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Hybrid DOHC motor (DOHC head on SOHC block) 

 

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 Post subject: Re: Hybrid DOHC motor (DOHC head on SOHC block)
Posted: Sat May 11, 2013 11:38 am 
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Thanks to Phong i now have some SOHC bottom end parts to play with. our discoveries were:

E-series tin sump is a NO GO on a B series block - the timing case sits around 10mm further out and the oil pump is in the way. You COULD cut and shut a sump and add 10mm to its length do some panel beating where the bend in the pickup is, trim the windage tray a bit and drill a couple of new holes (all but two line up stock) but it will still foul an a EF/EL k frame.
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Timing cases are very similar, BA is taller and the seal around the harmonic balancer is further out only one area is differently shaped.
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Timing setup is sorta decided, i was going to try and use the small chain from my parts bin with some custom pulleys but Phong had the bright idea of using the SOHC crank pulley and aux pulley with a custom single row chain (looks to be 3/8 inch or 9.5 mm pitch) SOHC sprockets will be turned down to single row for clearance on the main chain tensioners.
The two circled threaded holes will be drilled and tapped to M10 and a custom piece made up to support the lower ends of the DOHC tensioners - this should be the only block modification.
Timing cover will be mostly DOHC with the LHS section of a SOHC cover welded on to clear the aux pulley.
Tone wheel on DOHC crank sprocket will be removed to allow enough room for a modified harmonic balancer to fit (DOHC crank is longer) and run a dizzy mounted tone wheel.
other option is to use an AU block and fit the BA crank after having its snout modified (continue round keyed bit further back - remove oil pump drive)
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 Post subject: Re: Hybrid DOHC motor (DOHC head on SOHC block)
Posted: Sat May 11, 2013 11:52 am 
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After looking up the relevant standards on wikipedia :) it appears the chain is number 35 pitch (id guess with a H for heavy) which is used on motorbikes and go-karts

 

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 Post subject: Re: Hybrid DOHC motor (DOHC head on SOHC block)
Posted: Sat May 11, 2013 9:36 pm 
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That's coming together nicely - resourceful fella is our Phong.

I wonder if it may cut down the ignition setup by using an EF setup minus the coilpack - EF ECU, sequencer and crank angle sensor. If you run the DOHC coil on plug, the ECU fires the coils two at a time, just like EF wasted spark, shouldn't backfire ??
Just thinking your ignition leads will be pretty long to run a dizzy, probably bulky as well.

 

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 Post subject: Re: Hybrid DOHC motor (DOHC head on SOHC block)
Posted: Sat May 11, 2013 10:08 pm 
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snap0964 wrote:
That's coming together nicely - resourceful fella is our Phong.

I wonder if it may cut down the ignition setup by using an EF setup minus the coilpack - EF ECU, sequencer and crank angle sensor. If you run the DOHC coil on plug, the ECU fires the coils two at a time, just like EF wasted spark, shouldn't backfire ??
Just thinking your ignition leads will be pretty long to run a dizzy, probably bulky as well.


I think JOSE wanted to mock up a tone wheel onto the distributor since the distributor does one rotation for each crank rotation. Meaning he can mount the crank angle sensor (I think that's the sensor) on the outside rather than in the inside like the B-series engines.

I'm not to cluey with the electrical ignition so JOSE can explain it better.

Happy to help out to get this thing hopefully running. Would be good to see and definitely learning a heap!

 

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 Post subject: Re: Hybrid DOHC motor (DOHC head on SOHC block)
Posted: Sun May 12, 2013 3:35 am 
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as long as i can fit a crank angle sensor somewhere, an EDIS6 module will work with the ED (or EL) ECU inputs/outputs , and will run wasted spark on BA COPs - on EF/AU ECU's this module is integrated.

http://www.dainst.com/info/edis/edis.html

 

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 Post subject: Re: Hybrid DOHC motor (DOHC head on SOHC block)
Posted: Sun May 12, 2013 11:44 am 
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It's handy the Falcon SOHC ran dizzy and EDIS systems, plenty to choose from.

Would've been interesting to see a timing cover off pic of the chain setup on the DOHC prototype, just to see how they setup the Aux shaft.

 

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 Post subject: Re: Hybrid DOHC motor (DOHC head on SOHC block)
Posted: Mon May 13, 2013 10:16 am 
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has anyone run the BA coils in a wasted spark configuration?

not sure how they'd go with the different dwell times.

 

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 Post subject: Re: Hybrid DOHC motor (DOHC head on SOHC block)
Posted: Sat May 18, 2013 1:36 am 
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Did I miss something? why not mod the loom & sump to fit an e-series? Like what was planned with the 3P package from one of the forum supporters?

(*note- yup, I do understand the 'because I'm in the shed' factor in all this)

 

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 Post subject: Re: Hybrid DOHC motor (DOHC head on SOHC block)
Posted: Sat May 18, 2013 12:21 pm 
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fiftyone wrote:
Did I miss something? why not mod the loom & sump to fit an e-series? Like what was planned with the 3P package from one of the forum supporters?

(*note- yup, I do understand the 'because I'm in the shed' factor in all this)


The sump can't really be cut and shut because of the oil pump. The sump on the DOHC engine is also longer than the E-series sump.

As you noted...it will be considerably more expensive than what he is attempting at the moment, especially if you consider relocating the oil pump for clearance. If you do that, you might as well run a dry sump set up, cost might be the same.

The engine number will also stay the same, meaning you probably will have less hassle with the authorities.

 

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 Post subject: Re: Hybrid DOHC motor (DOHC head on SOHC block)
Posted: Sat May 18, 2013 1:50 pm 
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Im really just doing this to show it wasnt as impossible as people were claiming - no K-Frame mods is the only reason this would be preferable to fitting the whole DOHC engine, although it does appear the sump can be cut and shut to provide enough clearance on an EF/EL. http://www.fordmods.com/viewtopic.php?f=53&t=116634.

 

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 Post subject: Re: Hybrid DOHC motor (DOHC head on SOHC block)
Posted: Mon May 20, 2013 9:45 pm 
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I see

Image

Continue

 

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 Post subject: Re: Hybrid DOHC motor (DOHC head on SOHC block)
Posted: Tue May 21, 2013 10:57 pm 
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chain arrived today, so i cut it to length and fitted it - unfortunately the distance between the crank and the aux drive centres doesnt result in a nicely tensioned chain (there is quite a bit of slack to take up) - large drive sprocket on the aux shaft has been turned down to a single row to clear the main guide.

Next job is to make up the bracket to hold the lower parts of the guides and the tensioner for the oil pump drive.

After that i will call this project quits as it seems it is better to just mod the DOHC sump for clearance.

 

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 Post subject: Re: Hybrid DOHC motor (DOHC head on SOHC block)
Posted: Wed May 22, 2013 1:38 pm 
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That's Awesome. can't wait to see this run. :D

 

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 Post subject: Re: Hybrid DOHC motor (DOHC head on SOHC block)
Posted: Fri Oct 11, 2013 10:45 pm 
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That's Awesome. can't wait to see this run. :D

me to...... :o

oh. Last post in May 2013?

What happened? Work out for you or what?

 

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 Post subject: Re: Hybrid DOHC motor (DOHC head on SOHC block)
Posted: Fri Oct 11, 2013 10:50 pm 
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waits in anticipation
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