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*Group Buy tuned length polished stainless turbo manifolds* 

 

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Posted: Sun Jan 08, 2006 6:38 pm 
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6BOOST wrote:
As far as tuned length goes, in most cases you have to build what fits. People generalise the term tuned length, when they are in fact meaning equal length runners, IE most effort is taken into getting the pipes close to equal in length to each other.

It would surprise most people how little a difference various factors make in manifold design. The biggest 3 that makes large differences are pipe diameter, collector design/enrty angles of pipes, and rough length of pipes. Having equal length runners, as in tryin to make all the runners the same length within 1-2cm, make within 2-5hp difference over 6-8" difference in length, or, 50% total length. Spool is also not effected.

The overall length of the pipes moves the powerband around. Short overall pipes, such as a log or similar move the powerband down with faster spool, longer runners make more peak hp and lose bottom end power in most circumstances. Big Diameter pipes as a lot of people use also kill off spool and midrange power, while adding very little top end. It slows gass velocit down, which makes teh collector and turbine less efficent.

Collector design is possible the most important, aqnd wher I have focused all my testing. Overall, the biggest things to look for in a manifold resonable length, not to big a pipe, and that all the pipes come together nicely with none pointing in at cross angles to the others. With these traits, most manifolds in my testing and experience are very similar. I'm sure the Snort manifolds will work fantastically, and at a great price.

6BOOST


hi

i gather u make some turbo exhausts headers for ford I6 cylinders

do u have any pics to show good examples of headers

examples of the collector the way they enter each other the individual port runner primary pipes

and what prices are ur headers worth so if there was a group buy of urs

can we have some examples of different styles of turbo headers ie log style , tuned lenght headrts , headers for internal and external waste gates setup and say a header to suit a twin scroll turbo exhasut housing setup

and what materials u use to manufavture ur headers from ???


cheers

 

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Posted: Sun Jan 08, 2006 8:05 pm 
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eng-fnm wrote:
I wish someone could do the same for the V8 windsor boys, I am sure if we could get turbo manifolds for that price, there would be some smoking Falc's out there !!!!!

I made my own but I can't get front assembly [accessariry bracket] to assemble on my old 5.0 which is on engine stand in backshed to fab up exhaust...Otherwise it would be easy.. With V8's there's heaps less clearance and it has to be spot on....I have some manifolds 3/4 finished but can't finish due to nothing on engine to check clearances....I have thought of making some realy short headers then an exhaust shop can fab the rest from flange..But its better to make them from head to turbo flange in one piece...Here's anice mustang conversion...
Pics etc
http://www.turbomustangs.com/smf/index. ... ic=54415.0
6 boost is spot on there...
You have to keep away to a point from N/A exhaust systems...The shoter the runners BUT the closest you can get them to be as close to the same length is better...On std E.B motor we found 1 1/4 to be about right.. Now it you think n/a you'd be thinking 1 1/2 to 1 5/8...Keep in mind this is under far graeter pressure than N/A and exhaust pressure is atleast 1/3 more than boost .,. Up to 3 times infact ...For street use the kis system is best...

 

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Last edited by EBXR8380 on Sun Jan 08, 2006 9:20 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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Posted: Sun Jan 08, 2006 8:15 pm 
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6BOOST wrote:
As far as tuned length goes, in most cases you have to build what fits. People generalise the term tuned length, when they are in fact meaning equal length runners, IE most effort is taken into getting the pipes close to equal in length to each other.

It would surprise most people how little a difference various factors make in manifold design. The biggest 3 that makes large differences are pipe diameter, collector design/enrty angles of pipes, and rough length of pipes. Having equal length runners, as in tryin to make all the runners the same length within 1-2cm, make within 2-5hp difference over 6-8" difference in length, or, 50% total length. Spool is also not effected.

The overall length of the pipes moves the powerband around. Short overall pipes, such as a log or similar move the powerband down with faster spool, longer runners make more peak hp and lose bottom end power in most circumstances. Big Diameter pipes as a lot of people use also kill off spool and midrange power, while adding very little top end. It slows gass velocit down, which makes teh collector and turbine less efficent.

Collector design is possible the most important, aqnd wher I have focused all my testing. Overall, the biggest things to look for in a manifold resonable length, not to big a pipe, and that all the pipes come together nicely with none pointing in at cross angles to the others. With these traits, most manifolds in my testing and experience are very similar. I'm sure the Snort manifolds will work fantastically, and at a great price.

6BOOST


hows it going.

i'm the mechanic at x-treme motorsport in townsville.

just like to let you know i was quite impressed with the manifold you sent for my bosses SR20. I just wish he would get the thing running.

 

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Posted: Sun Jan 08, 2006 9:17 pm 
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Just back from another great weekend at the Summernats :D , I'll try to answer a few questions..

Quote:
how do these compare to 6boost's manifolds?

6boost has fairly much answered that question, Thanks buddy :). You will see by the pictures when we get them, that like 6boosts manifold all the runners head in straight up direction and don’t cross each others.

Quote:
Is the manifold exactly the same for all I6 falcons from EA to AU or are they different between models? Also are there any VL manifolds and would these be considered for the group buy as well? I'm asking this on behalf of my brother?


These will suit anything from EA to AU. I'm not sure about the VL stuff, I'll catch up with Geoff during the week and find out. (There’s enough VL turbo's out there anyway, we need more boosting falcons :D )



Quote:
may be interested. will he be doing any other deals?


With no doubt the Snort guys will be happy to supply other equipment, but you will have to organize that with them (www.snortperformance.com) This will get too difficult if we start getting different deals going on with everyone, also there is no need for me to be the middle man. Lets just keep it simple.. :lol:

FPV_GTp... Jezzz so many questions. I'll try to help out abit and get more info if needed..

The whole manifold is made from stainless. I believe that collector is called a split pulse setup, cylinder 123 run in to one side of the collector and 456 into the other side, cylinders 123 and 456 and separated from each other, I'm fairly sure it will suit your scroll turbo correctly.
Once again when I get some photos it will clear this up I'm sure.

bogan393, I should have a firm date for the group buy during this week, By the time we organize this and get the manifolds made it will be a week or two after a date is set, so you should be right..

Quote:
are the stainless manifolds prone to cracking??

I haven’t heard of any stainless manifolds cracking. The one I have on my car is not showing any signs of cracking, I've only done abit over 5000k's though. I've got a friend with a stainless one on his escort for well over a year now, and his hasn’t crack..

I hope this helps.

Cheers
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Posted: Sun Jan 08, 2006 11:18 pm 
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Stainless is definately prone to cracking, and this is by no means anything to do with snorts or anyone elses work. Its also not to tell anyone to stay away from them, as look at the market and the majority are stainless. I think it must be to do with looks and sales to be honest. I am a fitter and turner by trade, and worked in fairly complex environments and on pretty cool stuff, and as such had to learn a lot about steal composition and characteristics. Stainless, due to its attributes, expands and contracts 3 times greater/further than mild steal when it gets hot/cold.

As such, in a manifod environment, it work hardens along the welds, from all the heat cycling, and also the metals don't blend as well as mild steal filler rod to mild pipe. Over its life, the expansion and contraction at much higher rates thn mild steal or cast iron mean failure at either the hottest points, such as the collector, or the areas of most load, such as where the tubes join the head plate.

I have personally built manifold for 5 separate cars to replace many name brand stainless items, including a 12 month old Trust manifold from a $12 000 T51RSPL kit for a supra. The worst are the cheap $300 SR20 high mount import ones, I've even got a jig for those so I don't need the guys to send me their manifold anymore, I've done like 7 of those.

They do however seam to work out cheaper for some reason, and if treated correctly, and built to a high standard as I've heard the Snort ones to be, should give a relatively good service life. I would personally ask that they are braced back to the head plate though to help with some load.

If anyone has specific questions about my own work, please respect this is a for sale thread for someone else and that I am only replying to help people understand what they are shopping for an what to look for, and I would not like to answer them here. Either pm me or do a search, I'm not hard to find :wink:

Good luck with the sales guys, great price.

6BOOST

 

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Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2006 5:37 pm 
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6BOOST wrote:
Stainless is definately prone to cracking, and this is by no means anything to do with snorts or anyone elses work. Its also not to tell anyone to stay away from them, as look at the market and the majority are stainless. I think it must be to do with looks and sales to be honest. I am a fitter and turner by trade, and worked in fairly complex environments and on pretty cool stuff, and as such had to learn a lot about steal composition and characteristics. Stainless, due to its attributes, expands and contracts 3 times greater/further than mild steal when it gets hot/cold.

As such, in a manifod environment, it work hardens along the welds, from all the heat cycling, and also the metals don't blend as well as mild steal filler rod to mild pipe. Over its life, the expansion and contraction at much higher rates thn mild steal or cast iron mean failure at either the hottest points, such as the collector, or the areas of most load, such as where the tubes join the head plate.

I have personally built manifold for 5 separate cars to replace many name brand stainless items, including a 12 month old Trust manifold from a $12 000 T51RSPL kit for a supra. The worst are the cheap $300 SR20 high mount import ones, I've even got a jig for those so I don't need the guys to send me their manifold anymore, I've done like 7 of those.

They do however seam to work out cheaper for some reason, and if treated correctly, and built to a high standard as I've heard the Snort ones to be, should give a relatively good service life. I would personally ask that they are braced back to the head plate though to help with some load.

If anyone has specific questions about my own work, please respect this is a for sale thread for someone else and that I am only replying to help people understand what they are shopping for an what to look for, and I would not like to answer them here. Either pm me or do a search, I'm not hard to find :wink:

Good luck with the sales guys, great price.

6BOOST


hi

i think the damgae is already done the fact that u have already posted and replyed on this thread , so no secret any more u might as well post some pics and ur prices here . this way we have choice to whether whos exhaust we buy.



cheers

 

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Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2006 11:29 pm 
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ok guys and Girls, this is not supposed to turn in to a sledging match, lets take a look at why we are here.
After quite a lot of interest from you guys, Snort performance has been happy enough to organize a group buy of manifolds and 6Boost has been very helpful with some back ground technical information. Kyle has also showing his integrity and maturity by not trying to take over this group buy or use it to promote his own business. Lets Respect both of these things.

If your not a fan of the Snort performance manifolds and would much rather a 6boost one, then this is not a group buy for you. Just keep in mind I really think you should look at the manifold before you cast judgment.
Also lets not get picky and nasty about this, both 6 boost and Snort Performance are out there to help us all out.

If it wasn’t for people like Geoff Carter from Snort Performance there would be no way I would have not been able to turbo my falcon, and would never of have the enjoyment of driving it as I do today.

At then end of the day this is going to be an incredible manifold and an even better price and a great way to start you boosted falcon project.


Right enough of that stuff. :D
I’ve just found out that the All fords day in Albury is coming up at the end of the month. This should be another great event. Given that Albury is really my home town I think that my EF should really be making an appearance :P . For any of you guys that are going to make the trip up/down to Albury I will be more then happy show you the quality of the Snort equipment, and help with an questions/queries about getting your Falcon boosted.
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Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2006 11:33 pm 
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I have found that alot of guys are facinated with tubular turbo headers, which are great on high powered cars making 600+RWHP but the following issues are often neglected.
1. A majority will probably never make enough power to take advantage of a tubular turbo header
2. You will not get a high mount turbo with a tubular header easily engineered or passed by the pitts cause there are issues with way too much heat being put into a crucial part of the car, namely the brake master cylinder.
3. A high mount turbo will end up cooking the paint on your bonnet
4. A tubular header will slow turbo spooling. Not something you want on an auto turbo with standard stall.

These are issues to think about.

IMO a mild steel turbo header is better. I agree with 6Boost. You would think that stainless is better but a good steam pipe turbo header will last a very very long time with out cracking or deterioration provided you DONT heat wrap it. My turbotrana steam pipe manifold is about 8 years old and still as good as the day it was put on. Its a log manifold and can easily pull 500rwhp at 23psi.

 

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Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2006 8:28 am 
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LOL


ok guys , im just still interested in pictures of the two manifolds from two different suppliers


i must of missed the piont LOL !!!!!!

or have i pollute this threads real goal LOL !!!!!

cheers

 

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Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2006 8:41 am 
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Here is my 6BOOST manifold, sorry about all the crap in the pic but its the only one i have online.

The real stuff to see is inside the manifold, everything merges together perfectly. Ill try and get some photos of that tonight.

Another thing to note is that my manifold has been made thinner for clearance issues so its not typical of his work. This is all going into an LC torana with an RB30.

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Posted: Wed Jan 11, 2006 5:39 am 
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gday all , ok its been brought to my attention the direction in regards to this thread and thought it was time to put some truth behind the ( scare tactics ) being raged here on this forum

first of all , lets discuss the rummers regarding stainless steel manifolds and there so called tendances to crack!!!!! lets put these in prospective, if you compare a turbo manifold made from stainless steel ( tube ) and another made in mild steel tube of the same wall thickness you will find the mild steel manifold will crack and deteriate quicker than the stainless steel variant!!!!

the same can be said if you are to build the same style manifold from stainless steel ( forged steam pipe ) and again another in mild steel steam pipe you will find the stainless steel will outlast the mild steel version

with that said it should also be obvious why top name brand systems and to the reason why most of the market is made of stainless steel some are made more for looks than durability

again to compare tube/ versus pipe in construction is like comparing apples to oranges , our new manifolds are made from high grade ( forged stainless steampipe ) construction , merge collector , twin pulse, also fitted with multifit turbo flange ( will suit any turbo from small t3 to large European style t4 up to gt45 direct fit ) , 12mm stainless steel head plate, pulse tig welded , and they are polished , guaranteed never to crack!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

soon also to be released in titanium coating ( gold ) never fade, or discolour

we have continued to develop our systems to suit falcons for 4 years now, we also started out making our manifolds from mild steel steampipe like 6boost although natural progression has seen our manifolds evolve to the quality we supply now

we pride our manifolds on not only being able to support huge hp with awesome flow characteristics but look sensational and great value for money has always been out inspiration

6boost we welcome the competition , as do all here on ford mods, although to enter into this thread and the direction in which you have tried to take it is a little concerning, although talk is cheap we will let all here on fordmods make there own decision on which manifolds are the better option as i am sure many will have there own opinion

we will supply pictures of our new manifold in the next week here on ford mods , our current systems/manifolds can be seen via our website for comparison
this special group price is only available for fordmod members for a limited time please forward your questions via our email or phone message service geoff carter www.snortperformance.com
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Posted: Wed Jan 11, 2006 9:26 am 
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ok

nicely put bond007

i will wait for some pics

cheers

 

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Posted: Wed Jan 11, 2006 9:34 pm 
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I'll stay with steam pipe and ceramic coating thanks...Cooler under bonnet temps...
At the end of day it doesn't matter..They all bloody work!!! A 4.0 is never going to be formula 1 engine...These manifolds imo are over engineered !!!! For transmission, suspension and brakes thats possibly in same vehicle...

 

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 Post subject: Re: *Group Buy tuned length polished stainless turbo manifol
Posted: Wed Jan 11, 2006 11:52 pm 
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hi

spoke to tjb45 and have his ok to add to this thread

again its a group buy where we all save money and if ur planning on turbo charging ur next project here is a chance to save more money


the link is http://www.fordmods.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=19004

and reads as follows

'have a group buy of NEW intercoolers happening in several ford forums
valid for members in this forum and others to mininize the cost to make a
large group purchase where we all make a large savings

so if ur planning on turbo charging you car here is the chance to save a few dollars

PM me if ur interested need 10 people to make the buy happen at these prices

Hybrid style intercoolers are available seperately or as a group buy but need the numbers

group buy need a 10 guys to make it worth while

these units are NEW

intercooler size 600x300x100mm coolers are $215 for 5 and $205 for 10

intercooler size 600x300x76mm $145 at a time for the 5, and $140 each for 10.

frieght and package extra charge "

cheers

 

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Posted: Thu Jan 12, 2006 2:06 am 
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Bond007, please explain your comments "to enter into this thread and the direction in which you have tried to take it is a little concerning" mate.

I have respected your product, clearly stating that your workmanship is great, and the price outstanding, I have not posted pics or pricing, nor entered the thread to do so, I offered answers to some questions peopel had, mainly to give them a clearer picture of benifits and drawbacks of varoius aspects, if you have a problem with any of these things then I apologise.

I can't come colse to offering the same price you have for these manifolds, by 100's of $$, and have no interest in being your competition, if you have taken anything to offence, then I apologise, and will refrain from further posting, despite my various opnions of things that have been said. Good luck with the sales guys, and I do mean that, for what is a very high quality made manifold, the price is rediculous.

I will say though to turbotrana that engineering a log versus tuned length manifolding has no influence, and that a log manifold will be just as bad if not worse, as the turbine housing still points straight at the master cylinder, besides which my falcon was running for 2 years with it right next to my T66 and 4" dump, and the plastic never even aged.

WIth adequate bonnet clearance, paint on the bonnet should be no problem, if it is, a $150 turbine bag would fix the problem, and in most cases a WELL DESIGNED tubular manifold will outspool and out HP a log manifold. This is not to say all cases, but like I said, well designed ones such as these offered should. Regardless of hp, be it 300 or 600, if you can have 5-10hp more at low hp levels for little extra cost, doesn't every hp count??

In sayng that, I'm not having a dig, I just don't wouldn't want people to make a decision based on 1 perspective and not another.

Cheers.............................Kyle.

 

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