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FORD FALCON AUXILIARY SHAFT DODGY NEED TO REPLACE 

 

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 Post subject: FORD FALCON AUXILIARY SHAFT DODGY NEED TO REPLACE
Posted: Sun Jan 29, 2023 1:36 pm 
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Ride: Ford Falcon ED Wagon

Location: Melbourne
VIC, Australia

Hi Guys
Well I have done a lot of searching and found a lot of helpful hints from this site. So hope this helps others with a similar issue as this one had me stuffed for quite a while.
Firstly its a Ford Falcon ED Auto duel fuel wagon and I only use it on my motorcycle camping weekends so I sleep in the roomy back.
First time I had an issue was coming home from a Geelong area motorbike event and it was up a reasonable hill and a back fire and then it stalled. We pulled over and tried to crank it over multiple times and it was banging and clunking something shocking. Then it just started again and we drove another 100km home with no issue. This was weird as I know now the Aux shaft teeth are worn and it jumped a tooth ( or so) again six months later and I had to get towed home. On the Geelong trip the banging and spluttering must have made the (Distributor) dizzy jump to the correct tooth!!!
So after the Geelong experience I found my dizzy was pretty worn so changed it and thought it would be OK. Pitty I did not pay much attention to the gear condition at this time. ( note I did use the original gear on the new dizzy) But no 6 month later the penny dropped when it did it again and I found the timing mark moved about 40 deg BTDC and I found some photos of dodgy shafts on this and other sites.

So my situation is a bit strange as the car will run fine when I re time it. ( the timing mark jumps around a few deg but the car idles pretty well) Both times it jump out on the road was climbing a decent hill. First time it backfired on gas second time it just died with out a backfire.
( I have wasted a lot of time looking into failed sensors, Oxygen, ICV , MAP and TPS and Clogged Exhaust etc etc. )

So if this happens you need check the timing using a timing light. You will need someone to crank the car while you adjust the timing by rotate the distributor. You can re time the car even if it wont start. If you cannot see the timing mark the dizzy has jumped too many teeth. Then its time to remove the dizzy.
To remove the Dizzy, Remove the air box, Remove the thermo fan (retro fitted in ED) Remove the throttle body, Unclip the dizzy cap and carefully put it behind the dizzy, loosen dizzy clamp bolt ( you should now be able to put you hand behind the dizzy and flip the clamp out of the way) Now lift the dizzy out.

Now you have the dizzy out you can look down into the hole and examine the gears. You can see pretty easily whether they are good or bad. Mine were pointy and worn with no flat. If yours Look like the good gear ( RHS in photo) you are on the wrong track.

So now I need to change the AUXILIARY shaft. I believe my shaft gears has worm over the years and the engine still does not burn oil so I don't have a lot to loose buy putting in a new shaft. A lot of talk about metal bits in the sump on previous post but I will take the chance and just replace the gear.

I am hoping this can be done without removing the motor or the head. I heard you just have to remove the radiator and drop the sump.
I hope to get a good shaft from the wreckers. What models have the same shaft as and ED??
Any one who has done this before in the car?? Would appreciate your comments.

Thanks for your help in previous posts.

 

 

Attachments:
File comment: Looking down into Dizzy mount hole
Aux Gear down dix=zzy shaft.jpg
Aux Gear down dix=zzy shaft.jpg [ 490.91 KiB | Viewed 114 times ]

Last edited by stanm on Mon Jan 30, 2023 6:34 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: FORD FALCON AUXILIARY SHAFT DODGY NEED TO REPLACE
Posted: Sun Jan 29, 2023 1:41 pm 
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Location: Melbourne
VIC, Australia

Photo of good and bad gear

 

 

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 Post subject: Re: FORD FALCON AUXILIARY SHAFT DODGY NEED TO REPLACE
Posted: Sun Jan 29, 2023 2:07 pm 
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Photo of bad gears

 

 

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 Post subject: Re: FORD FALCON AUXILIARY SHAFT DODGY NEED TO REPLACE
Posted: Sun Jan 29, 2023 6:25 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: FORD FALCON AUXILIARY SHAFT DODGY NEED TO REPLACE
Posted: Mon Jan 30, 2023 9:11 pm 
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Don't quote me on it but far as i know the engine best needs to come out to do Aux shaft.
Dropping the sump is not as easy it sounds. Kframe is in the way too.

 

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93 EB II Fairmon8 with 17' EL GT's / Clear indicators / H.I.Ds / Sports exhaust / Lowered 2' / K&N / XR6 ECU.
2004 BA MKI XR6T in Lightning Strike paint / K&N / XR8 bonnet / BF lights and a few tweaks.

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 Post subject: Re: FORD FALCON AUXILIARY SHAFT DODGY NEED TO REPLACE
Posted: Wed Feb 01, 2023 8:39 pm 
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Hi 93eb
Yeh i checked the sump gasket and it rock hard. Will probably break to bits and be a b...tch to clean off from under. Might be coming around to taking the engine out.
I don't use the car often so got time to ponder.

Either way I will let you know how I do it.

I am considering taking out the K frame front box brace then welding it back in.
I am pretty sure I could do this and it would look just like the original when welded back in.
if you remove / shift the alternator and air con compressor you can clearly get to the top weld with a die grinder and bottom is accessible with a grinder. Welding back in exactly the same spot.
Anyone done this and how much easier would it be??

I got no hoist so I think removing the entire K frame is harder that removing the Engine.

Cheers
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 Post subject: Re: FORD FALCON AUXILIARY SHAFT DODGY NEED TO REPLACE
Posted: Thu Feb 02, 2023 11:33 am 
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Personally i would not be cutting the KFrame.
Maybe you could undo the engine mounts and lift the engine a little to access the sump bolts easier ?
If i were in your situation that would be a job for the workshop but.

 

_________________

93 EB II Fairmon8 with 17' EL GT's / Clear indicators / H.I.Ds / Sports exhaust / Lowered 2' / K&N / XR6 ECU.
2004 BA MKI XR6T in Lightning Strike paint / K&N / XR8 bonnet / BF lights and a few tweaks.

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 Post subject: Re: FORD FALCON AUXILIARY SHAFT DODGY NEED TO REPLACE
Posted: Sun Feb 05, 2023 8:09 pm 
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Ride: Ford Falcon ED Wagon

Location: Melbourne
VIC, Australia

Hi Guys
I read my manual and it said you can get the timing cover off with out taking the sump or head off.
So i gave it a go. Basically you got to take out the radiator, move the steering pump and alternator to the side and remove the adjusting brackets. Then work the cover free and lever it out at the bottom first.

Its a bit of a bugger working the cover off slowly by levering and tapping then cleaning off the old gaskets took some time and patience.

I have the Aux shaft out and getting a replacement tomorrow, I will post some shots and more details of how its done once I get it all back together successfully with no leaks. Fingers crossed.

Cheers
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 Post subject: Re: FORD FALCON AUXILIARY SHAFT DODGY NEED TO REPLACE
Posted: Sun Mar 05, 2023 4:43 pm 
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Ride: Ford Falcon ED Wagon

Location: Melbourne
VIC, Australia

Hi
Time for an Update.
My manual is wrong you cannot get the timing cover back on without removing or dropping the sump.
Their is a small chain guide down the bottom RHS that gets knocked off when you remove the timing cover that ,I believe , is near impossible to install without dropping the sump. This small chain guide gets knocked off when you remove the timing cover if you have not removed the sump first. I found it in the sump and when I worked out where it went I knew I had to drop the sump or remove the motor.
Any way i decided to try get the sump off instead of removing the motor. Hung a block and tackle from the carport roof and after disconnecting things that would break or bend and shifting stuff the would hinder max lift I got the transmission hard up to the fire wall. Engine lifted approx 100mm. F N sum still would not fit past the box section on the front of the K frame! Others say it is doable??
Then I just dropped the sump. Fitted another Auxiliary gear and a Timing chain kit. Cleaned the old gasket and smeared a bit of silicon on it. Fingers crossed it does not leak to much. It would be a bit tricky but not impossible to put on a new gasket but it was on back order and i did not have it otherwise I might have tried.

I am interested in comments the could have made the sump come off with motor installed
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 Post subject: Re: FORD FALCON AUXILIARY SHAFT DODGY NEED TO REPLACE
Posted: Sat Sep 02, 2023 1:56 pm 
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Age: 66

Posts: 7

Joined: 29th Jan 2023

Ride: Ford Falcon ED Wagon

Location: Melbourne
VIC, Australia

Hi guys
I changed the auxiliary gear and put in a new timing chain guide kit. Did it all by jacking the engine up. Did not take the sump off or install a new gasket. Cleaned it and use sealant and it all worked Ok with our leaks. All the parts and the old Aux gear look not as bad as I thought so i was still sus the problem would come back.
And yes its did come back and I was on the Tow truck again.
So now I have at last found the problem that caused me all this problems.
I made a Distributor tester as i got a couple of spare dodgy or unknown distributors. The cheap chinese distributor parts checked out OK which seemed strange? Does the the TFI have dodgy electronics that way retard the spark - I am over thinking

Bugger me it was simple! The cheap Chinese distributed that i replace the old original Bosch with was sparking in the wrong spot as the rotor with the slots for the pickup has no locating pin like a bosch and it was loosish!!

So the conclusion was that it was a distributor issue all along. The cheap Chinese one the rotor moved and gave me a similar symptom making me think it was something sinister.

Anyway beware of loose rotor in your Chinese copy.

Cheers
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