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EL falcon wont start, was running fine before hand 

 

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 Post subject: EL falcon wont start, was running fine before hand
Posted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 4:24 pm 
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Ride: Ford Falcon ED

Location: Hobart
TAS, Australia

Ok so other night I was cruising along and my car started shaking bad (flat tyre) pulled into a no metred park next to a dog beach (score) went to open boot, wont open. never had the boot issue til now. battery dead in remote so cant use the remote, got thru the rear seats and subs commando steeze to find tyre iron then it dawned on me I am never gonna get the spare outa here this way :/ next idea was to get another from home another day and go back and replace tyre, I hadn't really worried to much about it being in a free parking zone so it was a few day til I got down there.. went down replaced tyre put rim in the backseat and jumped in to head home, piece of s**t I mean reliable awesome car wouldn't start. just cranks over, although my starters drive is on its way out so now and then it will wiz a bit on start never fazed me to much because I live on a hill, and have spare starters to put in when I can find the motivation over a weekend. but yea just cranks and cranks, was going fine when the tyre went flat but I have had this problem before like a week ago also was on a really hot day but after half hour and f**k about checking the simple things it fired over and went fine for the rest of the day, I actually did a day drive last week after it happened, started first go every go at servos and stops and s**t that day. but today it doesn't wanna start. wasn't able to check spark had spare plugs on me to as it turned out tried putting one in and sitting it somewhere where I could see if it sparks and close enough to the engine to ground it, failed. need a second set of eyes for that unless I just monged it and didn't choose a logical place for it to sit, gonna try again later when It cools down. relays clicked, fuel pump primes, switched the plugs over just because why not.. even had the ecu off, is it normal for moisture to be present on the little rubber thingy in where it plugs in? thought that was odd, it looked like condensation.. checked that smartlock fuse, C*** still flashes, only the rev light fuse was gone. yep cabin light works also, think I can hear the injectors tick but hard over the other noise and was at a dam dogpark lol it wasn't a serene work environment. but literally put recod injectors in it 6 months ago, new filter in at the same time then to obv. leads were done about 12 months ago new plugs didn't seem to make a diff. but when I pulled the plugs out, plug 1 and 2 had a little oil on them only on the threads tho think it might be a leaky valve cover don't think it has anything to do with this but yea cleaned that up and put new plugs in anyway. gave it the ol tap on the dash incase it was the bcm. I'm running out of ideas guys apart from the obvious which a lazy C*** like me doesn't wanna do unless I really have to.. anyone got an idea that's not related to dizzy or coil sort of on a time frame with this to, I'm going back out to my car later with a multimeter and a timing light and will test for spark and double check fuels sweet, guess I'm kind of looking for hope that I don't have to replace the dizzy at a dog park, I'm limited budget so if I have to replace the dizzy I'm not getting it towed as well lol that's a joke id be doing this in a car park at a dog park while drinking a can lol sooo anyone got any ideas that don't involve removing the dizzy and replacing it, I cant stand removing the intake manifold worst job I swear
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 Post subject: Re: EL falcon wont start, was running fine before hand
Posted: Wed Dec 20, 2017 8:26 am 
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VIC, Australia

It may be the TFI module on the side of the distributor or your coil.

Do you smell fuel when cranking? If so, the TFI/distributor could be okay.

You mentioned this happened before when it was hot. This could point to a coil failure, as they tend to work occasionally and fail occasionally, especially when hot. If you just want to get the car home, get a new/working coil, unplug the wires and the lead from the old one and connect it straight to the new coil. Get some cable ties to hold the new coil somewhere so that it doesn't fall away while you try and start it. If the car starts, you can get the car home and fix everything properly once it is home.

You can also replace the TFI module without removing the distributor. You will however need to remove the air conditioning pump from the block to gain access to the 2 screws holding the module to the distributor.

Also there is no need to remove the intake manifold to replace coil or distributor.

Hope that helps

 

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phongus = Post whore 2006
EL XR6 motor, EL ECU + J3 chip, WADE 1673 Camshaft, 3" S/S intake, Pacy 4480, 2.5" Hi flow cat, 2.5" Lukey exhaust.
Max Power = 144.6 rwkw (03/05/2008)

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 Post subject: Re: EL falcon wont start, was running fine before hand
Posted: Wed Dec 20, 2017 2:42 pm 
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Age: 27

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Location: Hobart
TAS, Australia

No I didn't smell fuel when cranking, going back to my car in about half hour to knuckle into it, first thing I will be doing is checking for spark and fuel, will also have a multimeter so can check the coil and tfi module, also didn't hear any relays clicking like the usual loud noises, that keeps ticking over in the back of my mind, but I heard the fuel pump prime, maybe its the injector relay? the brown one next to it, when you usually turn the ignition off the eec relay clicks quite loud don't recall hearing that loud click, cant be the fuel pump relay as the pump wouldn't prime. but yea il be checking the module and coil when I go back, if it is getting spark and no fuel I'm guessing either the relay or the fpr but I did take the vacuum hose off the top and didn't have fuel in it, cant even smell noticible amount of fuel coming through, at least half a tank of fuel in there to, pump works to filter was changed with injectors I highly doubt its a blockage, if the diaphragm in the fpr is shot will it cause these symptoms? pretty keen to check the fuel pump connections to but cant get in the boot :/
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 Post subject: Re: EL falcon wont start, was running fine before hand
Posted: Wed Dec 20, 2017 3:26 pm 
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From what I recall, if the TFI module is shot, then the injectors won't cycle as there is no signal to it...but my memory is not that great.

Have you checked your battery? A bad battery can cause issues as well, especially with a dying alternator.

I am not sure what the brown relay does sorry, can't help you there.

 

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phongus = Post whore 2006
EL XR6 motor, EL ECU + J3 chip, WADE 1673 Camshaft, 3" S/S intake, Pacy 4480, 2.5" Hi flow cat, 2.5" Lukey exhaust.
Max Power = 144.6 rwkw (03/05/2008)

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 Post subject: Re: EL falcon wont start, was running fine before hand
Posted: Wed Dec 20, 2017 4:18 pm 
Stock as a Rock
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Age: 27

Posts: 111

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Ride: Ford Falcon ED

Location: Hobart
TAS, Australia

The brown relay is the fuel injector relay, do I check the voltage at the tfi module or how do I check it
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 Post subject: Re: EL falcon wont start, was running fine before hand
Posted: Wed Dec 20, 2017 5:44 pm 
Stock as a Rock
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Age: 27

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TAS, Australia

ok so checked spark, all good, nice and strong. Relays are working must just be quieter than my other falcon, used timing light on the injectors, they are pulsing, checked pressure in fuel rail. everything seemed fine so I took the rubber boot off the TB and put a TINY spray of petrol in there. turned over and it fired to life but rough , usually very smooth and just sounds really nice. gave it a tap and sounded like a diesel truck clearing its throat. put the air filter system back on while it was idling, drove it home, turned it off started it up again all good started like normal. its now an hour and a bit later tried again fine again. I start work at 5 am so il know in the morning if its going, this is my every day car, usually drive it every day, always fine, the first time it happened I also didn't drive it for a few days (like this time because I went back a few days later to change the tyre) so normally is driven every day, I'm really unsure what it is, I know the filter and recod injectors weren't that long ago but I do drive it a s**t load and have ran the thing down to near empty a e few times in that time. I'm starting to feel like its a fuel blockage somewhere, but wouldn't that affect the fuel pressure in the fuel rail? I haven't upgraded to au injectors yet either so il add that to the list. thankfully I have some time off coming up and will pull my head into gear and give it a full service and replace the pump filter and injectors
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 Post subject: Re: EL falcon wont start, was running fine before hand
Posted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 9:38 am 
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Joined: 17th May 2005

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Ride: EL Fairmont, VFR400 racer

Power: 144 rwkw

Location: Melbourne
VIC, Australia

Maybe replace the fuel filter again since you have ran it dry a few times...running low tends to block the filter quite quickly. It is cheap and easy to replace.

Another thing, have you checked the throttle and ISC? Make sure they are working fine.

I had major issues with my car mid year which prompted me to replace a lot of things and didn't fix the issue. I pulled the battery out for a week, then cleaned the throttle body and ISC and now the car starts and drives fine. I had not cleaned the TB or ISC for a long time (4 or 5 years) before the issues began, so the build could have caused poor air flow making it harder for the ECU to control...or something like that. I wouldn't think resetting the ECU would have made a big deal, but the car runs now so I am not complaining...until it doesn't.

 

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phongus = Post whore 2006
EL XR6 motor, EL ECU + J3 chip, WADE 1673 Camshaft, 3" S/S intake, Pacy 4480, 2.5" Hi flow cat, 2.5" Lukey exhaust.
Max Power = 144.6 rwkw (03/05/2008)

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 Post subject: Re: EL falcon wont start, was running fine before hand
Posted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 9:50 am 
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Age: 27

Posts: 111

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Gallery: 2 images

Ride: Ford Falcon ED

Location: Hobart
TAS, Australia

Yea I'll try the filter. I will clean the tb as well is the isc the same as IAC? I replaced tb and IAC about 9 months ago will try anyway
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 Post subject: Re: EL falcon wont start, was running fine before hand
Posted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 8:15 pm 
Stock as a Rock
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Age: 27

Posts: 111

Joined: 11th Jul 2011

Gallery: 2 images

Ride: Ford Falcon ED

Location: Hobart
TAS, Australia

Went to start again today no luck, but the battery was pretty dead from trying to crank it over, so I tried to roll start it, dunno what I thought it would achieve but it worked started up straight away but rough idle, went for a drive in it and now its misfiring/ stuttering/ hesitating now and then on idle, every time when accelerating over 1/2 way ( this happene don way to shop to get fuel filter) parked it on a hill incase, got a new fuel filter, new leads as well, plugs were done when this problem occurred, when it happened the other week I didn't notice any missing either if filter and leads don't work I'm gonna replace the dizzy and coil as well I reckon if that don't do it I'm clueless as to what the f**k it could be
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