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302 Windsor AU falcon noise problem 

 

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 Post subject: 302 Windsor AU falcon noise problem
Posted: Fri Nov 20, 2009 9:51 pm 
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Ride: AU XLS Ute V8

Location: Newcastle
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Hello everybody,

I have an unusual problem with my windsor. It's a 5 speed AU XLS ute with the 302 v8 in it. I have very little complaints with it coming from a non turbo diesel hilux and from 4wds in general. The major issue is a noise that develops at what seems to be the front of the engine only while under load.
The noise appears very rarely 3 or 4 times a month only when loading the engine up generally accelerating at around 3500-4000rpm. When the noise comes I immediately lose power (knock sensor kicking in maybe?) to the point where if I kept the throttle up it would continue to miss however if I let the throttle go and let it drop back to idle the noise will disappear and everything returns to normal and I can drive off again. The problem isn't really getting worse but I can imagine a time when I need to accelerate hard in traffic and won't be able to due to the engine spluttering so I want to get it sorted.
The noise sounds like a gear or a really bad bearing noise very audible from within the cabin.

If anyone can shed some light on what this problem might be that would be great or if you need anything clarified just ask.

Thanks in advance,
Peter
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 Post subject: Re: 302 Windsor AU falcon noise problem
Posted: Fri Nov 20, 2009 10:00 pm 
Parts Gopher
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Age: 39

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Ride: eb xr8 falcon/1966 xr fairmont

Location: Elizabeth Grove
SA, Australia

could be a timing chain or a dizzy gear problem, a tenitioner maybe worn, but that would make noise when idling, harmonic balencer maybe
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 Post subject: Re: 302 Windsor AU falcon noise problem
Posted: Fri Nov 20, 2009 10:14 pm 
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Ride: AU XLS Ute V8

Location: Newcastle
NSW, Australia

I'm thinking it might have something to do with the timing chain so the next step is to pull it all apart and have a look. Would have to be the idler pully/tensioner I imagine if it were but as you say doesn't make a noise any other time which would be strange (don't know if pully/tensioner are one in the same haven't had a a look yet).
Harmonic balancer is a distinct possibility. Is there a way to test if the harmonic balancer is rat s**t?
If it were dizzy gear wouldn't ignition timing be lost completely?
Very strange that the noise comes in then once I drop it back to idle it accelerates as if nothing was wrong.

Cheers for the feedback fella :)
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 Post subject: Re: 302 Windsor AU falcon noise problem
Posted: Fri Nov 20, 2009 10:30 pm 
Parts Gopher
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Age: 39

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Ride: eb xr8 falcon/1966 xr fairmont

Location: Elizabeth Grove
SA, Australia

what sort of sound is it, like a knock, ticking noise or just a niose that is more irritating.
It's like the way you describe when you get up to your mid range in the revs it starts to lack power, that to me is an indication to a timing thing, also normally when a harmonic balancer is buggerd the rubber seal in the centre lets go and the outer parts just wobbles and makes a ding sound, so now i am more looking to the timing chain, How many ks has it done and whether it has ever had atiming chan kit
when you get to the mid range rpm does it lose oil pressure might be the oil pump, it's hard to know what it is exactly cause i can't hear it.
I have a ebxr8 and i am having firing problems but you got something that only makes noise when loading your car up.
The older cars if the timing is out it will generally ping when loading up, lacks power also, the pining noise is generally herad in the headers thou.

Not sure mate it's a tricky 1 and i hope its not a big job to fix it
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 Post subject: Re: 302 Windsor AU falcon noise problem
Posted: Sat Nov 21, 2009 10:06 am 
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Ride: AU XLS Ute V8

Location: Newcastle
NSW, Australia

The sound is like a whirring sound like a bearing being wound up. It's hard to describe noises but if you can imagine the noise a gearbox makes when you reverse quickly, well similar to that noise but alot louder. The noise is the first thing I'll hear (always in mid to high range and always when loading the engine up) then it will have no power until you drop it back to idle which after dropping it back will accelerate and run fine.

The car has 305k on the clock, have no idea about it's service history as have only owned for last 15k.

Cheers
Peter
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 Post subject: Re: 302 Windsor AU falcon noise problem
Posted: Sat Nov 21, 2009 12:41 pm 
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Ride: 93 ED sedan

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When you take the oil cap off and look inside...is it grotty...gluggy...crap stuck on everthing?????
If so, I'd hate to see what the oil pick-up looks like.... :shock:

 

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 Post subject: Re: 302 Windsor AU falcon noise problem
Posted: Sat Nov 21, 2009 5:07 pm 
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Ride: AU XLS Ute V8

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Oil cap looks clean and oil pressure is good (going off the tickford cluster I swapped in). Doubt it would be a pickup/supply problem as it's always load specific. ie. it will never make the noise sitting in neutral revving the engine only when torque load is placed on the motor going through the gears.
Will try to upload a video of the problem noise in the next week if anyone wants a listen?

Cheers
Peter
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 Post subject: Re: 302 Windsor AU falcon noise problem
Posted: Sat Nov 21, 2009 8:47 pm 
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uhhohh wrote:
Oil cap looks clean and oil pressure is good (going off the tickford cluster I swapped in). Doubt it would be a pickup/supply problem as it's always load specific. ie. it will never make the noise sitting in neutral revving the engine only when torque load is placed on the motor going through the gears.
Will try to upload a video of the problem noise in the next week if anyone wants a listen?

Cheers
Peter


Not the oil cap..inside...where the rocker gear is.....like this....\/ \/ \/ \/

 

 

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 Post subject: Re: 302 Windsor AU falcon noise problem
Posted: Sat Nov 21, 2009 9:53 pm 
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It does sound timing chain and/or cam encoder gear related which could be causing the Crank encoder wheel to go out of sync with cam encoder. Also check the crank encoder pickup hasn't come loose and is rubbing on the encoder wheel.
Get it on a dyno so you can look at the front of the engine while it's happening. You may also pick up a fault code via an EEC self test.
btw AU V8's don't have knock control.
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 Post subject: Re: 302 Windsor AU falcon noise problem
Posted: Sat Nov 21, 2009 10:49 pm 
Getting Side Ways
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Its funny how the AU V8's are coil pack ignition, and don't have knock sensors.... :shock:

 

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 Post subject: Re: 302 Windsor AU falcon noise problem
Posted: Sat Nov 21, 2009 10:52 pm 
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XR9UTE wrote:
btw AU V8's don't have knock control.


Lol sweet that's one less thing it can be then :lol:

I'm thinking I might just bite the bullet and pull the front off and see if anything is obviously wrong. Thanks for your input guys.

Cheers
Peter
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 Post subject: Re: 302 Windsor AU falcon noise problem
Posted: Sun Nov 22, 2009 8:02 am 
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My advice is to take it to a mechanic, and get them to have a listen and diagnose it for you.

 

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 Post subject: Re: 302 Windsor AU falcon noise problem
Posted: Sun Nov 22, 2009 10:07 am 
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Not the dreaded harmonic ballancer ??
Check simple things like engine mounts...

 

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 Post subject: Re: 302 Windsor AU falcon noise problem
Posted: Fri Nov 27, 2009 4:07 pm 
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cjh wrote:
Its funny how the AU V8's are coil pack ignition, and don't have knock sensors.... :shock:


Why is it funny?
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 Post subject: Re: 302 Windsor AU falcon noise problem
Posted: Fri Nov 27, 2009 10:09 pm 
Getting Side Ways
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XR9UTE wrote:
cjh wrote:
Its funny how the AU V8's are coil pack ignition, and don't have knock sensors.... :shock:


Why is it funny?

Because EF's have a coil pack & have a knock sensor...as do VN, VP, VR,VS, VT...etc Commo's....Camry's, Mitsubishi's.........

 

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