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P.I.T.A HEATER PIPE REMOVAL 

 

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 Post subject: P.I.T.A HEATER PIPE REMOVAL
Posted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 12:57 pm 
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So i finally got my ef xr6 engine into my eb last night.
all bolted,wired,plumbed and full of fluids
only to wake up to a coolant leak!
it is leaking from the steel heater pipe that is connected to the water pump.
i have no intentions for a heater in my eb ...

(1) is there a way to completly remove that heater pipe and block the hole for it on both ends.
(2) has it been done before.?
(3) what holds the heater pipe in the water pump ..?
(4) what could i use to block it off
(5) will it affect the cooling system in any adverse way?

any advice would be gratefully accepted and appreciated.
I just want this car on the road last week.
Thankyou!
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 Post subject: Re: P.I.T.A HEATER PIPE REMOVAL
Posted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 1:44 pm 
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that pipe must stay in place as it is the bypass for when the thermostat is shut...

the heater tap bypass is a short piece of 3/8 hose under the intake manifold which links that steel pipe you mention to the steel pipe that leave the thermostat housing...

1) If you were our to destroy it them you could cut it up and remove it, as I mentioned above you can not block it off...

2) Yes! Everyone hates the job... You need to remove the intake manifold and exhaust manifold... It is held in by one bellhousing bolt which can be a prick to get to... Only needs to be loosened and the clamp will out from under the bolt head... And I believe there is an anchor point under the exhaust manifold... With the right amount of wriggling and swearing it will lift out from behind the rocker cover, though it may be easier with that removed...

3)covered above, a bolt holds the piep to the block under the exhaust manifold near the pump... it has a o ring on the pie and pushes into the back of the water pump and that's it...

4)you can't block it off

5)Yes, it is the bypass for when the thermostat is closed, must stay there...

Now!

This was a known problem to ford on EF onward pumps, they had too larger hole in them for the O ring... and they issued a part which stops this leak from occurring (assuming it is leaking at the back of the water pump?) It is a steel sleeve and you put the new o ring one with some gasket goo and then tap this sleeve into the end of the pipe and it locates the o ring in the centre of the water pump hole... because when that pipe is clamped to the block it squeezes the o ring to one side of the pump and causes it to leak from the other... This fixes it... When I put the AU pipe into my ED when I put the BBM on I tried this sleeve and it would not fit in the ED water pump, so clearly the later models they got carried away with the hole size in the serpentine pumps... I had to remove the sleeve to make the AU pipe fit and anyway I've never seen an ED leak from there, only seemed to be prone on EF-EU, after thinking the pipe was at fault on later vehicles we discovered it appears to be the pump...

You may get lucky... if you get the pipe free enough... (undo the bellhousing bolt and slide clamp off and undo the bolt on the exhaust side of the block) it should pull out of the pump leaving you enough room to work with it... Get the new o ring from ford and see if you can find that sleeve which is the repair to the known problem... you should be able to get the new o ring on with gasket goo and the sleeve tapped into the pipe and all done back up without having to remove manifolds... May just need to under the P-steer pump to more access...

Good luck!

Cheers,
Tim

 

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 Post subject: Re: P.I.T.A HEATER PIPE REMOVAL
Posted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 1:53 pm 
Parts Gopher
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what if i was to remove the thermostat..
then there would be no need for a bypass..?
or is there an issue i do not realize... ?
it may be a stupid question but i want the car on the road tonight!
Thankyou Tim. 8-)
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 Post subject: Re: P.I.T.A HEATER PIPE REMOVAL
Posted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 2:05 pm 
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i wouldnt remove the thermostat to acheive what your wanting to do..
the car will struggle to get to operating temp, it will run in cold start mode longer using more fuel...

why not just remove the water pump, put some rtv silicon around the o ring and on the water pump gasket...
much easier then removing the heater pipe...
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 Post subject: Re: P.I.T.A HEATER PIPE REMOVAL
Posted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 2:08 pm 
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Yeah remove the thermostat... But then you still have to be able to block that hole up? You got a mate who can tig weld alloy still on the car? You can just cap the pipe because that joint is leaking...

I'd still get the pipe free like I said and gasket goo it, pretty sure ford don't in the factory... It may band aid it until you can get a new o ring and the sleeve like I said?

Issue with removing the thermostat is the car will never get to temperature and will run cold and hence rich all the time... If it is an auto it may upset top gear... Some wont select top gear unless everything is at proper operating temp...

Cheers,
Tim

 

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 Post subject: Re: P.I.T.A HEATER PIPE REMOVAL
Posted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 2:10 pm 
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TROYMAN wrote:
i wouldnt remove the thermostat to acheive what your wanting to do..
the car will struggle to get to operating temp, it will run in cold start mode longer using more fuel...

why not just remove the water pump, put some rtv silicon around the o ring and on the water pump gasket...
much easier then removing the heater pipe...


haha... didn't even think of that... removing the water pump will certainly give access to that end of the pipe...

Cheers,
Tim

 

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Visuals: FG XR Wheel, XR Front, 17's, BA 5 Spd Shifter, BA Ghia Window Switches, NL Cluster
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 Post subject: Re: P.I.T.A HEATER PIPE REMOVAL
Posted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 3:29 pm 
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http://www.mypage.tsn.cc/dave/Documents/water_pump.htm

This document will explain how to replace the water pump O-ring on Ford Falcon I6 Vehicles EA-BA inclusive.
Ford changed the design of both the heater pipe and the water pump in June 2004 so vehicles built after this date are not covered in this document. Vehicles with the updated water pump can be identified by the letters "AA" cast in the back of the pump near where the bottom radiator hose joins on. BA Falcons with the old water pump and pipe "BA" is cast into the same place.

Parts Required:
1x AU-8K540-A (O-ring)
1x BA18N318S (Spacer)

Tools Required:
10mm Socket and suitable ratchet
13mm Socket and suitable ratchet
19mm Combination Spanner (for bell housing bolt securing rear of heater pump, Except BA vehicles)
Hammer and suitable punch (for tapping the spacer into the pipe)

Replacing the O-ring, and fitting the spacer.

1. Confirm that the O-ring at the rear of the water pump (where the heater pipe joins into it) is leaking
2. Remove the cooling system cap and refit it (this lets any pressure out)
3. Remove the exhaust heat shield
4. Undo the bolts holding the heater pipe to the engine block. (rear - near/on the bell housing.)
5. Carefully pull the pipe rearward out of the water pump.
6. Inspect the recess in the back of the water pump and clean any corrosion or grime if required.
7. Replace ‘O’ ring (Be sure to use a small amount of Rubber Grease to lubricate the new O-ring)
8. Tap the spacer into the front of the heater pipe until square and flush with the end of the pipe.
(This may require removal of the engine cooling fans to get enough movement with a hammer and punch.
Sometimes the spacers go in without any need for tapping, other times its a real pain.)
9. Carefully refit the heater pipe into the water pump.
10. Fit and tighten both front and rear heater pipe bolts. (It MAY be necessary to make the holes on the
pipe slightly larger using a die grinder etc, however of the 30+ cars I've replaced this O-ring on, only one
has required this. If you feel this is required make 100% sure the spacer is fitted into the pipe correctly.)
11. Refit any other items removed to gain access.
12. Refit the exhaust manifold heat shield.
13. Refill the cooling system, and pressure test the system if you have a pressure tester available.
If you do not have a pressure tester. Run the engine until at operating temperature, confirm the vehicle is
still full of coolant and observe for any leaks. If you use this method keep a close eye on coolant level for the next
few days.

 

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 Post subject: Re: P.I.T.A HEATER PIPE REMOVAL
Posted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 3:44 pm 
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TROYMAN wrote:
i wouldnt remove the thermostat to acheive what your wanting to do..
the car will struggle to get to operating temp, it will run in cold start mode longer using more fuel...

why not just remove the water pump, put some rtv silicon around the o ring and on the water pump gasket...
much easier then removing the heater pipe...


Exactly what I did. leaked after I changed the o ring. Got annoyed and squeezed some gasket maker with th o ring and shoved it in. not too much though...once in, more gasket maker on the outside.

 

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 Post subject: Re: P.I.T.A HEATER PIPE REMOVAL
Posted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 4:59 pm 
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If you decide to change the whole pipe, it is possible.

You do need to take off the exhaust manifold, leave the intake as is.
Take the valve cover off.
Undo the bolt holding the pipe to the block and also the top bell housing bolt.
Get under and disconect the hoses on the other end. While there undo the bolt under the inlet manifold.
Undo the Gbox cross member and lower the rear of the box leaving the slip yolk in place.
Now wiggle, twist,squeeze it out over the top of the bellhousing and box.
Once it is back far enough, twist over the side and out she comes!

Worst job, but very much do-able.

Enjoy :D

 

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 Post subject: Re: P.I.T.A HEATER PIPE REMOVAL
Posted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 6:06 pm 
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EFFUTURA4.05SP wrote:
If you decide to change the whole pipe, it is possible.

You do need to take off the exhaust manifold, leave the intake as is.
Take the valve cover off.
Undo the bolt holding the pipe to the block and also the top bell housing bolt.
Get under and disconect the hoses on the other end. While there undo the bolt under the inlet manifold.
Undo the Gbox cross member and lower the rear of the box leaving the slip yolk in place.
Now wiggle, twist,squeeze it out over the top of the bellhousing and box.
Once it is back far enough, twist over the side and out she comes!

Worst job, but very much do-able.



Enjoy :D


Also helps when you remove the starter motor too.

 

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 Post subject: Re: P.I.T.A HEATER PIPE REMOVAL
Posted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 6:19 pm 
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cjh wrote:
EFFUTURA4.05SP wrote:
If you decide to change the whole pipe, it is possible.

You do need to take off the exhaust manifold, leave the intake as is.
Take the valve cover off.
Undo the bolt holding the pipe to the block and also the top bell housing bolt.
Get under and disconect the hoses on the other end. While there undo the bolt under the inlet manifold.
Undo the Gbox cross member and lower the rear of the box leaving the slip yolk in place.
Now wiggle, twist,squeeze it out over the top of the bellhousing and box.
Once it is back far enough, twist over the side and out she comes!

Worst job, but very much do-able.



Enjoy :D


Also helps when you remove the starter motor too.



Forgot that.. :)

 

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 Post subject: Re: P.I.T.A HEATER PIPE REMOVAL
Posted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 7:44 pm 
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i got to repco to get the o-ring and the water pump gasket , got the water pump out, but destroyed the second gasket (that i didn't know existed) between the cast body and the second plate.. so its off till tomorrow when i can get another gasket.. but in the mean time ..
how do you split the pump and remove the pulley?
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 Post subject: Re: P.I.T.A HEATER PIPE REMOVAL
Posted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 7:51 pm 
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Don't know if you can... When you buy a new pump that second gasket is already fitted between that plate and housing... Unless it's possible to feed the new gasket on? Been a while since I've looked at a water pump now... :?

 

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 Post subject: Re: P.I.T.A HEATER PIPE REMOVAL
Posted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 11:06 pm 
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tickford861 wrote:
i got to repco to get the o-ring and the water pump gasket , got the water pump out, but destroyed the second gasket (that i didn't know existed) between the cast body and the second plate.. so its off till tomorrow when i can get another gasket.. but in the mean time ..
how do you split the pump and remove the pulley?


Why did you pull the water pump out? As far as I know, it is not possible to replace the gasket sandwiched between the housing and metal spacer (as TimmyA said). That gasket is put on when they assemble the pump...so the only way is to disassemble the pump. However in doing so, you may damage the water pump pulley if you don't have the proper pulley tool, even then the chances are slim...so you need to buy another pulley. Might as well get a new water pump, which usually comes with pulley and gaskets. If you go that route, get a GMB one if possible.

If you want to keep the old pump and don't want to risk of damaging the pulley, you can sort of get the gasket between the spacer and housing. It might be dodgy but it could work (haven't done so myself, the theory is good though IMO). With a sharp knife, cut one line across one area of the gasket so that you now have an opening when you twist it...should still be one piece. Slip it on between the spacer and housing (make sure you clean the surface of the housing and spacer...it will be a pain in the a*** of a job) and using some Permatex gasket maker (the blue one should be fine) smear it on the housing side and stick the gasket it on it, then smear some more on the space side and stick that on to the gasket. Make sure you do this the same time you install the pump...that way when you tighten up the bolts the gasket maker can seal it properly before it cures.

Hope that saves you a few pennies.

 

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EL XR6 motor, EL ECU + J3 chip, WADE 1673 Camshaft, 3" S/S intake, Pacy 4480, 2.5" Hi flow cat, 2.5" Lukey exhaust.
Max Power = 144.6 rwkw (03/05/2008)

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 Post subject: Re: P.I.T.A HEATER PIPE REMOVAL
Posted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 11:16 pm 
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When we've done them here you usually just soak the pump in a sink full of water to soften the paper gasket and they always seal... I suppose gasket goo never hurt anything though...

I wouldn't recommend dismantling the pump either... The seal in the front of them are super temperamental... I've seen brand new ones leak out through that inspection hole in the bottom of the housing... Let alone upsetting the seal by sliding that shaft out...

Cheers,
Tim

 

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Visuals: FG XR Wheel, XR Front, 17's, BA 5 Spd Shifter, BA Ghia Window Switches, NL Cluster
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