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| ebxr82nv |
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Done the search and there's no comparison relitive to this.
Has anybody switched from one to the other, and what results did they achive.
_________________ 9/98 AU1 XR6hp-about to retire from the road and be reborn on the race track. |
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| WiggyMK2 |
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I havent used jmm ones but i guess i kinda have the best of both worlds. I have Pacemaker comps with longer secondries to improve scavenging and tourque
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| ebxr82nv |
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ah yes but they're not as long as the race series items
_________________ 9/98 AU1 XR6hp-about to retire from the road and be reborn on the race track. |
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| Jaysen |
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If you can really measure the gains, your doing well. Speak to a reputable header builder (this can be hard as they are all biased towards thier own) and you will find that there is less than 5% total variance between a tuned and out of tune set of headers on most street cars.
To start the research, google headers by ED, there is some good stuff/info on his site, although he is based in the US
_________________ Dima, Mitch & Jay's RPD |
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| ebxr82nv |
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I've been talking to mat at chiptorque and he recomended the mock headers
_________________ 9/98 AU1 XR6hp-about to retire from the road and be reborn on the race track. |
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| Jaysen |
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The JMM's look great, but when I put them on my car, I noticed very little difference. Back in the day I think I got 106rwkw with the rest of the EF 6 motor with an auto being standard, and there were others running std 6 cylinder falcons doing the same, some better, some worse with different exhaust combo's on the dyno day.
_________________ Dima, Mitch & Jay's RPD |
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| Jaysen |
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to add to my above post, a guy I knew had a full JMM Dev 5 kit that refused to run over 135rwkw, he swapped out cams as well, but with little improvement. On the other hand though, JMM's quarter figures speak for themselves, so they have to be doing something right. There is a lot more to thier EA/EB that meets the eye, and header choice would be a very small factor in the entire equation
_________________ Dima, Mitch & Jay's RPD |
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| Grimketel |
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Jaysen wrote: On the other hand though, JMM's quarter figures speak for themselves, so they have to be doing something right. There is a lot more to thier EA/EB that meets the eye
yeah the fact that its not streetable?? its as far as they can take a car, not just an engine... its had massive driveline work, and has been totaly stripped out. whereas grechie gets within a few poofteenths of a second to mocks eb in his NA 6. with a lot less work and $$$ spent. Mocks OK, but for the money you spend your not getting good value. Not aiming this at you jaysen, more a general statement -but- better off doing your research and realising its not like grand turismo or forza where every bolt on gives X amount of hp. there are a million factors as to why a car does/doesnt make horsepower and torque. you have to get a series of things very very right, rather than just add one thing to a generic mix to see definate improvement.
_________________ enough isn't enough |
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| GeZza200 |
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Grimketel wrote: Jaysen wrote: On the other hand though, JMM's quarter figures speak for themselves, so they have to be doing something right. There is a lot more to thier EA/EB that meets the eye yeah the fact that its not streetable?? its as far as they can take a car, not just an engine... its had massive driveline work, and has been totaly stripped out. whereas grechie gets within a few poofteenths of a second to mocks eb in his NA 6. with a lot less work and $$$ spent. Mocks OK, but for the money you spend your not getting good value. Not aiming this at you jaysen, more a general statement -but- better off doing your research and realising its not like grand turismo or forza where every bolt on gives X amount of hp. there are a million factors as to why a car does/doesnt make horsepower and torque. you have to get a series of things very very right, rather than just add one thing to a generic mix to see definate improvement. Yeah that thing isn't street, its got slicks and suspension has been designed for drag.
_________________ EL Futura: CVE head, Wolf V500, ICE Ignition and Coil, 36lb injectors, Walbro 255lb, Paci comps, 3" exhaust, T5, Harrop Truetrac with 3.9s. Now with 198.9rwkw, (~185rwkw and 13.80 @99.1mph) with more power to come |
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| Jaysen |
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I agree with the last few posts, Im not here to support or put down JMM, this was just from my own personal experience from playing with thier headers, and bang for your buck I will say that there is better out there. I cant see that the $700 is well spent on them, when like it has already been said, others have achieved almost similar results with different products.
Grimketel, no offense taken to your general comment, and Ill agree totally with you. Just take a look at the 5ltr stuff, why is it that guys running SN95 mustangs weighing as much as our EF/EL fairmonts are doing low 12's with combos that look similar to ours on paper, Certain products will give you an increase in power, but how long is a piece of string, you can put the greatest set of heads on your 5ltr, and you will be super p****d off when its s**t to drive to work, and it doesnt make much power because your still running the std cam and exhaust. Gotta look at the lot
_________________ Dima, Mitch & Jay's RPD |
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| AUXR8 2 |
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personaly for the genreal street run around most of the systems on the market will do the trick, lets face it where not chasing 200rwkw plus are we so putting all that money on a set of pipes with posible very little engine mods IMO is a waste, as Jay mention invest it else where & as for pipes having some 2 stroke knolage there is hidden power in the right pipe configiation as with any engine but most exhaust shops that I deal with wouldn't have a clue as they need some race craft knolage, people like the Baker Bros who build, tune & prep konica cars & some touring cars, my mates F3 spent $3.5k just on pipes...... so spend your money wisley
Oh & I'm not kocking any one products just giving you my opinion to what I've seen & dynoed.......... |
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| InspectorRectum |
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That's the thing that boggles my mind about cars - it's so stupid to think that a pipe made of better material or by someone else's design could give a power increase when, come on, it's just a pipe. But at the speed of which everything is going -pistons, air flow, exhaust flow, etc - a simple bend in a pipe can either almost stop air flow or dramtically inceases the speed of which it flows. Crazy!
Everything has to be trailed and remade and it just boggles me how something so little can make such a difference IF the perfect bend or perfect angle is found. But you have to work out how much of airflow increase is that angle going to give you and will that even make a difference? IMO things like getting heads ported, headers extensivly researched, etc is really only worth it if you are going the Forced route. Depending on how much you value your money, 1-2rwkws for $500 for Paccies in an NA is to me, a waste of $ but 5-10rwkws in a Forced setup is well worth it. I'm just glad I wasnt around when the first cars were being made so I didnt slow them down lol what we have nowadays and the technology is truly amazing! |
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| GeZza200 |
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InspectorRectum wrote: That's the thing that boggles my mind about cars - it's so stupid to think that a pipe made of better material or by someone else's design could give a power increase when, come on, it's just a pipe. But at the speed of which everything is going -pistons, air flow, exhaust flow, etc - a simple bend in a pipe can either almost stop air flow or dramtically inceases the speed of which it flows. Crazy!
Everything has to be trailed and remade and it just boggles me how something so little can make such a difference IF the perfect bend or perfect angle is found. But you have to work out how much of airflow increase is that angle going to give you and will that even make a difference? IMO things like getting heads ported, headers extensivly researched, etc is really only worth it if you are going the Forced route. Depending on how much you value your money, 1-2rwkws for $500 for Paccies in an NA is to me, a waste of $ but 5-10rwkws in a Forced setup is well worth it. I'm just glad I wasnt around when the first cars were being made so I didnt slow them down lol what we have nowadays and the technology is truly amazing! What do you mean 1-2rwkw with paccies? you can get 20-25rwkw gain with a full system with pacies???
_________________ EL Futura: CVE head, Wolf V500, ICE Ignition and Coil, 36lb injectors, Walbro 255lb, Paci comps, 3" exhaust, T5, Harrop Truetrac with 3.9s. Now with 198.9rwkw, (~185rwkw and 13.80 @99.1mph) with more power to come |
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| skidder |
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GeZza200 wrote: InspectorRectum wrote: That's the thing that boggles my mind about cars - it's so stupid to think that a pipe made of better material or by someone else's design could give a power increase when, come on, it's just a pipe. But at the speed of which everything is going -pistons, air flow, exhaust flow, etc - a simple bend in a pipe can either almost stop air flow or dramtically inceases the speed of which it flows. Crazy! Everything has to be trailed and remade and it just boggles me how something so little can make such a difference IF the perfect bend or perfect angle is found. But you have to work out how much of airflow increase is that angle going to give you and will that even make a difference? IMO things like getting heads ported, headers extensivly researched, etc is really only worth it if you are going the Forced route. Depending on how much you value your money, 1-2rwkws for $500 for Paccies in an NA is to me, a waste of $ but 5-10rwkws in a Forced setup is well worth it. I'm just glad I wasnt around when the first cars were being made so I didnt slow them down lol what we have nowadays and the technology is truly amazing! What do you mean 1-2rwkw with paccies? you can get 20-25rwkw gain with a full system with pacies??? on a stock car i wouldnt say anymore than 10 (my car was just under 0.2 quicker down the quarter after getting exhaust done, but that was different days so not too conclusive), but on a worked car you would definately gain more.
_________________ EVL098 wrote: Cramping in the hand from having it on your Wang for an excessive period of time is a definate con. Seriously do people google "f**k up modifications for Fords owned by Jews" and get linked straight to this site nowadays? AU,factory fitted tickford kit/IRS, t5,Sports ryder/KYB: gone. |
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| skidder |
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ohh and in relation to your question, get whatever is cheaper....the only thing i would say is try to get ones that have all mandrel bends (either of the pacies)
_________________ EVL098 wrote: Cramping in the hand from having it on your Wang for an excessive period of time is a definate con. Seriously do people google "f**k up modifications for Fords owned by Jews" and get linked straight to this site nowadays? AU,factory fitted tickford kit/IRS, t5,Sports ryder/KYB: gone. |
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