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Starting Issues (intermittent) 

 

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 Post subject: Starting Issues (intermittent)
Posted: Wed Jan 28, 2015 5:57 pm 
Getting Side Ways
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My wife and I own a Automatic NC II Fairlane, it runs no issues but the last couple of months it will not start, acts like it has flat battery but the battery is fine.

The issue is that starts no dramas one day and later on that day or the next day it won't start, at first I thought it was the fault of the usual battery corrosion but clean that up and it starts. Next day or later the same day it fails to start again. Tap the terminals is starts, but last few days its starting to get more aggravating as no more built up on terminals.

I thought it was a battery issue but it's not, it's like the car is immobilized or something.

Could it be the Neutral Safety switch starting to or has failed?

 

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 Post subject: Re: Starting Issues (intermittent)
Posted: Wed Jan 28, 2015 6:50 pm 
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What is the Smartlock Light doing?
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 Post subject: Re: Starting Issues (intermittent)
Posted: Wed Jan 28, 2015 6:57 pm 
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Try bumping above the handbrake while holding the key to start and see if that gets her going... Could be a faulty smartlock module... They get a sticky relay and jolt to the dash can cause it go...

Could also be an inhibitor switch or something...

Cheers,
Tim

 

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 Post subject: Re: Starting Issues (intermittent)
Posted: Thu Jan 29, 2015 1:29 pm 
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And try starting the car in neutral as well as park. The linkage probably needs adjustment - that's probably why you're not getting reverse lights auto-electrical-forum-f89/no-reverse-lights-t128702.html .

Do you get the brake fail light (!) on start position?

 

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 Post subject: Re: Starting Issues (intermittent)
Posted: Thu Jan 29, 2015 2:19 pm 
Getting Side Ways
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Couple of possibles:
- inhibitor switch on the transmission: makes the BCM think the car is in gear when it's not.
- faulty BCM: behind the dash above your left knee. Try giving that area of the dash a good thump with your hand, then try to start.
- Smartlock conflict with alarm/immobiliser: My Mongoose MAP1100G integrated alarm would intermittently conflict with the Smarlock and immobilise the car. Had to have the immobiliser function of the Mongoose disconnected.

 

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 Post subject: Re: Starting Issues (intermittent)
Posted: Fri Jan 30, 2015 8:32 am 
Getting Side Ways
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Age: 33

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Ride: NCII Fairlane

Location: Bathurst
NSW, Australia

TimmyA wrote:
Try bumping above the handbrake while holding the key to start and see if that gets her going... Could be a faulty smartlock module... They get a sticky relay and jolt to the dash can cause it go...

Could also be an inhibitor switch or something...

Cheers,
Tim


We have a winner!

Yeah all those times I didn't even think, tapped the dash and no issues so far been a few days. If it continues I may have to sus out to rectify this issue, or follow a tutorial i found on boosted about cleaning the realay contacts

 

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 Post subject: Re: Starting Issues (intermittent)
Posted: Fri Jan 30, 2015 12:57 pm 
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If you find it, link it...

There is no relay contacts to clean... It is en enclosed PCB type relay... It is in fact a dual relay, two relays in the one package... I fixed my ED one by unsoldering the relay, turning it 180 degrees around and soldering it in again... Hence it used the other relay for starting... No idea what the other side fed in the car, but I never have any problems again...

Think about it, a relay is a electric over mechanical switch... It has moving parts... If you start your car 3 times a day on average... That's a 1000 per year that relay operates... Pretty sure you'll find most relays have a life expectancy of around 10,000 to 20,000 ops for most standard types... Or 10-20years... Seems about right for it to fail now? The tiny little mechanism wears out... Can't see how cleaning the contacts will fix the mechanism...

Alternatively you could straight bridge it out (lose some of the immobilisation) or bring the wiring out of the PCB to a normal relay base and put a plug in relay into it... Few options there...

Everyone talks about dirty contacts but... Can't see how an enclosed relay could get dirty contacts, they are either burnt out altogether or the mechanism is buggered...

Cheers,
Tim

 

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Performance: Complete AUII VCT Wiring & Power Train, Pacey Headers, 2.5" Exhaust, Exedy Clutch, DBA Rotors
Visuals: FG XR Wheel, XR Front, 17's, BA 5 Spd Shifter, BA Ghia Window Switches, NL Cluster
Tunes: 8" Pioneer Sub, JBL Speakers, Clarion Double DIN Headunit

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 Post subject: Re: Starting Issues (intermittent)
Posted: Fri Jan 30, 2015 9:51 pm 
Getting Side Ways
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Age: 33

Posts: 6746

Joined: 13th Mar 2006

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Ride: NCII Fairlane

Location: Bathurst
NSW, Australia

TimmyA wrote:
If you find it, link it...

There is no relay contacts to clean... It is en enclosed PCB type relay... It is in fact a dual relay, two relays in the one package... I fixed my ED one by unsoldering the relay, turning it 180 degrees around and soldering it in again... Hence it used the other relay for starting... No idea what the other side fed in the car, but I never have any problems again...

Think about it, a relay is a electric over mechanical switch... It has moving parts... If you start your car 3 times a day on average... That's a 1000 per year that relay operates... Pretty sure you'll find most relays have a life expectancy of around 10,000 to 20,000 ops for most standard types... Or 10-20years... Seems about right for it to fail now? The tiny little mechanism wears out... Can't see how cleaning the contacts will fix the mechanism...

Alternatively you could straight bridge it out (lose some of the immobilisation) or bring the wiring out of the PCB to a normal relay base and put a plug in relay into it... Few options there...

Everyone talks about dirty contacts but... Can't see how an enclosed relay could get dirty contacts, they are either burnt out altogether or the mechanism is buggered...

Cheers,
Tim


http://www.boostedfalcon.net/viewtopic.php?f=35&t=18905

This is the post I found of boosted .

 

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 Post subject: Re: Starting Issues (intermittent)
Posted: Fri Jan 30, 2015 10:05 pm 
Technical Contributor
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Age: 28

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Ride: ED Falcon

Power: 133 rwkw

Location: Leeton
NSW, Australia

Yeah no worries... Each to their own... I wouldn't be taking a sealed relay and permanently removing the cover to allow them to fill up with dust which would begin to happen in near no time... I would sooner replace with an equivalent relay, even if that involved some hot glue to stick it to the board and then running wire pigtails back...

Like I said too, you'll get one go by just turning the particular relay around 180 degrees so it uses the other side... Will get you out of trouble for many years yet...

Cheers,
Tim

 

_________________

93 Red ED 5spd Manual Build Thread

Performance: Complete AUII VCT Wiring & Power Train, Pacey Headers, 2.5" Exhaust, Exedy Clutch, DBA Rotors
Visuals: FG XR Wheel, XR Front, 17's, BA 5 Spd Shifter, BA Ghia Window Switches, NL Cluster
Tunes: 8" Pioneer Sub, JBL Speakers, Clarion Double DIN Headunit

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 Post subject: Re: Starting Issues (intermittent)
Posted: Sat Jan 31, 2015 8:47 am 
Getting Side Ways
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Age: 33

Posts: 6746

Joined: 13th Mar 2006

Gallery: 10 images

Ride: NCII Fairlane

Location: Bathurst
NSW, Australia

TimmyA wrote:
Yeah no worries... Each to their own... I wouldn't be taking a sealed relay and permanently removing the cover to allow them to fill up with dust which would begin to happen in near no time... I would sooner replace with an equivalent relay, even if that involved some hot glue to stick it to the board and then running wire pigtails back...

Like I said too, you'll get one go by just turning the particular relay around 180 degrees so it uses the other side... Will get you out of trouble for many years yet...

Cheers,
Tim


:mrgreen:

 

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