comming in and the air is directed to the snorkle and averything is still sealed ?

win win i just might do that what a great idea lollllllllllll and take of the plastic on my ef xr6 wooooohooooooo.
:lol: :idea: :idea: :idea: :idea: :idea: :idea: :idea:

 

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Posted: Thu Oct 13, 2005 7:57 pm 
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Slick wrote:
AU-MUSTD wrote:
My fairlane doesnt have it and it's the tickford vct 6. My car has never had a heat problem but still gets too hot to touch.
it'll be to hot to touch the headers, we're refering to heat radiation & its effect it did to intake system. I can touch the rocker cover for a few seconds with out going "f**k!!" *#%!@# as it was before.



Since l got the ftg intake it is hot too touch as it absorbs all the engine heat as well. Doesnt take a genius to realise that the headers would be hot to touch.

 

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Posted: Fri Oct 14, 2005 8:42 am 
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AU-MUSTD wrote:
Slick wrote:
AU-MUSTD wrote:
My fairlane doesnt have it and it's the tickford vct 6. My car has never had a heat problem but still gets too hot to touch.
it'll be to hot to touch the headers, we're refering to heat radiation & its effect it did to intake system. I can touch the rocker cover for a few seconds with out going "f**k!!" *#%!@# as it was before.



Since l got the ftg intake it is hot too touch as it absorbs all the engine heat as well. Doesnt take a genius to realise that the headers would be hot to touch.
be specific when you post, cause the hotest thing in my engine bay is the headers. the rest is nice & warm which I can touch. :lol:

 

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Posted: Fri Oct 14, 2005 9:41 am 
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Slick wrote:
4.9 EF Futura wrote:
That's defectable as well. Having said this, im contemplating removing mine. There is a reasonable amount of ambient heat generated by the supercharger - it would be good to get it out of the bay as opposed to have it soak into the engine componentry....


*I alwas carry a heavy load all the time. 200-400kg of cement base, 5x20ltr of of sealer, 5x20 ltr of modifier, 85 kg air compressor, plus 60 to 100kg of tools. add it up & I'll probablem over the recommended GMV weight of the ute.
*XR6 & 8 don't have that seal in place.
*Alot of stop & go at traffic.
*even better on highway driving, thats when I really notice the drop in the temp gage when I checked the oil level at the servo yesterday. the only sign of heat was from the extractor heat sheild when I place my hand over it. not touching it of course.
*less heat, no pinging or knocking, more timing advance= more power
*more heat, more heat stress more ping & knocking, more timing retart= lost of power.


Slick, run an engine too cold and you'll cause premature wear, excessive fuel consumption, and wear out plugs faster.

Could you also inform us how exactally you think you get the extra timing advance due to cold air? The falcons run off the fixes spark tables and the ONLY change to ignition timing will be to retard it due to the knock sensor.

And heat stress? What are you on about? Running your engine 10C cooler than 80C isn't going to make any difference to 'heat stress'. The major stress that heat puts on an engine is the constant heating up and cooling down, especially when different metals with different expansion rates are involved. Once the engine's up to runningtemp, there's no 'heat stress' no it at all. Think about it, internal combustion temps are up to 900C. The cylinder wall temp is constantly fluctuating @ much much higher temps than your intake manifold. Doesn't seem to bother the cylinder walls!
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Posted: Fri Oct 14, 2005 9:49 am 
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Slick wrote:
WagonDad wrote:
G'day guy's, Doesnt the rubber seal help direct fresh air to the cold air intake, unless you have another intake pipe set up wouldn't you be reducing the pressure fed cool air intake. I realise reducing engine bay temperatures is benificial I just dont know what trade off is occuring by removing the rubber seal.
hehehe, actually I have another intake tube channelled between the headlight and radiator with a 4x6" metal plate as a deflector.

I think its more of a weather strip and aerodynamics then anything else. just have to look inside my old TE cortina engine bay after 1 year of no cleaning.

I rekcon there will be more pressure build up in the bay now with the air rushing in & pushing hot air throu the back of the hood & under the body, also increasing air speed & pressure into the intake. colder engine/intake means more hp. Besides, the knock sensor won't interfere if the engine is colder.


Actually, when you design a car well, you aim to have the body create a low pressure area under the car, yes, this includes under the open bottom of the engine bay.

By having a low pressure under the car, you get a higher differentian pressure between the top and bottom thereby creating some downforce which helps with handling. The last thing you want to do is try to increase the pressure in the engine bay as this would flow under the car and reduce any downforce created by the body design.

Oh, and also, a warmer engine is better for power, not a colder one. If cold engines were so fantastic for power then we'd all be cooling out engines with liquid nitrogen. Of course, there is an optimal temp. As you have mentioned, partially correct, a hotter engine can lead to detonation through pre-ignition, so get an engine too hot and you make power and engine life worse, but by the same token, run it colder than optimal and you also do the same thing.
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 Post subject: Re: benefit of removing front bonnet rubber seal.
Posted: Fri Oct 14, 2005 9:55 am 
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Slick wrote:
Hi guys.
a couple of days back I decided to remove the rubber strip infront of the engine bay. {the one that goes over the intake snorkle}.
To my surprise it made a big difference to the engine bay then the was it was before.
Since I removed it, the engine is alot cooler now, I can touch the manifold premium, T/B, intake pipes with out any heat. usually when I left the bonnet up my eyes goes watery from the rediant heat.
My temp gage usually sits on the 1/4 mark, now its almost between Cold & the 1/4 mark.

the only thing I'm worried about now is, getting dust on my spark plug leads.


YaY! The car's constantly running in cold start mode now by the sounds of things. Very good. you'll soon carbon up your valves, plugs and cat converter. Because of excessive carbon on the plugs you'll also cause excessive wear on the leads as they will be forced to carry more power. Once the valves get all carboned up, they might not close properly leading to loss of compression, reduction in power and economy. You'll dirty the engine oil quicker and if you don't increase the oil change intervals, you'll accelerate the wear on the engine. The camshaft is the component that suffers the most from old oil..

I'll be sure to tell Murry Carter or Mark Skaife that they need to take the thermostat out of their cars and run the engine as cold as possible. I'm sure they'll be thankful for the info then they blow up a $60,000 engine after 5 laps.
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Posted: Fri Oct 14, 2005 10:47 am 
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The back rubber seal would be more effective.
Like unclewoja said, low pressure area under the car is an aerodynamic/downforce aid.
However having the air forced up out of the engine bay, is effective for dumping engine bay heat (heat rises remember).
Look at the drift boys, modifying there bonnet hinges so the rear is higher to let out more heat.
Having said that, again, like unclewoja said, I doubt it's necessary or that beneficial on a factory N/A car.
All you turbo boys though, that's a different story.

 

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Posted: Fri Oct 14, 2005 11:18 am 
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tickford_6 wrote:
shoey50 wrote:
4.9 EF Futura wrote:
That's defectable as well.


how is it i cant see how??



the rules unfortunatly are not based on any form of common sence


Agreed. But there is logic to this one. OK, i dont recall the wording of the rule - but basically, there must be something which keeps fuel and oil in the engine bay.

i.e. in the unlikely event of the fuel lines popping off at the input side to the pressure regulator, there is the potential for petrol to find its way onto the windscreen...

I believe the regulation is along the same lines as why you're not allowed to run a mechanical fuel pressure gauge in the cabin (altho you'd need rocks in your head to do so!)

 

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Posted: Fri Oct 14, 2005 12:18 pm 
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4.9 EF Futura wrote:
i.e. in the unlikely event of the fuel lines popping off at the input side to the pressure regulator, there is the potential for petrol to find its way onto the windscreen...

That makes sense in one way, but in another, more correct way, at least you'd know what was going on if you saw the fuel spray onto your windscreen.

I just had to say it like that, I couldn't help myself.
:D:D:D

 

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Posted: Fri Oct 14, 2005 8:17 pm 
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:idea: :!:

 

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Last edited by Slick on Mon Oct 17, 2005 7:43 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Posted: Sat Oct 15, 2005 1:38 am 
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]
Steady ED wrote:
4.9 EF Futura wrote:
i.e. in the unlikely event of the fuel lines popping off at the input side to the pressure regulator, there is the potential for petrol to find its way onto the windscreen...

That makes sense in one way, but in another, more correct way, at least you'd know what was going on if you saw the fuel spray onto your windscreen.

I just had to say it like that, I couldn't help myself.
:D:D:D


I'll be more specific & concise this time, hehehe

* It'll be still hot but not hot that it'll burn, not as hot as extreme sealed in burning hot.
*the manifold primium, throttle body, intake pipes are cold to the touch. It will operate in a more efficent temperature where the knock sensor will not interfere with timing. {Ecu} stores multiple maps & will pick the right timing acording to temp, s**t fuel, loads & so forth. I can say good bye to pre-ignition, As we old school would say "premature detonation" *{excessive heat}= ping, pre-ignition, detornation, blown head gasket, burnt valves, warped head, burnt piston, some times the knock sensor is a mili second to slow:P
*{Heat stress}= The engine temperature will be at a constant maintain temperature. compared to a sealed engine bay where it circulate hot air until the electric fan kicks in {rise/drop} in temp.


* It is true that downforce is reduced if that front seal is removed as it will increase left/low pressure under the car at high speed. to counter that, lower the b**ch til you're 3" of the ground or if want install some ricer wings:lol:

*The seal was placed there to increase downforce on the front end of the car. for stability & handing at high speed, 100 + kmh. minimizing left, resistence & drug.

* right infront of the nose of the car {radiator, shroud & elec fan} has the most pressure{low}. not the snorkle, it'll suck in static pressure & low pressure which ever way. when the car is in motion air pressure will find the easy way around, over the car, sides & bottom where there is a larger surface & less resistence

*when the elec fan is off at high speed, there is minimal amount of air going throu the engine bay, so fast moving air will find the quickest way round, over the car {downforce/high pressure} & under the car {left/low pressure}. when the electric fan kicks in, low pressure will increase under the car. {modern cars}

* its all earodynamics. When they put in for wind tunnel time streamline is the aim maximium stability & handling at the highest speed & squeeze as much cooling as they can. to counter that, anti-boil.

*why would you remove the rear bonnet seal? I said front seal.


Economy wise, alot better. 82 ltr tank lasted me 670km with loads compared to 540km before. I keep a vehicle log for tax purposes so I keep track of km's & each fuel stops, my fuel bill is dropping gents.

why? the engine is operating more efficently.
why? I'm not doing 110 k's plus on the road, that high/low pressure will effect the way it handles. If I was to drive over 120k's or more, maybe then I start to feel the front end bounce. like they say, the faster you go the more resistence,left & drag. there for more enegy{fuel} is required to keep it at that speed to counter the forces. there for more heat is greated.


By the way, Its colder down here in Tasmania. :lol:

 

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