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BBK SSI-R (short runner T3 box style) intake - knowledge? 

 

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Posted: Wed Aug 06, 2008 11:10 pm 
Oompa Loompa
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We're kind of halfway through the dyno tuning. There's some exhaust leaks that need to be sorted out before the tune can be finished, but preliminarily, we've got about 300rwhp@6500rpm, up from about 270@5800rpm. Not sure of the tourque difference - not looked at a chart yet.
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Posted: Fri Aug 08, 2008 6:28 pm 
Parts Gopher
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just had a quote from ford for the 5.6 manifold f@%$ me
manifold upper $1500
lower $1497
lid $900
throttle body $230
are they serious??
How much did you end up getting the manifold for?
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Posted: Fri Aug 08, 2008 6:33 pm 
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ad another zero on the throttle body
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Posted: Fri Aug 08, 2008 6:54 pm 
Getting Side Ways
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$2300 for a bloody throttle body???

Far out...

 

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'95 EF XR8 auto, Advance headers, 3" exhaust, Cobra manifold, BBK 75mm throttle body , 80MM Marauder MAF, Vortech V2 T Trim , 307 rwhp, 405 ft/lb 13.2 @ 105 MPH

Now N/A (permanent Lag) - AFR 165's, Comp XE270 cam, 1.6 RR - 269 rwhp 14.1 @ 102mph.

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Posted: Fri Aug 08, 2008 7:09 pm 
Oompa Loompa
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Throttle body will be expensive for the 5.4 because it electronic control, not a traditional mechanical item.

Last edited by slacker on Wed Jun 03, 2009 12:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Posted: Fri Aug 08, 2008 7:18 pm 
Getting Side Ways
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slacker wrote:
Throttle body will be expensive for the 5.4 because it electronic control, not a traditional mechanical item.


The price above was for a T/B for the 5.6L T3 engine, exact same set-up T/B as any other 5.0 windsor just 82mm.

 

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Posted: Fri Aug 08, 2008 7:29 pm 
Oompa Loompa
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Posted: Fri Aug 08, 2008 8:04 pm 
Getting Side Ways
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Any further word on how the SSIR performed? :)

 

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200kw 5.0L, T5, Koni shocks, King S/Lows, Whiteline swaybars, DBA 4000 rotors, Acron CAI, 80mm Accufab TB, Difillipo headers & cats, twin 2.5" & Aerochambers, 3.91 LSD.

To Come:
Long rod 306, TFS 11R 205cc heads, SHP camshaft, 1.72 R/R, ported TFS Box R, 400hp NX SHO kit...

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Posted: Sat Aug 09, 2008 12:50 pm 
Oompa Loompa
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I'll post it up when it happens, but it may still be another week or two....
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Posted: Sat Aug 09, 2008 2:23 pm 
Getting Side Ways
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No worries

 

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TE50 T1 P01
200kw 5.0L, T5, Koni shocks, King S/Lows, Whiteline swaybars, DBA 4000 rotors, Acron CAI, 80mm Accufab TB, Difillipo headers & cats, twin 2.5" & Aerochambers, 3.91 LSD.

To Come:
Long rod 306, TFS 11R 205cc heads, SHP camshaft, 1.72 R/R, ported TFS Box R, 400hp NX SHO kit...

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Posted: Fri Sep 05, 2008 1:06 pm 
Oompa Loompa
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Dyno Graphs.

Only changes between the two runs is the manifolds, and obviously the date. The second run was on a warmer day than the first. Obviously we've gained top-end at the expense of a lot of midrange power and torque and overall probably gone backwards. Overall I'm a bit disappointed.....at this stage.

However.... The dyno operator suspects that advancing the cam may return some of the mid-range, thus we need to check the cam timing and advance it by a couple of degrees, depending on precisely where it's at right now (which also needs to be checked).

It's been a very long time since I checked a cam's timing, and even then I've only ever done it on SOHC motors. I have an aftermarket good quality timing chain that is adjustable, but i don't have a degree wheel or a dial gauge. Where's the best place to get these, and I'd also appreciate any tips on checking the cam timing on a windsor....

 

 

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Posted: Tue Sep 09, 2008 11:23 am 
Getting Side Ways
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I'll be honest and say that is the 'shape' of graph that I'd expect to see. Its a shame the bottom scale is in km/h not rpm, it would be more meaningful. However from what I can see you've lost peak torque (normal when changing to shorter length runners), but the engine holds onto torque for longer and will rpm for at least another 500rpm beyond what you've run it to on the dyno.

So as it stands if you RPM range is from ~4800-7000, I would say you've made a gain. :)

 

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TE50 T1 P01
200kw 5.0L, T5, Koni shocks, King S/Lows, Whiteline swaybars, DBA 4000 rotors, Acron CAI, 80mm Accufab TB, Difillipo headers & cats, twin 2.5" & Aerochambers, 3.91 LSD.

To Come:
Long rod 306, TFS 11R 205cc heads, SHP camshaft, 1.72 R/R, ported TFS Box R, 400hp NX SHO kit...

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 Post subject: Re: BBK SSI-R (short runner T3 box style) intake - knowledge?
Posted: Sun Feb 15, 2009 9:56 am 
Oompa Loompa
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Another Update, and again apologies for my slowness. I don't have a scan of the latest Dyno graph, but I advanced the cam by 2 degrees (i.e. advanced crank gear 4 degrees), and we saw some better results. The graph shape is more or less the same - perhaps a little more torque, but max power went up 25hp to 311rwhp at about 6000rpm. This is at about the same point in the rev range as previously, so clearly the limiting factor is the heads' flow, which in practice is not as high as we measured on the flow bench. Of course, the exhaust manifolds (std EL GT / XR8 series II items) could also be a restriction, but I think that is unlikely. We might gain a little from making some tuned length pipes, but the cost is significant. There may aso be a gain from getting a different cam. The cam was custom made based on the head bloke's figures and thoughts in conjunction with the cam manufacturer's ideas. Given that our real-work working-revs are a little lower than we expected, it may be worth talking to him too.

Part of the increase in power will be going from a 3.9 to a 4.11 final drive, and assuming this is a direct relationship I reckon the ratio change is worth 15hp ( (4.11-3.9)/3.9 * 286hp = 15hp), so the cam timing change yeilded 10 hp. If anyone disagrees with my maths and assumptions for the ratio change - I'm all ears.

So the Explorer manifold had great torque but not much top end and the SSI-R has a fantastic top end but loses torque through the short runners. I'd like a bit more torque (i.e. mid-range performance) so I don't have to reve the ring off of it all the time and it's less 'cammy'. I think that our estimations of the working rev-range of the heads was too high and while the explorer manifold was definitely a restriction, it wasn't as significant as we initially thought.

Thus, I'm thinking of trying a more middle of the road manifold like the Edelbrock RPM Performer or Performer II for EFI which has a very similar design to the Explorer. I think it might just meet my height restrictions, and Edelbrock claim it's good for 6500rpm, but it still has the longer runners that will deliver torque more like the explorer. If it's too tall I may consider machining a little bit off the mating faces between the upper and lower and re-matching the ports and sorting out the bolt-holes and threads for bolting them together.

So. I need to get a manifold. I have done a search in the for sale section and contacted the people who have had ones for sale in the past to no avail (no-one got back to me). Nothing's come up on EPay either for the last couple of months. If anyone's got an RPM Performer gathering dust, or knows of one, please PM or email me through the forum.

Discuss.
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 Post subject: Re: BBK SSI-R (short runner T3 box style) intake - knowledge?
Posted: Sat Feb 21, 2009 12:09 am 
Getting Side Ways
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Ive got an RPMII that has been extrude honed & bench flow runner balanced, match ported with a 75mmTB.

Only problem is that it has had the port faces & valley face milled down quiet a bit to suit my decked block and has also been match ported to suit AFR185's. So I dont know if it will be any good to you or not, plus with all the work done it does owe me a few bob.

 

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