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Higher oil pressure after cam swap + rattling noise 

 

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 Post subject: Re: Higher oil pressure after cam swap + rattling noise
Posted: Mon Jan 24, 2011 5:12 pm 
Getting Side Ways
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no oil pressure tensioner on these engines. just the spring one. get the proper allen key and do it right

 

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 Post subject: Re: Higher oil pressure after cam swap + rattling noise
Posted: Mon Jan 24, 2011 6:04 pm 
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I've made the Allen key tool using 3mm Allen key and tube fits on very tight ,
But when I took then tensioner of it was all apart doesn't that mean the screw driver worked ?
Ill take it all apart then use the Allen key the right way and she how she goes

 

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 Post subject: Re: Higher oil pressure after cam swap + rattling noise
Posted: Mon Jan 24, 2011 6:06 pm 
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I've made the Allen key tool using 3mm Allen key and tube fits on very tight ,
But when I took then tensioner of it was all apart doesn't that mean the screw driver worked ?
Ill take it all apart then use the Allen key the right way and she how she goes

 

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Dark Agents,Sunroof, bilstein shocks, 6000k HIDS, 329 mm slotted rotors, twin pot calipers , Climate Control, GarrettT04 turbo,log manifold, crow turbo cam, microtech lt10c, 42lb injectors , 044, surge tank , T56 , rebuilt bottom end , alloy plenum .

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 Post subject: Re: Higher oil pressure after cam swap + rattling noise
Posted: Mon Jan 24, 2011 7:42 pm 
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Mate this is a pretty common problem that accurs with big cams in these engines. I am going through the same dramas at the moment. Do you have enough spring pressure for the size of the cam? what is Wade cams spring specs for this cam? When were the timing chain and guides last replaced? When were the lashes last replaced?

Are you sure that the higher oil pressure is not a result of a raised idol?

There are differances between cam designing process which can result harmonic noises appearing with one cam and not another even though the advertised specs of the cam are very similar, but this is usually due to a valve componant that is not up to the job. Duration, overlap, base circle DIA, ramp slopes up and down and lobe seperation all play a part in how your valve train or any other componant linked to the cam will behave.

I have no idea what causes this and I have spent the last 8 months trying everything to find out. My motor is coming out on friday to be rebuilt again to see if the are any signs of this problem. One thing we have noticed is a wear mark appearing on the two rear cam bearing surfaces that is a bit odd. Rather than being in the bottom like the rest they are about half way up the exhaust side of the gernal.

My advice to you would be to start with some bigger springs, get advice from Wade cams on what you should use.

Check when your lashes, timing chain and guides were last replaced and if they are due do them, especially your lashes. If they are old and not working correctly anymore they may not be able to handle the extra lift the cam is putting on them. You will get a bit more valve train noise due to the cam being a re-grind too, you can go and put two lash caps on top of the lash and expect it to still work the way it uesd to!!

Also Make sure you follow the order in which you are supposed to torgue the cam retainer bolts in!

GOOD LUCK

 

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 Post subject: Re: Higher oil pressure after cam swap + rattling noise
Posted: Mon Jan 24, 2011 7:59 pm 
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I get the same noise at about 3200RPM...it's chain slapping. Most likely worn guides.

I have never replaced the chain or the guides (wish I did though while the engine was out) and when I bought the engine, it had 170000km on the clock. The noise got progressively louder over time. It is now at around 250000km and the noise is still there, but I barely get up to those revs these days.

 

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EL XR6 motor, EL ECU + J3 chip, WADE 1673 Camshaft, 3" S/S intake, Pacy 4480, 2.5" Hi flow cat, 2.5" Lukey exhaust.
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 Post subject: Re: Higher oil pressure after cam swap + rattling noise
Posted: Mon Jan 24, 2011 8:26 pm 
Getting Side Ways
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xr6eat 50 wrote:
Mate this is a pretty common problem that accurs with big cams in these engines. I am going through the same dramas at the moment. Do you have enough spring pressure for the size of the cam? what is Wade cams spring specs for this cam? When were the timing chain and guides last replaced? When were the lashes last replaced?

Are you sure that the higher oil pressure is not a result of a raised idol?

There are differances between cam designing process which can result harmonic noises appearing with one cam and not another even though the advertised specs of the cam are very similar, but this is usually due to a valve componant that is not up to the job. Duration, overlap, base circle DIA, ramp slopes up and down and lobe seperation all play a part in how your valve train or any other componant linked to the cam will behave.

I have no idea what causes this and I have spent the last 8 months trying everything to find out. My motor is coming out on friday to be rebuilt again to see if the are any signs of this problem. One thing we have noticed is a wear mark appearing on the two rear cam bearing surfaces that is a bit odd. Rather than being in the bottom like the rest they are about half way up the exhaust side of the gernal.

My advice to you would be to start with some bigger springs, get advice from Wade cams on what you should use.

Check when your lashes, timing chain and guides were last replaced and if they are due do them, especially your lashes. If they are old and not working correctly anymore they may not be able to handle the extra lift the cam is putting on them. You will get a bit more valve train noise due to the cam being a re-grind too, you can go and put two lash caps on top of the lash and expect it to still work the way it uesd to!!

Also Make sure you follow the order in which you are supposed to torgue the cam retainer bolts in!

GOOD LUCK



I'm not sure when it was replaced I dont think it has ever been replaced, I got a work shop manual, there are a few things I'm not Sure what u mean like 'lashes '. I'll read up on all that tho, looks like I'll be replacing all the timing chain gear etc.
I'm looking into getting a cms stage 3 cam and head, I'll put the stock cam back in so My engine lives a bit longer while the head work is getting done, I was going with a 977b then get head work then drop in a 1521a but the 1521a I have is a regrind and wade wernt sure on how many shims so use to might be a bit dodgy lol , I'm running standard original springs

 

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Dark Agents,Sunroof, bilstein shocks, 6000k HIDS, 329 mm slotted rotors, twin pot calipers , Climate Control, GarrettT04 turbo,log manifold, crow turbo cam, microtech lt10c, 42lb injectors , 044, surge tank , T56 , rebuilt bottom end , alloy plenum .

Aiming for 300 rwkw

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 Post subject: Re: Higher oil pressure after cam swap + rattling noise
Posted: Mon Jan 24, 2011 10:48 pm 
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heres a vid of the noise, it sounds worse in the vid but in real life its a bit quiet and not as grindy, but still a bad noise
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HOPohVtPUZs

heres a vid of the loose chain, when its on TDC its tight then when the timing mark its moved 1/4 of a turn clock wise its loose
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lt4PfazY5No


and in this pic, the circled area is where the noise is coming from

 

 

Attachments:
File comment: this is the highest my presssue has gotten
IMG_1037.JPG
IMG_1037.JPG [ 223.74 KiB | Viewed 43 times ]
File comment: the circle is where the noise is
IMG_1042.JPG
IMG_1042.JPG [ 90.39 KiB | Viewed 37 times ]

 

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Dark Agents,Sunroof, bilstein shocks, 6000k HIDS, 329 mm slotted rotors, twin pot calipers , Climate Control, GarrettT04 turbo,log manifold, crow turbo cam, microtech lt10c, 42lb injectors , 044, surge tank , T56 , rebuilt bottom end , alloy plenum .

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 Post subject: Re: Higher oil pressure after cam swap + rattling noise
Posted: Mon Jan 24, 2011 11:07 pm 
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Definitely chain. My chain is no where as loose as that but makes a similar sound. Just a little higher in the rev range.

 

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phongus = Post whore 2006
EL XR6 motor, EL ECU + J3 chip, WADE 1673 Camshaft, 3" S/S intake, Pacy 4480, 2.5" Hi flow cat, 2.5" Lukey exhaust.
Max Power = 144.6 rwkw (03/05/2008)

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 Post subject: Re: Higher oil pressure after cam swap + rattling noise
Posted: Mon Jan 24, 2011 11:35 pm 
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phongus wrote:
Definitely chain. My chain is no where as loose as that but makes a similar sound. Just a little higher in the rev range.


So my chain is stretched and worn

 

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Dark Agents,Sunroof, bilstein shocks, 6000k HIDS, 329 mm slotted rotors, twin pot calipers , Climate Control, GarrettT04 turbo,log manifold, crow turbo cam, microtech lt10c, 42lb injectors , 044, surge tank , T56 , rebuilt bottom end , alloy plenum .

Aiming for 300 rwkw

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 Post subject: Re: Higher oil pressure after cam swap + rattling noise
Posted: Mon Jan 24, 2011 11:42 pm 
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ef_falcon_95 wrote:
phongus wrote:
Definitely chain. My chain is no where as loose as that but makes a similar sound. Just a little higher in the rev range.


So my chain is stretched and worn


I would think so. If it is tighter at one spot on the chain compared to another, it could well mean a stretched chain...much like a motorcycle chain. But considering these chains are different to motorcycle chains I am not 100%. I am no expert, but that noise to me sounds like chain slapping and having such a loose chain I lean more towards it.

 

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phongus = Post whore 2006
EL XR6 motor, EL ECU + J3 chip, WADE 1673 Camshaft, 3" S/S intake, Pacy 4480, 2.5" Hi flow cat, 2.5" Lukey exhaust.
Max Power = 144.6 rwkw (03/05/2008)

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 Post subject: Re: Higher oil pressure after cam swap + rattling noise
Posted: Mon Jan 24, 2011 11:55 pm 
Getting Side Ways
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phongus wrote:
ef_falcon_95 wrote:
phongus wrote:
Definitely chain. My chain is no where as loose as that but makes a similar sound. Just a little higher in the rev range.


So my chain is stretched and worn


I would think so. If it is tighter at one spot on the chain compared to another, it could well mean a stretched chain...much like a motorcycle chain. But considering these chains are different to motorcycle chains I am not 100%. I am no expert, but that noise to me sounds like chain slapping and having such a loose chain I lean more towards it.



Yes my chain has loose and tight spots, and what you've seen in the video , it's loose spot is very loose,

 

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Dark Agents,Sunroof, bilstein shocks, 6000k HIDS, 329 mm slotted rotors, twin pot calipers , Climate Control, GarrettT04 turbo,log manifold, crow turbo cam, microtech lt10c, 42lb injectors , 044, surge tank , T56 , rebuilt bottom end , alloy plenum .

Aiming for 300 rwkw

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 Post subject: Re: Higher oil pressure after cam swap + rattling noise
Posted: Tue Jan 25, 2011 7:28 am 
Getting Side Ways
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throw a chain and some guides at it

 

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Weekend driver: EA SVO AU motor. Built BTR. TCE 2800 stall. T76 turbo. Locked diff. On E85. approx 320rwkw. 11.5 @121mph

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 Post subject: Re: Higher oil pressure after cam swap + rattling noise
Posted: Tue Jan 25, 2011 7:43 am 
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 Post subject: Re: Higher oil pressure after cam swap + rattling noise
Posted: Tue Jan 25, 2011 7:54 am 
Getting Side Ways
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well thats a weird one. maybe his oil cam was worn out. and the new cam isn't

 

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Weekend driver: EA SVO AU motor. Built BTR. TCE 2800 stall. T76 turbo. Locked diff. On E85. approx 320rwkw. 11.5 @121mph

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 Post subject: Re: Higher oil pressure after cam swap + rattling noise
Posted: Tue Jan 25, 2011 8:14 am 
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fiend wrote:
Just out of curiosity here ---

Why would a slightly stretched chain and even a broken guide result in HIGHER OIL PRESSURE?



I don't know u tell me, that's why i put up this thread :D

 

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Dark Agents,Sunroof, bilstein shocks, 6000k HIDS, 329 mm slotted rotors, twin pot calipers , Climate Control, GarrettT04 turbo,log manifold, crow turbo cam, microtech lt10c, 42lb injectors , 044, surge tank , T56 , rebuilt bottom end , alloy plenum .

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