Fordmods Logo

Trouble bolting EL 5spd to AU motor, help please 

 

Page 1 of 2 [ 20 posts ] Go to page 1, 2  Next

 
 Post subject: Trouble bolting EL 5spd to AU motor, help please
Posted: Fri Apr 06, 2007 5:11 pm 
Getting Side Ways
Offline

Posts: 625

Joined: 6th Nov 2004

Ride: R32 GTR

Location: Brackistan
VIC, Australia

I've managed to sort out all bolts bar one, looking from the rear of the motor, the bottom RHS one. For the upper two bolts from the bellhousing to the sump, I've dremeled out the holes in the bellhousing, for the bottom LHS bolt into the sump I've made a bracket since adequate room was present. I'm at a loss how to reliably and securely bolt up the last bolt at the bottom RHS of the sump, I'd like to have all in since the engine will have around 300hp... Here are some pictures.

(BTW - EL alternator and AC compressor fits easily with alternator bracket modifications, if anyones interested i'll send measurements and pics)



Image

Image

Image

Image
Its the bolt at the bottom of this pic that I can't figure out a good method of attaching to the sump...
Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Fri Apr 06, 2007 5:21 pm 
Getting Side Ways
Offline

Posts: 625

Joined: 6th Nov 2004

Ride: R32 GTR

Location: Brackistan
VIC, Australia

Hey on a tangent, does the BF 6 speed bolt up to an AU motor into an EL sedan? Any further info re the conversion eg input shaft, clutch, bellhousing, clutch release method (I heard they finally went hydraulic), tailshaft etc???

Cheers
Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Fri Apr 06, 2007 5:51 pm 
Moderator
Offline

Posts: 14513

Joined: 7th Nov 2004

Ride: ford falcon au3 xr8

Location: a shit suburb in sydney
NSW, Australia

HI
I noticed you have re drilled the hole on the drivers side of the bellhousing i got a au engine in my ea 5 speed and the only bolts that didnt line up were the 2 lower bolts..

i like what your doing with the bracket for the bottom bolts.. i just left them out lol
Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Fri Apr 06, 2007 8:31 pm 
Oompa Loompa
Offline
User avatar

Age: 35

Posts: 48

Joined: 4th May 2006

Gallery: 3 images

Ride: ED Futura 94

Location: Toowoomba
QLD, Australia

I see your problem and I think I may have a solution. Can you weld? If you can you can weld a bracket or gusset in place to bolt against. You must tap/ hit the weld with a ball pained hammer untill it cools completly. I've never had problem welding Mild steel to Cast using this method. Don't do it if you don't feel capiable.

 

_________________

- May 1994 ED Falcon Futura sedan
- 4.0L, Auto, 3.23 LSD
- Lukey Extractors
- Lukey Exaust 2¼"
- Custom cold air intake
- Custom grill
- 320000Km. Had it for 5 years and 170 000Km without changing a head gasket. Keep you posted.

- 2003 BA Futura
- That's it for now..... lol.

Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Fri Apr 06, 2007 8:56 pm 
Getting Side Ways
Offline
User avatar

Posts: 3363

Joined: 27th Dec 2004

Gallery: 4 images

Ride: MCMXCV Falcon

Location: G town
VIC, Australia

makes no sense to me....cant follow without actually seeing it..

whats the 2nd pic of?

also why did u need to dremel when troyman didnt?

 

_________________

Image

Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Fri Apr 06, 2007 9:09 pm 
Getting Side Ways
Offline
User avatar

Posts: 3115

Joined: 20th Dec 2004

Ride: Falcon

Location: Adelaide
SA, Australia

Dont bother with the bottom bolts. 300hp isnt enough to trouble the engine->bellhousing join without them.

 

_________________

Stoke me a clipper, I'll be back for Christmas

Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Fri Apr 06, 2007 9:44 pm 
Getting Side Ways
Offline

Posts: 625

Joined: 6th Nov 2004

Ride: R32 GTR

Location: Brackistan
VIC, Australia

Nato82 wrote:
I see your problem and I think I may have a solution. Can you weld? If you can you can weld a bracket or gusset in place to bolt against. You must tap/ hit the weld with a ball pained hammer untill it cools completly. I've never had problem welding Mild steel to Cast using this method. Don't do it if you don't feel capiable.


I'm fine with welding however I was hoping someone else had figured how to do it with brackets or something else I could engineer up like the other bracket in the second picture. The sump and bellhousing are cast alloy, to the best of my knowledge there's no way of welding steel to them. If you're suggesting welding steel to cast iron, I've done that before but the block is too far away from this hole

gogetta wrote:
also why did u need to dremel when troyman didnt?


NFI :? This motor is AU series 1
Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Fri Apr 06, 2007 10:07 pm 
Moderator
Offline

Posts: 14513

Joined: 7th Nov 2004

Ride: ford falcon au3 xr8

Location: a shit suburb in sydney
NSW, Australia

Bozz wrote:
Nato82 wrote:
I see your problem and I think I may have a solution. Can you weld? If you can you can weld a bracket or gusset in place to bolt against. You must tap/ hit the weld with a ball pained hammer untill it cools completly. I've never had problem welding Mild steel to Cast using this method. Don't do it if you don't feel capiable.


I'm fine with welding however I was hoping someone else had figured how to do it with brackets or something else I could engineer up like the other bracket in the second picture. The sump and bellhousing are cast alloy, to the best of my knowledge there's no way of welding steel to them. If you're suggesting welding steel to cast iron, I've done that before but the block is too far away from this hole

gogetta wrote:
also why did u need to dremel when troyman didnt?


NFI :? This motor is AU series 1


my engine is series 1 au also..
and i didnt have to drill or modify any holes when i fitted it to the ea bellhousing...
hmm
Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Mon Apr 09, 2007 8:26 am 
Getting Side Ways
Offline

Posts: 625

Joined: 6th Nov 2004

Ride: R32 GTR

Location: Brackistan
VIC, Australia

TROYMAN wrote:
my engine is series 1 au also..
and i didnt have to drill or modify any holes when i fitted it to the ea bellhousing...
hmm


Had a look at another bellhousing and its identical to mine... go figure... The bolts I'm referring to are the top bolts in the sump, 1cm down from the block - they didn't line up without dremeling out the bellhousing.

Got the car running with the AU motor (finally), spent a while on the dyno tuning it on LPG. Got 119rwkw but backed off timing for 115rwkw which had a much wider power band. It got about 460nm of torque in third. Complete list of mods to make the motor fit into EL:

- Cut and shut the sump
- Drill and tap a hole for the centre alternator mount
- Dremel a couple of ribs at the top and bottom of alternator bracket.
- Make a Z-shaped bracket for the bottom rear of the alternator bracket to bolt to sump
- Cut 13mm off the three air conditioner spacers
- Cut 13mm off the three air conditioner bolts
- Dremel out the two upper holes for the bellhousing to make it attach to the sump
- Make a bracket to bolt the passenger side bottom bolt from sump to bellhousing
- Change AU rocker cover for EL one, looks heaps better - they even managed to make the AU rocker cover as ugly as the car
- Change AU oil pump drive gear for EL distributor
- Change AU intake manifold assy for complete EL unit
- Swap knock sensor
- Attach coil to one bolt of intake manifold > head
- Attach capacitor to one sump bolt

Was it worth it? Probably, it's s**t smoother than the EL motor, vibration and harshness kicks in around 3500rpm instead from 1500rpm, until then it's Nissan-like smooth, completely silent, perfect idle and great low down torque. It's lost high end power because its stock, the previous motor had a cam to help wake it up so its not as enjoyable to open up and rev out. About 20+ hours of measuring, welding, fitting, grinding, refitting, swearing etc to get it to fit.

Now I'm at a loss whether I should leave it like this and bolt the turbo up or remove the EL head, have it machined and replace the AU head with the EL one.

Correct me if I'm wrong but doesn't the EL head have larger valves and ports? Since the alted cam that's in the EL motor wont fit in the AU head, would it be worth my while to get a decent cam for the AU head or do a head swap?

Here's the power, torque and AFR curve
http://lotsofspace.net/au_dyno_lpg.jpg

Advice please! Cheers
Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Mon Apr 09, 2007 9:52 am 
Oompa Loompa
Offline
User avatar

Age: 35

Posts: 48

Joined: 4th May 2006

Gallery: 3 images

Ride: ED Futura 94

Location: Toowoomba
QLD, Australia

Bozz wrote:
Nato82 wrote:
I see your problem and I think I may have a solution. Can you weld? If you can you can weld a bracket or gusset in place to bolt against. You must tap/ hit the weld with a ball pained hammer untill it cools completly. I've never had problem welding Mild steel to Cast using this method. Don't do it if you don't feel capiable.


I'm fine with welding however I was hoping someone else had figured how to do it with brackets or something else I could engineer up like the other bracket in the second picture. The sump and bellhousing are cast alloy, to the best of my knowledge there's no way of welding steel to them. If you're suggesting welding steel to cast iron, I've done that before but the block is too far away from this hole

gogetta wrote:
also why did u need to dremel when troyman didnt?


NFI :? This motor is AU series 1


Sure, I saw the hole above where you bolt from the alloy bell housing to the alloy sump. Thought thats where you were meaning. Can't say that you could weld steel to alloy lol. I don't think I would like to leave a bolt out though.

 

_________________

- May 1994 ED Falcon Futura sedan
- 4.0L, Auto, 3.23 LSD
- Lukey Extractors
- Lukey Exaust 2¼"
- Custom cold air intake
- Custom grill
- 320000Km. Had it for 5 years and 170 000Km without changing a head gasket. Keep you posted.

- 2003 BA Futura
- That's it for now..... lol.

Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Mon Apr 09, 2007 10:44 am 
Moderator
Offline

Posts: 14513

Joined: 7th Nov 2004

Ride: ford falcon au3 xr8

Location: a shit suburb in sydney
NSW, Australia

Bozz wrote:
TROYMAN wrote:
my engine is series 1 au also..
and i didnt have to drill or modify any holes when i fitted it to the ea bellhousing...
hmm


Had a look at another bellhousing and its identical to mine... go figure... The bolts I'm referring to are the top bolts in the sump, 1cm down from the block - they didn't line up without dremeling out the bellhousing.

Got the car running with the AU motor (finally), spent a while on the dyno tuning it on LPG. Got 119rwkw but backed off timing for 115rwkw which had a much wider power band. It got about 460nm of torque in third. Complete list of mods to make the motor fit into EL:

- Cut and shut the sump
- Drill and tap a hole for the centre alternator mount
- Dremel a couple of ribs at the top and bottom of alternator bracket.
- Make a Z-shaped bracket for the bottom rear of the alternator bracket to bolt to sump
- Cut 13mm off the three air conditioner spacers
- Cut 13mm off the three air conditioner bolts
- Dremel out the two upper holes for the bellhousing to make it attach to the sump
- Make a bracket to bolt the passenger side bottom bolt from sump to bellhousing
- Change AU rocker cover for EL one, looks heaps better - they even managed to make the AU rocker cover as ugly as the car
- Change AU oil pump drive gear for EL distributor
- Change AU intake manifold assy for complete EL unit
- Swap knock sensor
- Attach coil to one bolt of intake manifold > head
- Attach capacitor to one sump bolt

Was it worth it? Probably, it's s**t smoother than the EL motor, vibration and harshness kicks in around 3500rpm instead from 1500rpm, until then it's Nissan-like smooth, completely silent, perfect idle and great low down torque. It's lost high end power because its stock, the previous motor had a cam to help wake it up so its not as enjoyable to open up and rev out. About 20+ hours of measuring, welding, fitting, grinding, refitting, swearing etc to get it to fit.

Now I'm at a loss whether I should leave it like this and bolt the turbo up or remove the EL head, have it machined and replace the AU head with the EL one.

Correct me if I'm wrong but doesn't the EL head have larger valves and ports? Since the alted cam that's in the EL motor wont fit in the AU head, would it be worth my while to get a decent cam for the AU head or do a head swap?

Here's the power, torque and AFR curve
http://lotsofspace.net/au_dyno_lpg.jpg

Advice please! Cheers


i dont know why you Change AU oil pump drive gear for EL distributor.??

i didnt change mine and im using a el distributor.. ive done about 20,000 kms and there are no signs of problems..
and they looked physically the same..
im interested if there is any real difference in the drive gears??
Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Mon Apr 09, 2007 5:24 pm 
Getting Side Ways
Offline

Posts: 625

Joined: 6th Nov 2004

Ride: R32 GTR

Location: Brackistan
VIC, Australia

I mean I changed the AU gear that fit in place of the dizzy for the EL distributor.... I didn't change anything to do with the oil pump.
Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Mon Apr 09, 2007 5:51 pm 
Getting Side Ways
Offline

Age: 33

Posts: 6746

Joined: 13th Mar 2006

Gallery: 10 images

Ride: NCII Fairlane

Location: Bathurst
NSW, Australia

um why didn't just get an au bellhousing seems to me would of stopped i lot of f**k a** around

 

_________________

R.I.P Tobias my son.

Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Mon Apr 09, 2007 6:02 pm 
Getting Side Ways
Offline
User avatar

Posts: 2644

Joined: 6th Nov 2004

Gallery: 8 images

Ride: 2007

Location: Mount Annan
NSW, Australia

Froudey wrote:
um why didn't just get an au bellhousing seems to me would of stopped i lot of f**k a** around
Thats what I did but they are very hard to find, $750 new from ford or $150 from a wrecker if you can find one. As Troyman said , if it does not upset you then leave the bottom two out.

 

_________________

BF Fairmont Ghia Series II update.
GQ XR6T ghia patrol.

,======o00o
//__|__|_,\_____\,___
|_/--\'_|'__|_/--\_[]IIII[]
_( o ) )_____( o ) )=o=) )__

Top
 Profile  
 
 
Posted: Mon Apr 09, 2007 6:02 pm 
Getting Side Ways
Offline

Posts: 625

Joined: 6th Nov 2004

Ride: R32 GTR

Location: Brackistan
VIC, Australia

Froudey wrote:
um why didn't just get an au bellhousing seems to me would of stopped i lot of f**k a** around


Where is this source of AU bellhousings that you speak of?

They're made from unobtainium and priced to match the rarity of this material.
Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:
Sort by  
 Page 1 of 2  [ 20 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 18 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

 

 

It is currently Tue Dec 12, 2017 3:05 am All times are UTC + 11 hours

 

 

(c)2014 Total Web Solutions Australia - Australian Web Hosting and Domain Names