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Engine cutting out on acceleration 

 

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 Post subject: Engine cutting out on acceleration
Posted: Mon Jun 03, 2013 1:00 pm 
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Age: 55

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Joined: 18th Oct 2012

Ride: EL falcon

Location: Sydney
NSW, Australia

Hello,

I have a couple of issues with my recently purchased (last one was an EL) 2005 BA mk2 wagon.

Problem :1 - This problem although relatively infrequent, is a bit scary when it occurs. Whether the engine is at operating temperature or cold, the engine will either cut out completely or go into the emergency run program after starting and moving off relatively quickly. Like when pulling out from the kerb to move into the traffic, it will just cut out, leaving me with no power assistance at all. To rectify this on the move, I have found that if I return the key to the 0 position (yes I'm going in a straight line and I know this could also lock the steering, but its probably better than coming to an abrupt stop and risking a rear end collision, hence my concerns) and then restart the engine, it behaves as per usual operation. It is especially apparent if the after initially accelerating quickly for a short duration and then releasing the accelerator pedal quickly (ie stabbing the pedal).

I realise my driving style could be considered questionable, but when you are in the push and shove of Sydney traffic and you have to make a move, you do so..but this is still a problem that requires rectification, why I approach the forum for advice.

Problem :2- The second problem relates to the brakes. Under highway speeds, the brakes develop a nasty shudder through the steering, like going down Mt. Ousley towards Wollongong.

I have now replaced the front and rear brake rotors and pads with some aftermarket drilled and slotted rotors. The problem has now gone, however, I have heard that the adjustment length of the push rod of the brake master cylinder is too long and by backing off this adjustment slightly, will reduce the brakes from dragging and hence overheating. Given that I don't want the problem to potentially reappear as the 'fix' doesn't necessarily solve the potential original issue, does anybody know about this, or can recommend this action? Will shortening the rod alter the feel at the pedal (my car also has the electric steering column adjustment for the brake pedal height). Additionally when pushed hard I can still get some brake fade, like going down Clyde mountain pass towards Batemans Bay - the pedal doesn't drop in height, but the effectiveness of the brakes is reduced (backing off and letting them cool down, returns the brakes to normal). I did bleed through the brake fluid when I changed the rotors. I admit I didn't completely change the fluid but it was a good clean colour and as I thought the the rotors were the issue, it was not done. (I will however do this at next opportunity). Any ideas would be appreciated (slowing down is not necessarily an option)...

I appreciate your input.

Regards

Rowdy
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 Post subject: Re: Engine cutting out on acceleration
Posted: Mon Jun 03, 2013 2:56 pm 
Getting Side Ways
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Joined: 11th Jan 2009

Ride: BA Falcon XT

Location: Smithfield
NSW, Australia

1. Have the TPS (Throttle Position Sensor) checked and the HEGO Sensor, they can be a problem. While you are at it, have the coils checked? if you have one dud one, change them ALL.

As to the Brakes, I haven't heard of increasing the travel of the brake pedal and I doubt it would really change a lot. BA's did have some problems with bad boosters and bad Master Cylinders.
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 Post subject: Re: Engine cutting out on acceleration
Posted: Mon Jun 03, 2013 6:21 pm 
Fordmods Junkie
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Ride: '91 EB Wagoon

Location: Geeelong
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Rowdy EL Wagon wrote:
Hello,

I have a couple of issues with my recently purchased (last one was an EL) 2005 BA mk2 wagon.


Problem :2- The second problem relates to the brakes. Under highway speeds, the brakes develop a nasty shudder through the steering, like going down Mt. Ousley towards Wollongong.

Any ideas would be appreciated (slowing down is not necessarily an option)...

I appreciate your input.

Regards

Rowdy



i was reading somewhere about the 'brake shudder' .... do you have 'ABS' on your car? check them & yeah quite a few have changed from the factory brakes to aftermarket to get rid of the 'shudder'
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 Post subject: Re: Engine cutting out on acceleration
Posted: Mon Jun 03, 2013 7:05 pm 
Oompa Loompa
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Age: 36

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Joined: 15th May 2013

Ride: AU LPG falcon

Location: Werribee
VIC, Australia

The brake shudder is caused from hard spots forming in the brake disk. Then when the disks are machined, most of the surface will cut properly but the hard spots will remain higher. So the end result is an uneven face on your rotor, hence the shaking/rattling you hear when the brake is applied.
The only way to fix this IMHO is to replace the rotors, as you have done.

As for shortening the pedal rod, leave it be! The only time the pedal rod needs to be adjusted is if for some reason the piston is not traveling all the way to the end of the master cylindar when the pedal is up, but if this is the case you would have to ask why, what has caused this?

Brake fade is caused from hot disks and pad faces. What happens when applying brakes down a slope is the pad surface starts to get so hot that the material starts to burn(not actually burn but get extremely hot) causing gas to build up between the pad and the disk, thus lowering the amount of brake force applied for the pedal pressure.

With your engine cutting out, for a start, check the main earth cable from the battery to the engine block to the body is all secure and tight. Next it would be worth checking fuel pump and regulator, would be good if you had a fuel pressure test kit. Then pretty much the MAP sensor would be the next in line. If you just lightly accelerate does this problem occur? Does it happen all the time when you accelerate hard?

Cheers Mick
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 Post subject: Re: Engine cutting out on acceleration
Posted: Tue Jun 04, 2013 11:58 pm 
Fordmods Newbie
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Age: 55

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Joined: 18th Oct 2012

Ride: EL falcon

Location: Sydney
NSW, Australia

Hi Mick, Thanks for your response.

I have checked the earth cable it is secure. I'm pretty sure it it something wrong with the fuel injection and not an issue from the fuel supply. My reason for this is the emergency run program and dash light are activated on occasions when the problem occurs- I don't believe this function is available if the fuel pump loses pressure or is cutting out. Additionally the engine runs perfectly in all other instances, other than the conditions described previously. I was thinking it was more something like the TPS was possibly faulty and sending a dud or false signal to the control unit which was shutting down the engine or causing it to go onto the emergency run program. Do you know what the tests are to check the TPS and MAP sensor? I am proficient with a multimeter.

Cheers

Rowdy
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 Post subject: Re: Engine cutting out on acceleration
Posted: Fri Jun 07, 2013 12:13 am 
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Location: Melbourne
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The brake adjustment is not done at the pedal, it's the pushrod between the booster and master cylinder.
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 Post subject: Re: Engine cutting out on acceleration
Posted: Fri Jun 07, 2013 10:46 am 
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Age: 55

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Joined: 18th Oct 2012

Ride: EL falcon

Location: Sydney
NSW, Australia

Thanks Bourbon Ute,

Maybe I didn't make that clear enough in the original post.

Yes, I was talking about the adjustment of the push rod between the brake booster and where it mates onto the brake master cylinder, there is an adjustment on that rod, I have heard that the rod could be incorrectly set at the factory and slightly too long, causing the brakes to drag ever so slightly and when the vehicle is pushed harder at speed or load, that the brakes overheat causing the discs to temporarily warp, causing the shudder.

I was not talking about the adjustment of the brake pedal & rod where it activates the booster through the firewall.

Anyway, does any body have any knowledge about the specified length of the booster to m/cylinder push rod or whether there is any service information from Ford or any anecdotal evidence out there.

Additionally the cutting out problem happened again last night, i would love t get to the bottom of this issue as well, as it's only a matter of time before I have an accident. It seems that the problem occurs from a quick application of the throttle (not necessarily flooring it, actually mostly about mid throttle),there seems to be a momentary lag in response, like the control unit is deciding what to do, where it either picks up and goes, or just stalls while rolling at about 30-40km/h. I then momentarily freak out, (last night I was going around a bus), make sure the car is going in a straight line, turn the key back to 0 and restart the engine and continue on as per usual.

Any ideas ??
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