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Removing LPG balance line? 

 

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 Post subject: Removing LPG balance line?
Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 12:17 pm 
Parts Gopher
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Hey guys the other day I picked up an acron plastics CAI box with piping and filter really cheaply so I thought i'd give it another go. Last time I Tried it I had issues with using more gas which i'm guessing was due to the increased airflow and not enough restriction.

This time though the pipe system is a little different so I thought i'd give it a go and see what happens.

Attachment:
Intake.jpg


What I was wondering though is what to do about the balance line?

The snorkel with the balance line is still on the car but isn't actually connected to the side of the airbox.
When I had it fitted a few months ago the guy told me he just had to adjust something on the converter and I am just wondering if anyone knows what that was so I can try and adjust it back to the way it was and remove the snorkel.

Or am I better off cutting a hole in the side of the airbox and finding a way to attach the snorkel to the airbox to get more airflow?

If this doesn't work out and I still find I use more fuel it's not a huge deal I'll just fit the factory system back on.
I'm not expecting huge fuel savings either.

Attachment:
Snorkel.jpg


As you can see, the snorkel isn't doing anything so I think perhaps there's more pressure coming in through the balance line than through the intake?

Attachment:
Snorkel inlet.jpg


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Last edited by Aussierox on Wed Feb 27, 2013 5:12 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Removing LPG ballance line?
Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 12:45 pm 
Getting Side Ways
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Balance line there makes sure that the converter responds to additional air pressure in the inlet (so it adds a little gas).

Youd want to have it there still, on the fresh air side of the "box" (or the open side, not after the pod).

And because the whole induction system is changed, yes, it will probably need a quick re-tune
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 Post subject: Re: Removing LPG balance line?
Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 5:04 pm 
Parts Gopher
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Nigel wrote:
Balance line there makes sure that the converter responds to additional air pressure in the inlet (so it adds a little gas).

Youd want to have it there still, on the fresh air side of the "box" (or the open side, not after the pod).

And because the whole induction system is changed, yes, it will probably need a quick re-tune


The place I had my gas installed removed the snorkel and told me that you can't have cold air intakes (reffering to the snorkel) on gas or it'll stall so clearly didn't know about ballance lines.

So I went to a different place and had a snorkel fitted but now that snorkel is doing nothing but the balance line is fitted to the snorkel and I was wondering if this was creating too much air pressure on the balance line side and throwing the converter off? i'll upload a photo above.
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 Post subject: Re: Removing LPG balance line?
Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 6:18 pm 
Getting Side Ways
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OK. Remove the snorkel.
The Balance Line has to be connected to the same air as the airbox - and that only works when the snorkel is connected to the airbox. The balance line basically senses the pressure increase that a snorkel or other source adds, and increases the vapour pressure to match.

You probably need to keep the balance line because your going to get pressure air from behind the headlights. You could try just tucking the hose end into the cavity that the pod filter is in so its getting the same air pressure as the pod.

You may not need it. Either way your 90% likely to need a retune. LPG is affected by everything - including that it is reliant on the pressure drop across the mixer to draw the LPG. Changing filter (even to a K+N in the std box) changes the pressure drop, and changes the mix.

Nigel
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 Post subject: Re: Removing LPG balance line?
Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 8:24 pm 
Parts Gopher
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Nigel wrote:
OK. Remove the snorkel.
The Balance Line has to be connected to the same air as the airbox - and that only works when the snorkel is connected to the airbox. The balance line basically senses the pressure increase that a snorkel or other source adds, and increases the vapour pressure to match.

You probably need to keep the balance line because your going to get pressure air from behind the headlights. You could try just tucking the hose end into the cavity that the pod filter is in so its getting the same air pressure as the pod.

You may not need it. Either way your 90% likely to need a retune. LPG is affected by everything - including that it is reliant on the pressure drop across the mixer to draw the LPG. Changing filter (even to a K+N in the std box) changes the pressure drop, and changes the mix.

Nigel



Thanks for the info mate :)

I'll try getting some more hose (needs to be longer) and fitting the line in the airbox otherwise if I was to try and remove it, what setting needs to be adjusted on the converter?

As for the retune I'll wait till I have my 4499's/hi flow cat fitted in a few weeks and have one tune done for the lot.
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 Post subject: Re: Removing LPG balance line?
Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 9:03 pm 
Getting Side Ways
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be carefull - LPG either too rich, or too lean is not good for your engine if your driving it hard

Nigel
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 Post subject: Re: Removing LPG balance line?
Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 9:31 pm 
Parts Gopher
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Nigel wrote:
be carefull - LPG either too rich, or too lean is not good for your engine if your driving it hard

Nigel



I tend to switch to petrol if I want to drive hard since I Know it's better for the engine, I drive on economy mode and stay under 2500 revs when driving on lpg most of the time.
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 Post subject: Re: Removing LPG balance line?
Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 9:35 pm 
Getting Side Ways
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See thats not the right answer either.

I have had mixer ring systems which moved, impco, as well as LPG Injection. LPG isnt slow if set up right and most of my cars have ended up single-fuel.

If you have for example an airod variable mixer set up correctly it will give you 200kw - performance at the right price.

Injected LPG is even better, again once the programming and jetting is right.

Nigel
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 Post subject: Re: Removing LPG balance line?
Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 9:38 pm 
Parts Gopher
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Age: 25

Posts: 65

Joined: 29th Jan 2012

Ride: 1997 Falcon EL Fairmont Wagon

Location: Melbourne
VIC, Australia

Nigel wrote:
See thats not the right answer either.

I have had mixer ring systems which moved, impco, as well as LPG Injection. LPG isnt slow if set up right and most of my cars have ended up single-fuel.

If you have for example an airod variable mixer set up correctly it will give you 200kw - performance at the right price.

Injected LPG is even better, again once the programming and jetting is right.

Nigel



I've been reading about those $600 LPI kits that you install yourself while a lot of work, would still save a lot of money but i'm not sure on the reliability of a $600 ebay kit.

I don't really want to spend several thousand to go lpi as much fun as it would be, I only plan to keep this car till I get off my p's in 3 years time.
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