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best computer to use with a turbo?? 

 

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 Post subject: best computer to use with a turbo??
Posted: Mon Jan 04, 2010 1:23 am 
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hey guys, just wondering about what computer or chip to use with a forced induction setup, i have looked into the j3 chip or whatever its called, and also the wolf but cant sort of get my head around it, do you plug the ecu into a laptop and play with injector pulse ect?
thanks in advance guys,
sorry for the newb q's
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 Post subject: Re: best computer to use with a turbo??
Posted: Mon Jan 04, 2010 6:59 am 
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hi therei have an ea with auvct 4.0 dont mess around with chips been there
i have had a wolf 3d 4.7 in my ea for 6 years it does almost any thing u want ran great 4 3 years as n/a made 147 rwkw now runs my turbo set up for 2 years no probs very tuneable up to 1.3bar runs the thermos , vct and of course fuel, boost and timing all displayed on my hand controler .can be tuned on dyno or on the road with hand controler great peice of gear
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 Post subject: Re: best computer to use with a turbo??
Posted: Mon Jan 04, 2010 1:10 pm 
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but a motec if money is not a issue, haltec and wolf are good, but they dont do much more then a j3 does believe it or not, and they cost alot more..

with the j3 you give it a run, then muck around with the lap top and tune it, re-run re-tune etc.. you can muck around with injector pulse and afr but the j3 is more of a b**ch to tune cars with then most ecu's hence more dyno runs

 

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 Post subject: Re: best computer to use with a turbo??
Posted: Mon Jan 04, 2010 2:04 pm 
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4dlvr wrote:
but a motec if money is not a issue, haltec and wolf are good, but they dont do much more then a j3 does believe it or not, and they cost alot more..

with the j3 you give it a run, then muck around with the lap top and tune it, re-run re-tune etc.. you can muck around with injector pulse and afr but the j3 is more of a b**ch to tune cars with then most ecu's hence more dyno runs


why don't you shut the f**k up unless you know something. J3 is dodgy as f**k. You need a 10:1 Rising rate reg with a J3. To the OP, find a Tuner you want to use and ask them What ECU they prefer to tune.

 

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 Post subject: Re: best computer to use with a turbo??
Posted: Mon Jan 04, 2010 4:16 pm 
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???
most tuners prefer to tune with a product they advertise. not what suits you application..
yes you do have to use a Rising rate reg with a J3 big s**t..

the j3 isnt dodgy at all, it does exactly what its supposed to do, its limited to what it can do compared to other more expensive ecu's

if the j3 wasn't a excellent bang for your buck chip it wouldnt be so common..

i am in the same boat as this guy, so why dont you shut the f$#k up unless you have some useful info

 

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Garrett gt40turbo, iceman plenum, ported head, turbo cam, double valvesprings, 023 fuel pump, 36lb injectors 4' cat, 4' dump, 2.5 exhaust, build bottom end, hypertonic pistons rods & rods, king bearings, j3. c10 3500 stall
232rwkw@4psi

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 Post subject: Re: best computer to use with a turbo??
Posted: Mon Jan 04, 2010 5:53 pm 
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:shock:
thanks for the help fella's, do you know round abouts how much the price difference is between the j3 and the upper range of ecu's?
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 Post subject: Re: best computer to use with a turbo??
Posted: Mon Jan 04, 2010 7:15 pm 
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depending on what brand of ecu you want ..
im running an ems stinger. it was $1200, there is the ems 6680 which is the next one up its about $1500..
and there are different brands of j3 that vary in price from $200 up to $700 without the tune...
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 Post subject: Re: best computer to use with a turbo??
Posted: Mon Jan 04, 2010 10:18 pm 
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And as for the top of the line Motec M800 with all capabilities enabled you are looking at close to $8000 all up.

Ask yourself how you want to control the engine and then choose your ECU on that. Do you want Boost control or not and if you want boost control how do you want it? Single stage, multi stage, fully mapped with gear/engine RPM/road speed? Do you want launch control, anti lag, soft and hard rev limiters, 2D or 3D fuel and ignition mapping, increased mapping resolution, data logging? The list goes on.

Personally if you want a basic setup with no boost control (assuming you have your own boost controller) then the Microtech provides the best bang for buck. Many VL turbo's that run 9's still run Microtech's. I think my brother paid $1400 (installed) for his Microtech. These things are on par with a J3 chip or Tweecer but personally I'd use the factory Ecu where possible on a street car. The only reason Microtechs find their way onto VL's is because once an intercooler is fitted (even with standard boost) the airflow meter readings are maxed out due to the increased density of the cooler incoming air and the car develops a lean condition that not even a rising rate reg can cure. They are also very popular with the rotary crowd and they have been controlling some seriously powerfull cars over the years. Remember that gold twin turbo commodore from WA that made 1200hp at the treads or something ridiculous like that? That's controlled by a Microtech.

Anyone got a link for the ECU guide that was posted up a while ago? Pro's and cons of all of the major ECU's was discussed in great detail.
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 Post subject: Re: best computer to use with a turbo??
Posted: Mon Jan 04, 2010 10:35 pm 
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Pick a tuner and use him.. Not necessary a mechanics shop...
I run Haltech E11v2 with 480 rwkw..There are new Haltech's out now..
If you want a second hand ECU check E bay for Haltech E6X, EMS, Motec M4 clubsport etc with all the loom to fit .. The upper Motec ECU's are in excess of $8,000...[Buying the ECU is only part tune equpement]

The old Motec M4 is an option second hand..
EMS Stinger and 8860 work VERY well on Falcon 6's..
It's VERY IMPORTANT to have GOOD tune with forced induction !!
Especially turbo's as boost / power is not lineal .. Boost can be anywhere in rpm range.. So ECU must tune well all the time..
I cannot see why some people spend big on engine etc then fit bodgy
12 to 1 rising rate and run timing retarded or fit boost retard which is also bodgy!!
$1500 for ECU plus fitting and tuning is what keeps engines alive!!

 

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Last edited by EBXR8380 on Mon Jan 04, 2010 10:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: best computer to use with a turbo??
Posted: Mon Jan 04, 2010 10:37 pm 
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The J3 and the other expansions you can use with it are amazingly good value, it doesnt have all the features of the motec's, haltechs and wolfs as it can only use the std falcon ecu.

i think the J3 is limited mainly (in your situation) by boost. the MAP sensor i dont think can read boost nor can the ecu. So i think that rules it out for a good quality boost app.

however for all the other hardware mods (exhaust, cam, TB, porting, ignition etc etc) it is the way to go.

 

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 Post subject: Re: best computer to use with a turbo??
Posted: Mon Jan 04, 2010 10:45 pm 
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I'm speaking from experience here, I mucked around with a J3 when I turbo'd my car, if there was more support and more tuners around then yeah I think it'd be decent depending on what you want to do, they're also great to learn with as well as you can tweak them yourself.

But you have to run something that will bleed off boost after around 9psi, I didn't want to bother with some 11ty:1 rising rate fuel reg so I got bigger injectors and fuel pump, when I had to get it tuned I had a bit of trouble because there's only two tuners in Melbourne I know of that tune these things and I didn't want to goto one of them, and the other had trouble with some BIN files, so in the end I bought a microtech, it uses all the stock sensors and was easy as to wire up only 13 wires IIRC, started first go, and there's plenty of tuners to choose from!

Personally with a turbo car i'd go an aftermarket ECU, purely because there's alot of tuners to choose from.

 

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 Post subject: Re: best computer to use with a turbo??
Posted: Tue Jan 05, 2010 12:06 am 
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thanks for all the help guys!
i think i will be sticking around on these boards for a while!! lol.
so after reading through all that, i have sorta got my heart set on the aftermarket ECU, but i am kinda not understanding something, so i go buy the ECU, then wire it in, turn the key and presto???

and do you have to dyno them, or do they self learn?
thanks.
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 Post subject: Re: best computer to use with a turbo??
Posted: Tue Jan 05, 2010 12:07 am 
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gasdea wrote:
thanks for all the help guys!
i think i will be sticking around on these boards for a while!! lol.
so after reading through all that, i have sorta got my heart set on the aftermarket ECU, but i am kinda not understanding something, so i go buy the ECU, then wire it in, turn the key and presto???

and do you have to dyno them, or do they self learn?
thanks.


They need to be tuned, by a professional tuner, on a dyno.

 

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 Post subject: Re: best computer to use with a turbo??
Posted: Tue Jan 05, 2010 12:56 am 
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If you buy a microtech it will have a base map on it already, so yes wire it up and it'll start, my one started first go and I helped a mate with his and his started first go as well (we both forgot to wire the earth up though lol, but after that, first go)

It would be driveable but you would have to get it tuned on a dyno for it to be safe.

 

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 Post subject: Re: best computer to use with a turbo??
Posted: Mon Jan 11, 2010 7:51 pm 
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needfordspeed wrote:
If you buy a microtech it will have a base map on it already, so yes wire it up and it'll start, my one started first go and I helped a mate with his and his started first go

My Stinger had a base map also, and mine started first go as well. 150,000km motor and 227rwkw.

As said, pick a tuner and go with what they like to use. They are all roughly the same price. Wire it up yourself and the money you'll save will pay for the tuning.

From my experience, EMS's after sales service would be hard to beat.......

Cheers

Daz

 

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