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 Post subject: Woohoo first post, now on to my question.
Posted: Mon Nov 08, 2004 12:05 pm 
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Does anyone have any goot pics of the CAPA stage 1 (6 psi boost) vortech supercharger kit on an EA-ED the ones on CAPA's site are crap, im trying to figure out if theer is enough room to fit in the plumbing for a side mount intercooler.

 

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Posted: Mon Nov 08, 2004 12:17 pm 
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I know this not what you're asking but there's no need for a cooler on that particular application. The kit comes with water injection which should cool the charge adequately. You may find that you loose boost on a low-PSI setup like the stage 1 if you decide to run a cooler.

 

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Posted: Mon Nov 08, 2004 12:18 pm 
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4.9 EF Futura wrote:
I know this not what you're asking but there's no need for a cooler on that particular application. The kit comes with water injection which should cool the charge adequately. You may find that you loose boost on a low-PSI setup like the stage 1 if you decide to run a cooler.


would it be sensible to consider water injection on a NA application?

 

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Posted: Mon Nov 08, 2004 12:32 pm 
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Waggin wrote:
4.9 EF Futura wrote:
I know this not what you're asking but there's no need for a cooler on that particular application. The kit comes with water injection which should cool the charge adequately. You may find that you loose boost on a low-PSI setup like the stage 1 if you decide to run a cooler.


would it be sensible to consider water injection on a NA application?


I guess it depends what kind of water injection system you're considering. Have a poke around some rotary forums (cos i'm sure you've got plenty of spare time at the moment, hehehehe) and a lot of them run a second injector into the manifold for water injection. Apparantley can replace up to 50% of fuel with H2O... but of course all rotaries are turbo nowadays. Not just for cooling the air charge but think about it - more H and more O is always gonna be a good thang. Dunno if it qualifies as a catalyst but definately assists combustion.

My system very primitave (sorry CAPA). 3PSI boost closes a switch which turns a pump on which sprays water into the intake, just before the blower. Doubt if this would be much chop on a n/a system so if it were worthwhile, i'd look at a more complex manifold/cylinder injection system, much like methanol injection as i doubt intake charge temps would be too much of a problem on n/a.....

 

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Posted: Mon Nov 08, 2004 2:42 pm 
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Water/meth injection is used on NA motors, usually to allow for some added advance timing, and good on high comp motors.
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Posted: Mon Nov 08, 2004 3:42 pm 
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Hmm.. I'll have to look into it. 2 people didnt laugh at me :)

11.7:1 counts as Hi-comp... Could be quite interesting.

 

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Posted: Mon Nov 08, 2004 3:51 pm 
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Who said i wasnt laughing? Nah, just jokes. Yeah Chef covered what i should have - the injection system on my setup isnt for performance gains, more for improved reliability and greater resistance to a bad case of the knocks. Makes me sleep easier at night and at 5500rpm

With 11.7:1, i assume pinging is your new worst enemy as well.

 

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Posted: Mon Nov 08, 2004 3:57 pm 
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4.9 EF Futura wrote:
With 11.7:1, i assume pinging is your new worst enemy as well.


I thought it would be too, but the new engine and 24lb/hr injectors seem to have overcome any issue re: pinging. I guess it will be a different story once the motec is in and tuned up.

If water injection means I can advance timing a bit more, and cram more Oxygen in there.. hopefully its worth a bit more power too.

 

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Posted: Mon Nov 08, 2004 4:02 pm 
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Yeah more timing advance is the key. With boost its always better to err well into the side of caution, n/a probably allow you to operate closer to the pinging frontier (without the nervous fits, lol).

Did someone say MORE dyno time? I think they did :wink:

 

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 Post subject: because
Posted: Mon Nov 08, 2004 5:06 pm 
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4.9 EF Futura wrote:
I know this not what you're asking but there's no need for a cooler on that particular application. The kit comes with water injection which should cool the charge adequately. You may find that you loose boost on a low-PSI setup like the stage 1 if you decide to run a cooler.


i dont think the 6 PSI (stage one) CAPA kit even has water injection, i was thinking of buying the 6 PSI kit with the straight scroll compressor housing, and a 9 PSI S/C pulley and running it through an intercooler, so no need for water injection, and it comes out cheaper.

 

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 Post subject: Re: because
Posted: Mon Nov 08, 2004 5:21 pm 
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JOSE wrote:
4.9 EF Futura wrote:
I know this not what you're asking but there's no need for a cooler on that particular application. The kit comes with water injection which should cool the charge adequately. You may find that you loose boost on a low-PSI setup like the stage 1 if you decide to run a cooler.


i dont think the 6 PSI (stage one) CAPA kit even has water injection, i was thinking of buying the 6 PSI kit with the straight scroll compressor housing, and a 9 PSI S/C pulley and running it through an intercooler, so no need for water injection, and it comes out cheaper.


Interesting..... whatever you decide, make sure you have a good chat with the boys at CAPA. I found Justin was a champ to deal with. They're honest - if there's a way to make it work they'll help, if it's a no-go they'll tell you straight up.

May not be as easy as getting a new pulley, as there are a lot of tuning implications with upping the boost - fuel injectors come to mind. This is the difference between the different stages - they all use the same blower but have different s**t for fuel delivery - injectors, booster pumps and regulators. Not to mention the chip.....

 

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 Post subject: Re: Woohoo first post, now on to my question.
Posted: Mon Nov 08, 2004 10:21 pm 
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JOSE wrote:
Does anyone have any goot pics of the CAPA stage 1 (6 psi boost) vortech supercharger kit on an EA-ED the ones on CAPA's site are crap, im trying to figure out if theer is enough room to fit in the plumbing for a side mount intercooler.


I assume you are talking about a 6cyl. The Stage 1 6psi kits are Powerdyne blowers not Vortech. The Vortech blowers are only an option on the EF/EL engines as there will be clearance issues with the EA-ED manifold. If you want to go vortech, I would imagine you will need to do a manifold swap first.

The CAPA kits are ok for lower boost applications, but if you are planning on running more than 6-8psi be prepared for a lot of extra cost as you really need aftermarket computer and injectors etc.

As 4.9 EF Futura said, give CAPA a call. I also delt with Justin, and even though he is a holden guy :evil: he gave me some good advice and options.
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Posted: Mon Nov 08, 2004 10:48 pm 
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im contemplating the same kit, when you add up all the s**t you do first off to a na it almost equates to the same price of just slapping a capa kit on
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Posted: Mon Nov 08, 2004 11:36 pm 
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Felony wrote:
im contemplating the same kit, when you add up all the s**t you do first off to a na it almost equates to the same price of just slapping a capa kit on


Exactly right, and nothing beats boost :D
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 Post subject: Re: Woohoo first post, now on to my question.
Posted: Tue Nov 09, 2004 12:26 pm 
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EDXR8 wrote:
I assume you are talking about a 6cyl. The Stage 1 6psi kits are Powerdyne blowers not Vortech.


Yeh that one, i though the CAPA kits came with the chip/injectors/pressure reg?, when i have the money i will have to start phoning people up and figuring it all out, untill then i cant really make any plans.

 

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