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EL Hybrid Confusion :( 

 

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 Post subject: EL Hybrid Confusion :(
Posted: Sat Jan 04, 2014 1:47 pm 
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Age: 23

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Joined: 16th Oct 2012

Ride: 98 EL Falcon

Location: Brisbane
QLD, Australia

Hey guys,

I apologise if this has been done to death. I did a pretty comprehensive search but I was getting different answers to my questions and getting even more confused with each post.

So here it is.
I have a 98 EL falcon. The plate says it is a march build which matches up with my hybrid theory and the head starts with 96DA (also hybrid). But my problem is the engine number. I can't find anything anywhere that actually corresponds with a hybrid block. All I can find are things that say 94da, 95da, 96da etc.. But nothing that says 'VRxxxx' on it. Unless I am looking in the wrong place.

I planned on putting a wade 1636 into the thing, but now I believe I have a hybrid and I need an AU cam to be re-ground into the au equivalent of the EL 1636. I want to make sure I grab the right cam, otherwise I know bad things will happen.

Help is gladly appreciated.
Thank you.

 

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98 EL Falcon Gli - AU II intech - t5 manual - Lowered on king lows - 2.5" custom exhaust - 200cell hi flow cat - 17" Speedy cobalt's powder coated in steel pearl - powerwindows - suede door inserts (classy) - fog lights - (probably other things I can't remember)

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 Post subject: Re: EL Hybrid Confusion :(
Posted: Sat Jan 04, 2014 2:52 pm 
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The fact that your running the au/hybrid el head means you will need an au cam regardless of the engine blocks cast number.

 

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 Post subject: Re: EL Hybrid Confusion :(
Posted: Sat Jan 04, 2014 2:59 pm 
Getting Side Ways
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The fact that your running the au/hybrid el head means you will need an au cam regardless of the engine blocks cast number.

 

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xr8 snorkel,typhoon lower snorkel,territory intake pipe,20% underdrive kit,pacemaker extractors,high flow cat,xforce exhaust,t56 conversion hd turbo clutch/ flywheel,m86 3.45 lsd,custom tune187.1rwkw as an auto

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 Post subject: Re: EL Hybrid Confusion :(
Posted: Sat Jan 04, 2014 4:09 pm 
Stock as a Rock
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Age: 23

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Joined: 16th Oct 2012

Ride: 98 EL Falcon

Location: Brisbane
QLD, Australia

I have read that it may be possible for the hybrid heads to still run normal el rockers, and this makes me wonder if that may have been done. I had the rocker cover off about two weeks ago and I don't recall seeing conical shaped springs which I have been told au heads have.

Also, would you happen to know what au cams I can use? I have been to the wreckers and got myself an au series 1 cam. But I don't know if that is right thing. I have been told to steer clear from vct engines, so that is what I did.

 

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98 EL Falcon Gli - AU II intech - t5 manual - Lowered on king lows - 2.5" custom exhaust - 200cell hi flow cat - 17" Speedy cobalt's powder coated in steel pearl - powerwindows - suede door inserts (classy) - fog lights - (probably other things I can't remember)

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 Post subject: Re: EL Hybrid Confusion :(
Posted: Tue Jan 07, 2014 8:28 pm 
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The VRxxxxx code is behind engine mount, almost impossible to see with mounts on. I've had 3 EL's and all were hybrid LOL

 

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 Post subject: Re: EL Hybrid Confusion :(
Posted: Tue Jan 07, 2014 8:39 pm 
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Ride: 98 EL Futura

Power: 199 rwkw

Location: Lilydale
VIC, Australia

if its all original and is a 96DA head you will need the Wade 1502AU cam which is the 1636 equiv

 

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 Post subject: Re: EL Hybrid Confusion :(
Posted: Fri Jan 10, 2014 9:36 pm 
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Ride: el wagon

Location: melbourne
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Have a look at the valve springs. If they are conical i.e.: smaller at the top than at the bottom, it is a hybrid head, and MUST run a AU cam profile with AU rockers, as the valve angle is different to previous models, as is the rocker ratio

If they are straight, it is not a hybrid (AU) and can run any cam/rocker combination from EB to EL pre 1998
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 Post subject: Re: EL Hybrid Confusion :(
Posted: Sat Jan 11, 2014 12:44 pm 
Stock as a Rock
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Age: 23

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Joined: 16th Oct 2012

Ride: 98 EL Falcon

Location: Brisbane
QLD, Australia

Cheers for the replies fellas, muchly appreciated.

I have to go compression test the stupid thing today, so while I'm out there I'll pull the rocker cover off and have a look at those springs. This will be fun, apparently it is meant to hit 45 in brissy today. :(

Also, would any of you guys happen to know a little about how wade do their cams? I have read that you need an exchange cam to send them, so I ran off to the wreckers a couple of weeks ago and grabbed an AU series 1 cam to send to them. But then I read elsewhere that you don't need an exchange cam unless they ask for one. So I am a little confused as to whether I actually need to send them a cam or not, and even if it is the right cam in the first place..

Thanks guys :)

 

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98 EL Falcon Gli - AU II intech - t5 manual - Lowered on king lows - 2.5" custom exhaust - 200cell hi flow cat - 17" Speedy cobalt's powder coated in steel pearl - powerwindows - suede door inserts (classy) - fog lights - (probably other things I can't remember)

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 Post subject: Re: EL Hybrid Confusion :(
Posted: Sat Jan 11, 2014 1:09 pm 
Getting Side Ways
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Age: 25

Posts: 4599

Joined: 30th Aug 2010

Ride: BF XR6,

Location: NEWCASTLE
NSW, Australia

Its cheaper if you send them a cam.

 

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xr8 snorkel,typhoon lower snorkel,territory intake pipe,20% underdrive kit,pacemaker extractors,high flow cat,xforce exhaust,t56 conversion hd turbo clutch/ flywheel,m86 3.45 lsd,custom tune187.1rwkw as an auto

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 Post subject: Re: EL Hybrid Confusion :(
Posted: Sat Jan 11, 2014 4:33 pm 
Stock as a Rock
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Age: 23

Posts: 100

Joined: 16th Oct 2012

Ride: 98 EL Falcon

Location: Brisbane
QLD, Australia

Okay, so to save myself some time, I didn't remove the rocker cover, but I undid the bolts so I could lift it up enough to get a look at the springs.

To me they seem to be somewhat conical. But I'm not sure if my eyes are playing tricks on me.
Image
Image
Image
Image

Also one point to note. When I was at the wreckers, I found all the AU heads had a bolt running up on the right hand corner of the head - I didn't find that on any other heads apart from hybrids.
Image

Also I did the compression test and all seemed okay. I can post results if people are interested.

Anyway, I have managed to break my rear right window reg somehow...another thing to fix. :'(

 

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98 EL Falcon Gli - AU II intech - t5 manual - Lowered on king lows - 2.5" custom exhaust - 200cell hi flow cat - 17" Speedy cobalt's powder coated in steel pearl - powerwindows - suede door inserts (classy) - fog lights - (probably other things I can't remember)

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 Post subject: Re: EL Hybrid Confusion :(
Posted: Sat Jan 11, 2014 5:03 pm 
Getting Side Ways
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Ride: el wagon

Location: melbourne
VIC, Australia

Those springs are straight. The AU ones are obviously conical

Quote:
I have read that it may be possible for the hybrid heads to still run normal el rockers


IIRC, you cannot run E series rockers on AU head, as the ratio is different, as is the valve angle. I would suggest that, if you think you have a hybrid, that someone has replaced the head with an E head. Maybe when repairing the head gasket?

That said, I have straight springs on my head, which I know is a hybrid head, as when JMM modified it, he couldn't get the conical springs and replaced them with the straight ones
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 Post subject: Re: EL Hybrid Confusion :(
Posted: Sat Jan 11, 2014 5:18 pm 
Stock as a Rock
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Age: 23

Posts: 100

Joined: 16th Oct 2012

Ride: 98 EL Falcon

Location: Brisbane
QLD, Australia

Are there any other ways of identifying a hybrid head? Because the part number says it is a hybrid, but the springs are not. Can you use straight springs on a hybrid head?

 

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98 EL Falcon Gli - AU II intech - t5 manual - Lowered on king lows - 2.5" custom exhaust - 200cell hi flow cat - 17" Speedy cobalt's powder coated in steel pearl - powerwindows - suede door inserts (classy) - fog lights - (probably other things I can't remember)

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 Post subject: Re: EL Hybrid Confusion :(
Posted: Sat Jan 11, 2014 5:21 pm 
Stock as a Rock
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Age: 23

Posts: 100

Joined: 16th Oct 2012

Ride: 98 EL Falcon

Location: Brisbane
QLD, Australia

Are there any markings or part numbers on the rocker assembly? If so, does anyone know what they should be for a hyrbid?

 

_________________

98 EL Falcon Gli - AU II intech - t5 manual - Lowered on king lows - 2.5" custom exhaust - 200cell hi flow cat - 17" Speedy cobalt's powder coated in steel pearl - powerwindows - suede door inserts (classy) - fog lights - (probably other things I can't remember)

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 Post subject: Re: EL Hybrid Confusion :(
Posted: Mon Jan 13, 2014 11:30 am 
Stock as a Rock
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Age: 23

Posts: 100

Joined: 16th Oct 2012

Ride: 98 EL Falcon

Location: Brisbane
QLD, Australia

Guys, where did everyone go? :(

Anyway, I think I have found some stuff that will be helpful for others. I'm pretty sure that this is a hybrid head, and I will show why.

Firstly, I happened to have the cam positioned in such a way that I could read the part number on it. (I don't actually know if this correlates to a hybrid head, but I'm sure it could help someone)
You can see here that the number starts with 96 (it is upside down though)
Image

In this one, 4 lobes down, the next bit is DA which makes up the hybrid 96DA number.
Image

Also, in regards to the springs. I think they are actually conical. I measured the top and I got 28mm and then about halfway down the spring it measured 32mm-ish. (my verniers are too big to fit inside the head properly to measure the bottom of the spring)

Another thing, I have read that the EB-EL models have 8.7mm valve stems and that Hybrid and AU's have 7mm valve stems.
This is what I measured mine at. (I apologise for the blurriness)
Image

can anyone advise me on what I have found?

 

_________________

98 EL Falcon Gli - AU II intech - t5 manual - Lowered on king lows - 2.5" custom exhaust - 200cell hi flow cat - 17" Speedy cobalt's powder coated in steel pearl - powerwindows - suede door inserts (classy) - fog lights - (probably other things I can't remember)

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 Post subject: Re: EL Hybrid Confusion :(
Posted: Mon Jan 13, 2014 3:49 pm 
Getting Side Ways
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Age: 45

Posts: 444

Joined: 12th Apr 2010

Ride: 2006 BF XR8 Boss 260

Location: Auckland
New Zealand

Hybrid 100%

 

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