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Improving your 6cyl E-series Throttlebody the DIY way 

 

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 Post subject: Re: Improving your 6cyl E-series Throttlebody the DIY way
Posted: Tue Aug 31, 2010 3:10 pm 
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RAPTOR_XR8 wrote:
With an increase of 8% thats a pretty good gain, id be looking at get it possibly bored out to 65mm too.


this 8% increase will only be available at WOT.
At half throttle there wont be any gains, you only notice gains in partial throttle opening when the diametre is bigger.

That's a good point too actually. Only at WOT.

 

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 Post subject: Re: Improving your 6cyl E-series Throttlebody the DIY way
Posted: Tue Aug 31, 2010 4:14 pm 
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While one or two kw might not sound like much, i tend to wonder what the torque increase is, if any, as that is what get's the car moving in the first place.

Cheers

ToranaGuy

 

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 Post subject: Re: Improving your 6cyl E-series Throttlebody the DIY way
Posted: Tue Aug 31, 2010 4:19 pm 
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this is what the 68mm did on my car

im thinking about getting some more made up....

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 Post subject: Re: Improving your 6cyl E-series Throttlebody the DIY way
Posted: Tue Aug 31, 2010 4:24 pm 
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Yeah, I only used small numbers for the idea, but that's also a good one, torque can change as well.
A mate bought this little book about all the graphs and equations for mechanical engineering.
And it was insane, all sorts of graphs showing torque to horspower increases and how to work all the stuff out on paper.

 

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 Post subject: Re: Improving your 6cyl E-series Throttlebody the DIY way
Posted: Tue Aug 31, 2010 11:54 pm 
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FAST-XR wrote:
this is what the 68mm did on my car

im thinking about getting some more made up....


I don't suppose we can ask you which lines were with what tb?

Cheers

ToranaGuy

 

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 Post subject: Re: Improving your 6cyl E-series Throttlebody the DIY way
Posted: Thu Sep 02, 2010 9:21 am 
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ToranaGuy wrote:
FAST-XR wrote:
this is what the 68mm did on my car

im thinking about getting some more made up....


I don't suppose we can ask you which lines were with what tb?

Cheers

ToranaGuy

haha, pink and orange mate, it made gains in power and torque...

 

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 Post subject: Re: Improving your 6cyl E-series Throttlebody the DIY way
Posted: Thu Sep 02, 2010 9:35 am 
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Lowlane7 wrote:
Yeah, I only used small numbers for the idea, but that's also a good one, torque can change as well.
A mate bought this little book about all the graphs and equations for mechanical engineering.
And it was insane, all sorts of graphs showing torque to horspower increases and how to work all the stuff out on paper.


Don't take to heart what your mates are telling you.

You can't justify by giving a hypothetical X kw increase for each modification, when each mod ON ITS OWN might only make this difference, but when used together if properly matched would make a much bigger difference.

Example, standard engine with 4480's might hypothetically pick up X kw of peak power over the standard manifold. Get a worked engine and measure the difference between standard manifold and the 4480's and I guarantee you will pick up a lot more.

 

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 Post subject: Re: Improving your 6cyl E-series Throttlebody the DIY way
Posted: Thu Sep 02, 2010 10:23 am 
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FAST-XR wrote:
ToranaGuy wrote:
FAST-XR wrote:
this is what the 68mm did on my car

im thinking about getting some more made up....


I don't suppose we can ask you which lines were with what tb?

Cheers

ToranaGuy

haha, pink and orange mate, it made gains in power and torque...

Seems it made gains across the entire rev range with a nice increase up top with the 68mm bore, nice work!!

 

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 Post subject: Re: Improving your 6cyl E-series Throttlebody the DIY way
Posted: Thu Sep 02, 2010 10:37 am 
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skidder wrote:
Lowlane7 wrote:
Yeah, I only used small numbers for the idea, but that's also a good one, torque can change as well.
A mate bought this little book about all the graphs and equations for mechanical engineering.
And it was insane, all sorts of graphs showing torque to horspower increases and how to work all the stuff out on paper.


Don't take to heart what your mates are telling you.

You can't justify by giving a hypothetical X kw increase for each modification, when each mod ON ITS OWN might only make this difference, but when used together if properly matched would make a much bigger difference.

Example, standard engine with 4480's might hypothetically pick up X kw of peak power over the standard manifold. Get a worked engine and measure the difference between standard manifold and the 4480's and I guarantee you will pick up a lot more.


oh, there's no issue with it really,
you have another good point there too as with the other bloke sayin about only at WOT would the T/B have the most effect.
Cars are wonderful creations and the science behind them is quite mind bending somtimes.
I'd love to get that book I was saying to show you all. When your looking at a dyno style sheet bit with 4 lines from each edge of the grid it looks rediculous! Lol.

The idea was just to give a VERY basic view of my point. Like you say there would be a bigger overall gain if added together, which is highly likely given the greater overall flow.

Cheer man, good food for thought. And excellent point.

Jacob.

 

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 Post subject: Re: Improving your 6cyl E-series Throttlebody the DIY way
Posted: Thu Sep 02, 2010 11:01 am 
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FAST-XR wrote:
ToranaGuy wrote:
FAST-XR wrote:
this is what the 68mm did on my car

im thinking about getting some more made up....


I don't suppose we can ask you which lines were with what tb?

Cheers

ToranaGuy

haha, pink and orange mate, it made gains in power and torque...



Cool man, now i can see the gains. I thought it was pink & orange, but i have learn't never to assume anything.

Cheers

ToranaGuy

 

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 Post subject: Re: Improving your 6cyl E-series Throttlebody the DIY way
Posted: Thu Sep 02, 2010 6:28 pm 
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good work man....i couldnt see it making a noticable difference but eveyr kw counts! keep it up!
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 Post subject: Re: Improving your 6cyl E-series Throttlebody the DIY way
Posted: Sat Jan 07, 2012 2:39 pm 
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Hi guys, I don't want to sound like I am rubbishing your idea, not at all I admire people who give DIY a go not just buy stuff off the shelf. I just thought I'd point out that I have personally seen the results of this throttle shaft mod going back when it broke leaving the car at uncontrollable wide open throttle and have read of it happening to others.

Also when this mod was discussed on a honda forum I used to frequent a number of people put forward a very convincing argument the knife edging the throttle plate can cause bad turbulence.

I made up a jig so when I knife edged my throttle plate it was exactly the same angle on both sides, great care was taken to ensure the outer circumference of the plate was not touched at all and I still found that the idle surged a little. I did get a noticeable increase in throttle response however this could have been attributed to the fact I recalibrated the TPS at the same time.
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 Post subject: Re: Improving your 6cyl E-series Throttlebody the DIY way
Posted: Sat Jan 07, 2012 4:40 pm 
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You shouldn't have any idle surging unless the butterfly isn't sealing inside the throttle body when it's closed.

Cheers

ToranaGuy

 

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 Post subject: Re: Improving your 6cyl E-series Throttlebody the DIY way
Posted: Sat Jan 07, 2012 5:43 pm 
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I realise that, that's why I said a lot of effort was put into not altering the circumference of the plate at all. I was merely pointing out that even when extreme care is taken to do it "correctly" this modification it will not always end the way you expected. Not saying my opinion is more correct than anyone else's, just sharing my personal experience with this mod.
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 Post subject: Re: Improving your 6cyl E-series Throttlebody the DIY way
Posted: Sat Jan 07, 2012 5:56 pm 
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Fair call, and with the proper measuring devices and careful work, there shouldn't be any problem.

I wish I had the time to make a small hobby cnc machine, this is the sort of stuff it would be great for, cnc bore the TB to size & then CNC machine a new butterfly for it.

Cheers

ToranaGuy

 

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